Liverpool FC Forum

[JC_81]

He's only made three quality signings. Fowler, Alonso and Reina.

Rafa's been here for 6 transfer windows. Why do we still have Riise, Hyypia, Carragher, Finnan, Gerrard and Kewell as part of our best first 11. They aren't his players. He's had the money and the options to strengthen. He's simply gone about it the wrong way and signed the wrong players..

So are you actually trying to say that Carra and Gerrard should have been replaced by Benitez simply because they were at the club already and that Benitez's team should be made up purely of players that only he has bought??

I think it's you that's living in a dreamworld mate

No I'm not saying they should have been replaced. What I am saying is that seven players who played under Houllier are still in the best starting 11 we can put out on the pitch. 8 if you want to include Fowler (although a Benitez signing).

My point is clear. He hasn't greatly improved the personel which is the exact reason we are where we are. The players we have aren't upto it. We are as i said 5-6 top class players away from being a great side. Maybe on 4 class players we can scrape the league.

He's improved the personnel massively, don't be daft.

Instead of having Diao, Cheyrou or Le Tallec as an option from the bench, we have players like Masherano, Pennant and Crouch.  The squad is far better overall.  Let's not also forget he turned Carra's career around by converting him from a decent full back into a top class centre half.

There's no way we need  to buy 4 or 5 world class players to win the league.  One striker and a winger who can open teams up is all we need.  If we're being really greedy then 2 wingers and a striker.

[76-1174245250]

To add to that. Alves is a right back. Not a winger.

We absoloutely NEED without question a centre half

You've obviously never watched Alves play.  He's a winger played at full back.

And why the fook do we absolutely need without question a centre half?  We've had the tightest defence in the premiership this year and I'd certainly not be wasting our budget on that area when it's absolutely without question obvious that our problem is scoring goals not conceding them.

John, ya don't even know who ya talking to lad. Don't sit there and tell me I don't know what am talkin about. Am bored of it. I hear it time again, as with Baros, Carragher, Sissoko, Morientes, Finnan, blah blah blah.

As for Alves, he's a right back. An attacking right back who loves a tackle. You don't play players out of position to disguise weaknesses. Alves is probably the best right back in the world.

As a centre half, you think Agger's good enough mate then am sorry but you're deluded. Agger is a good player, but he's certainly not and never will be (just as Sissoko will never be) top class. We've had this arguement a million times. He's not dominant enough in the air and he's lazy with his clearances. He's also not physically strong enough. He isn't the quickest either. Jon Woodgate is available this summer and will go for around £6m. I firmly believe he's the one.

Alves, Woodgate and Ashton would be choice of signings. Woodgate and Ashton would probably cost around the £16m mark. Also, if we were to sell Crouch or Kuyt we would regain some of the money spent. We would still desperately NEED another first choice striker and a left winger aswell.

Woodgate and Ashton are a must. Alves is a dream.

That would still leave us short of a top top striker and a qinger who's as good as a fit Kewell who can actually play a game.

[Sabre]

As a centre half, you think Agger's good enough mate then am sorry but you're deluded. Agger is a good player, but he's certainly not and never will be (just as Sissoko will never be) top class. We've had this arguement a million times. He's not dominant enough in the air and he's lazy with his clearances. He's also not physically strong enough. He isn't the quickest either. Jon Woodgate is available this summer and will go for around £6m. I firmly believe he's the one

I don't know who I'm talking at, but it doesn't matter, even if you were absolutely new and unknown your points would be discussed anyway.

Agger is extremely young and playing regularly for a top club as a CB, which is something I'm not used to see. He runs with the ball well and knows taking the ball out of the defence controlled well, he's good in anticipation and has good tackling, I see a very promising player on this lad. Not to mention some defenders start to be worried when he lurks the area and nobody challenges him because he sometimes make very good efforts from range. I think he'll be our centre back many years. Perhaps I'm biased because I only watch LFC games in the EPL and the centre backs I see in Spain are shíte as of late. But I think he's a great player, and will improve a lot this years.

Alves is a right back as far as I could see in the 3 games I've seen him live, and the 10 or 12 games in the tv. In min 78 the bást still was making a lot of harm going to attack, so I guess that if you gave him the full wing for him he could do ok without drawning. He's the only player that stopped Gonzalez by pace last year, and his tackling is aggresive and nice. Great RB, don't know if the best of the world, but I'm sure he's the best of the Spanish liga.

Wether we need 2 or 5 top players can be discussed, but if I may suggest this kind of debates are too biased by emotions after dissapointing results. Wednesdays and Thursdays are better days to discuss this.

[JC_81]

To add to that. Alves is a right back. Not a winger.

We absoloutely NEED without question a centre half

You've obviously never watched Alves play.  He's a winger played at full back.

And why the fook do we absolutely need without question a centre half?  We've had the tightest defence in the premiership this year and I'd certainly not be wasting our budget on that area when it's absolutely without question obvious that our problem is scoring goals not conceding them.

