Liverpool FC Forum

stmichael wrote:Here's a stat for you.

Our CM duo that started the game have scored 1 goal between them in their professional careers.

That my friends, sums it up.

Ladeulcateg wrote:

Emerald Red wrote:

Ladeulcateg wrote:Class players show there class at there young age. I'm sick of hearing it how someone will become something they aren't. It never happens. If Baros learns to look up he'll be class... he never has. If Steven Gerrard learns to dicate a game like Keane and Vieira he'll be immense, he never has, if Djimi Traore just learns to position himself better he'll be class.... he never did. If Sissoko just learns to pass he'll be world class... he's the new Vieira you know...

Some of what you say there is valid, but the point you're making is wrong.

World class players don't normally start out that great. In fact, it's the legendary players that started out as class and started to fade out when their career's and talent were meant to peak - Maradona, Best, Romario, Ronaldo etc etc. Depends on the possition and who's playing around them, really.

Zidane started out good, with potential, as did Henry and Ronaldinho. But they gradually became better and better as years went on. Look at Zidane in that last world cup for evidence of this. Roy Keane and Viera weren't even regarded as world class players until their mid-twenties.

It's simple: if a player wants to learn and improve, he will. He just needs to be in the right environment to grow.

Right. Am sorry but again you're prattling.

Players have attributes. They don't gain them. Or all of a sudden become good at something they weren't.

I remember having this debate a while ago. Someone saying to me Gerrard couldn't strike a ball a when he first came through because he scored something like 3 in his first 40 or something. I remember watching him for the ressies scoring 30 yard piledrivers and smashing shots like he did against United a few years back nearly every week, passing diagnol balls an diving into tackles.

Players have the attributes, the only thing is they learn how to use them properly, and consistently over the 90 minutes. They generally stop improving the quality of there attributes around 18-21 (very rare they still improve after 21 if at all) and usually they are very very good to start off with. Mental attributes can increase with age as happened with Carragher and Keane, but both were already very good in this department. With Carragher and Keane it pushed them upto the next level. For Carragher a quality player and Keane a world class one.

I remember seeing Zidane for Bordeaux when he was about 22. You could see it a mile off, he wasn't consistent throughout the 90 minutes but you could still see his class.

You mention Vieira? Come off it lad... he was immense when he broke through for Arsenal. His passing, movement, tackling, aggression, it was all there from day one. Ask the Arsenal fans, from the moment they saw him they knew they had a player. Just as we did with Robbie, Michael, Steven in the people who have a clue's case Jamie.