Liverpool FC Forum

[Reg]

Question:

Would Arsenal change their team or play a more defensive formation if we played Crouch alongside Torres in a 4-4-2?

If they would then we should play him. If we play the 4-5-1 formation which means they can man-mark Torres and free up an extra midfielder to push forward then this would only work against us.

If you had 4-4 but with Stevie playing central and attacking then Crouch and yer boy Torres up front, wouldnt this mean the Arsenal would have to hold a man deeper to cover the risk?

Makes sense to me. What say the experts?

[Alonso14]

I say whatever formation we put out, we go out a bombard them for the first 25mins and see if we can get our goal, just like when Juve came to town in the 1st Leg in 2005.

I like bigmick fear that if they score first, they will not need to hold a high line and stifle our attack. I don't believe we have the guile to cut them open if we have the majority of the possesion.

[Owzat]

I think there are a few problems, regardless who starts. If they score (first) then we've not scored more than one against them in any of the three games this season. Do we stick to our plan and formation or try and change it via a formation change/substitution? If we score (first) will we sit back as is our wont? We tend to be their equal first half and at times over-run in the second half. No matter what I think we need to score first half, preferably twice. And we must sort out the defending from set-pieces. It's hard enough to beat teams like Arsenal, Man Utd and Chelsea without gifting them goals. If he must play zonal then why not instruct the CBs to mark their two main goal threats/strikers, and the rest can defend zonally. Saying that I do feel our side on Saturday was a little lightweight in the air, not exactly filled with great headers of the ball.

[fivecups]

Question:

Would Arsenal change their team or play a more defensive formation if we played Crouch alongside Torres in a 4-4-2?

If they would then we should play him. If we play the 4-5-1 formation which means they can man-mark Torres and free up an extra midfielder to push forward then this would only work against us.

If you had 4-4 but with Stevie playing central and attacking then Crouch and yer boy Torres up front, wouldnt this mean the Arsenal would have to hold a man deeper to cover the risk?

Makes sense to me. What say the experts?

Definitely should be and will be a 4-5-1 (or strictly a 4-4-1-1, or a 4-2-3-1 when attacking). Mascherano and Alonso are our two best holding midfielders, great tacklers who work well together - they are essential to snuff out Arsenal's midfield threat. If Finnan's fully fit, I think Carra and Skyrtel (who's been superb recently) should make up central defence. Kuyts understanding with Stevie and Torres has grown in the last few months and he'll track back all night so I think he'll start on the right and Rafa's likely to go with Babel for his speed on the break on the left, although I think he's been fairly poor of late. That leaves no room for Crouch but I think theres no way Rafa would change a recent winning formation especiallly when we dont need to score.

I think a 4-5-1 with Arsenal needing to score will give Torres a few chances even if he's man marked - especially if we break quickly with Stevie and him linking up.

As Rafa says, I don't know how you play for 0-0, but I think we should definitely set up with the aim of not conceding. When we're in possession everyone push up and I think we'll score at least once.

I'm confident about this one.

[JoeTerp]

drop Babel for Riise. Yes Babel has pace but he offers little in the attack against good teams. He may go one a threatening looking run or two, but in the end, we know and they will know it wont lead to anything. At least Riise can shore up the defense on the left if Aurelio or Arbeloa play LB.

I would also consider dropping Kuyt for Crouch. This would put Gerrard on the right, which will put a lot more fear in Clichy, and he might think twice or three times before joining in on attacks, and he offers just as much if not more in defense when compared to Kuyt. We all compliment Kuyt on his workrate, but I can't see Stevie putting in a lazy performance tomorrow night. If we are going to hoof balls up from the back everytime we break them down, I would rather to at least have the chance of it looking dangerous with Crouch playing the 2nd balls on to Torres. We are at home, we need to take it to them while being prepared to deal with whatever they throw at us

[Reg]

Which as you confirm means Clichy would have to hang back to cover Gerrard and possibly someone else hang back to cover Crouchie.

Backing them into a corner would be the best way of pinning them into their own half imho.

If they flood forward then its going to be a bunfight which is mighty dangerous.

[fivecups]

drop Babel for Riise. Yes Babel has pace but he offers little in the attack against good teams. He may go one a threatening looking run or two, but in the end, we know and they will know it wont lead to anything. At least Riise can shore up the defense on the left if Aurelio or Arbeloa play LB.