John, ya don't even know who ya talking to lad. Don't sit there and tell me I don't know what am talkin about. Am bored of it. I hear it time again, as with Baros, Carragher, Sissoko, Morientes, Finnan, blah blah blah.

As for Alves, he's a right back. An attacking right back who loves a tackle. You don't play players out of position to disguise weaknesses. Alves is probably the best right back in the world.

As a centre half, you think Agger's good enough mate then am sorry but you're deluded. Agger is a good player, but he's certainly not and never will be (just as Sissoko will never be) top class. We've had this arguement a million times. He's not dominant enough in the air and he's lazy with his clearances. He's also not physically strong enough. He isn't the quickest either. Jon Woodgate is available this summer and will go for around £6m. I firmly believe he's the one.

Alves, Woodgate and Ashton would be choice of signings. Woodgate and Ashton would probably cost around the £16m mark. Also, if we were to sell Crouch or Kuyt we would regain some of the money spent. We would still desperately NEED another first choice striker and a left winger aswell.

Woodgate and Ashton are a must. Alves is a dream.

That would still leave us short of a top top striker and a qinger who's as good as a fit Kewell who can actually play a game.

This Stu by any chance?

Mate, there's no way in hell I'd sign Woodgate for 6 million.  He's Redknapp, Kewell and Anderton rolled into one in terms of injuries.  Too much of a risk even at 6 million.  Unless he was on a free or on loan I wouldn't consider it.

Ashton's quality but too slow to play alongside Kuyt.  I'd also want to see what he's like after that injury first, it was a pretty bad one.

There's also no way I'd play Alves at right back.  He's weak defensively, but his crosses are class, he can go by a man and he's a goal threat.  He's a winger.  He's some bloody player.

I think you're a bit harsh on Agger and Sissoko.  I think Agger's quality, although we're slightly weak in the air when he and Carra play together.  Despite that they've kept a hell of a lot of clean sheets though.  Sissoko seems to be everyone's favourite player to knock recently, but he's still well worth his place in the squad imo.

[76-1174245250]

As a centre half, you think Agger's good enough mate then am sorry but you're deluded. Agger is a good player, but he's certainly not and never will be (just as Sissoko will never be) top class. We've had this arguement a million times. He's not dominant enough in the air and he's lazy with his clearances. He's also not physically strong enough. He isn't the quickest either. Jon Woodgate is available this summer and will go for around £6m. I firmly believe he's the one

I don't know who I'm talking at, but it doesn't matter, even if you were absolutely new and unknown your points would be discussed anyway.

Agger is extremely young and playing regularly for a top club as a CB, which is something I'm not used to see. He runs with the ball well and knows taking the ball out of the defence controlled well, he's good in anticipation and has good tackling, I see a very promising player on this lad. Not to mention some defenders start to be worried when he lurks the area and nobody challenges him because he sometimes make very good efforts from range. I think he'll be our centre back many years. Perhaps I'm biased because I only watch LFC games in the EPL and the centre backs I see in Spain are shíte as of late. But I think he's a great player, and will improve a lot this years.

Alves is a right back as far as I could see in the 3 games I've seen him live, and the 10 or 12 games in the tv. In min 78 the bást still was making a lot of harm going to attack, so I guess that if you gave him the full wing for him he could do ok without drawning. He's the only player that stopped Gonzalez by pace last year, and his tackling is aggresive and nice. Great RB, don't know if the best of the world, but I'm sure he's the best of the Spanish liga.

Wether we need 2 or 5 top players can be discussed, but if I may suggest this kind of debates are too biased by emotions after dissapointing results. Wednesdays and Thursdays are better days to discuss this.

Agger is young. So was Djimi Traore. Agger is lazy with clearances. He doesn't attack the ball in the air at all and is indecisive when the ball is in the air. He lacks leadership (something which MIGHT improve with age). He is also very sloppy with his passing. This myth about him being excellent at it is annoying. Yes he's got skill, yes he can carry ball forward but his choice and weight of pass leave alot to be desired.

[Sabre]

Poor passing election is something which we have seen in every one of our centre backs this season. And if I had to blame someone on this more, it would be Hyypia. But our defensive record is very good and it's unfair to ask for urgent replacement for this player.

I've seen mistakes in pass choosing and decissions in Agger of course, but his skill passing is good IMHO, that decission aspect of his game is something he'll also improve with age.

I'll come back later. I've seen some highlights, but now I'll start watching the whole game quietly. According to some of you I might get asleep, hope not.

[76-1174245250]

To add to that. Alves is a right back. Not a winger.

We absoloutely NEED without question a centre half

You've obviously never watched Alves play.  He's a winger played at full back.

And why the fook do we absolutely need without question a centre half?  We've had the tightest defence in the premiership this year and I'd certainly not be wasting our budget on that area when it's absolutely without question obvious that our problem is scoring goals not conceding them.