I would also consider dropping Kuyt for Crouch. This would put Gerrard on the right, which will put a lot more fear in Clichy, and he might think twice or three times before joining in on attacks, and he offers just as much if not more in defense when compared to Kuyt. We all compliment Kuyt on his workrate, but I can't see Stevie putting in a lazy performance tomorrow night. If we are going to hoof balls up from the back everytime we break them down, I would rather to at least have the chance of it looking dangerous with Crouch playing the 2nd balls on to Torres. We are at home, we need to take it to them while being prepared to deal with whatever they throw at us

I agree that Gerard would offer as much as Kuyt in defence on the right but I don't think that Crouch will offer as much in defence as Stevie would if he played in the centre behind Torres. I think playing without a fifth midfielder would give Arsenal too much room in the centre of midfield to build attacks. If and when they push forward theres a risk the strikers could become isolated only seeing action from hopeful long balls.

I think Arsenals defense are going to watch Gerard on the break as carefully as they would watch Crouch.

4-5-1 for me.

[bigmick]

I think he'll play the same team which started the first leg at the Emirates as I've already said earlier in the thread. I don't honestly think there's any chance of Crouch starting (although of course with Rafa you never know) and think if I was going to go for a Rafaism, a little surprising selection that might just make everybody sit up with shock, I'd look elsewhere. I don't think he'll do it, but I've a hunch he'll consider dropping alonso and playign Lucas. There, I'll go and put my hard hat on.

[RedBlood]

aww im well up 4 this game i cant wait hmm predictions...lets see

2-0

torres & babel

[Reg]

After the way you lads were cursing Babel for not showing any inclination to compete for balls,why would Rafa pick him again in the key game of the season so far?

[NANNY RED]

I think he'll play the same team which started the first leg at the Emirates as I've already said earlier in the thread. I don't honestly think there's any chance of Crouch starting (although of course with Rafa you never know) and think if I was going to go for a Rafaism, a little surprising selection that might just make everybody sit up with shock, I'd look elsewhere. I don't think he'll do it, but I've a hunch he'll consider dropping alonso and playign Lucas. There, I'll go and put my hard hat on.

I agree with you Mick He played well on Sat (Lucas) and even though im a big fan of Xabi id start with Masher and Lucas tomorrow.

[bigmick]

I think he'll play the same team which started the first leg at the Emirates as I've already said earlier in the thread. I don't honestly think there's any chance of Crouch starting (although of course with Rafa you never know) and think if I was going to go for a Rafaism, a little surprising selection that might just make everybody sit up with shock, I'd look elsewhere. I don't think he'll do it, but I've a hunch he'll consider dropping alonso and playign Lucas. There, I'll go and put my hard hat on.

I agree with you Mick He played well on Sat (Lucas) and even though im a big fan of Xabi id start with Masher and Lucas tomorrow.

Yeah I've just got this feeling that if both of our midfielders sit in, we're going to get put under seige by Arsenal. One of them has to be prepared to move out of the comfort zone and give us an out ball, and Xabi has shown extreme reluctance to do it lately. He is some way his imperious best right now, it'd be a brave call to leave him out but I wouldn't be surprised to see it.

All that said I don't think Rafa will do it, and if he does play I just hope Xabi doesn't spend all night being close enough to hold hands with Masherano.

[LFC2007]

I think Alonso will play because, a) He's more experienced than Lucas (and still is a fantastic player despite form of late), b) He was rested for the league game and c) He was at the press conference with Rafa and he looked like he meant business.

[ruskiy playmaker]

Whoever plays at CB, RB or LB, I couldn't care less. What I do care about is whether - and hopefully, WHEN ! - Rafa sorts out this marking to defend from set pieces. I don't know how many games of late I've seen where the opposition has sauntered into the box and been given a free header on goal. And worst case, they score from them.
Bendtner, Toure, Adebayor etc. seem to latch onto crosses for fun and we can't deal with it.
I was watching Premiership highlights at the weekend and Ronnie Whelan has been saying the same thing for weeks on end: when is Rafa going to ditch this zonal marking cack and counter properly ?
I can't help but think that if Arsenal get one or two chances to swing in a half-decent cross into the box, it's gonna cause us major grief and we plainly are not dealing with them the right way.

That's what I'm worried about too.  I remember on Saturday I was so at Pennant for giving away that freekick because I knew that they could quiet easily score from it and they did.  I just hope that we have a 100% concentration tomorrow, because I am pretty sure that Arsenal will really try to exploit this weakness.

[Kharhaz]

Im not worried at about tonights game. We have played arsenal twice at there stadium the second match with a weaker team (which we could easily have won on another day !) and they are tiring, they look tired. We have walked away with an away goal and a point. The only possible downer for tomorrow is if the players are for it. If they are up for it, its in the bag !