John, ya don't even know who ya talking to lad. Don't sit there and tell me I don't know what am talkin about. Am bored of it. I hear it time again, as with Baros, Carragher, Sissoko, Morientes, Finnan, blah blah blah.

As for Alves, he's a right back. An attacking right back who loves a tackle. You don't play players out of position to disguise weaknesses. Alves is probably the best right back in the world.

As a centre half, you think Agger's good enough mate then am sorry but you're deluded. Agger is a good player, but he's certainly not and never will be (just as Sissoko will never be) top class. We've had this arguement a million times. He's not dominant enough in the air and he's lazy with his clearances. He's also not physically strong enough. He isn't the quickest either. Jon Woodgate is available this summer and will go for around £6m. I firmly believe he's the one.

Alves, Woodgate and Ashton would be choice of signings. Woodgate and Ashton would probably cost around the £16m mark. Also, if we were to sell Crouch or Kuyt we would regain some of the money spent. We would still desperately NEED another first choice striker and a left winger aswell.

Woodgate and Ashton are a must. Alves is a dream.

That would still leave us short of a top top striker and a qinger who's as good as a fit Kewell who can actually play a game.

This Stu by any chance?

Mate, there's no way in hell I'd sign Woodgate for 6 million.  He's Redknapp, Kewell and Anderton rolled into one in terms of injuries.  Too much of a risk even at 6 million.  Unless he was on a free or on loan I wouldn't consider it.

Ashton's quality but too slow to play alongside Kuyt.  I'd also want to see what he's like after that injury first, it was a pretty bad one.

There's also no way I'd play Alves at right back.  He's weak defensively, but his crosses are class, he can go by a man and he's a goal threat.  He's a winger.  He's some bloody player.

I think you're a bit harsh on Agger and Sissoko.  I think Agger's quality, although we're slightly weak in the air when he and Carra play together.  Despite that they've kept a hell of a lot of clean sheets though.  Sissoko seems to be everyone's favourite player to knock recently, but he's still well worth his place in the squad imo.

Woodgate has played alot of games this season on a reduced training schedule. Thats clearly the way to go and its a gamble I'd be more than willing to take. The lads a class act and the only centre half in the league who's better or even close to him is Ferdinand.

Ashton is quality. I'm not even getting into that again. But I have to laugh at your suggestion of playing alongside Kuyt. I'm sorry but I'd rather Bellamy than Kuyt. I'd rather Fowler than both if I'm honest, but the narrow minded and the media followers still don't understand the game.

Fowler still attacks the ball and will still score goals. Its absoloutely no coincidence whatsoever that Fowler nearly scored today from a Pennant cross. Pennant swings in some fantastic crosses and the only player in the squad who's sown an interest in them all season is Fowler and it was the same again today. Pennant hasn't done what I expected and has only shown in fits and starts what he's capable of, he's not as good in his own half as I thought he was and he's not a top player but he's certainly not a bad one.

I'm quite annoyed with Benitez proposed style for the team if i'm honest. I thought last season was how he wanted us to play. Obviously it wasn't.

Fowler is still our best striker and has sat on the bench all season. Pennant... a winger... was signed to play with Bellamy and Kuyt who are two players who can neither head a ball or attack a near post... whats the point? Had Fowler played this season he'd be on at least 15 goals by now. Absoloute minimum and he'd probably have a hell of alot of assists aswell as he sees the game and keeps the ball moving and is the only forward who consistently plays quick one two's.

Kuyt's first touch is also rediculously heavy. The lad again, is a good squad player. But for £9.5million i expected a hell of a lot more.

Bellamy's as good a player as Kuyt. For all Kuyt's workrate and intelligence, his touch and passing are sloppy, his goalscoring is second rate and his arial ability is none existant.

[76-1174245250]

Poor passing election is something which we have seen in every one of our centre backs this season. And if I had to blame someone on this more, it would be Hyypia. But our defensive record is very good and it's unfair to ask for urgent replacement for this player.

I've seen mistakes in pass choosing and decissions in Agger of course, but his skill passing is good IMHO, that decission aspect of his game is something he'll also improve with age.

I'll come back later. I've seen some highlights, but now I'll start watching the whole game quietly. According to some of you I might get asleep, hope not.

Theres not alot wrong with Hyypia's choice of pass. Occassionally he hoofs it forward without thinking. But i'd rather that than giving it away stupidly in daft positions. Ala Agger and Alonso (at times this season).

What people don't see when Hyypia punts it forward is there is often nothing on infront of him. IE there is no movement from the midfielders and there is no pattern in the play. Hyypia often looks before the punts which is something you don't see unless you're at the ground. The amount of times you see Riise and Hyypia HAVING to go long because the players ahead of them aren't giving the option to do something different is EXTREMELY annoying.

[Sabre]

Bah, 98% of the game downloaded. Can't wait.

What people don't see when Hyypia punts it forward is there is often nothing on infront of him. IE there is no movement from the midfielders and there is no pattern in the play. Hyypia often looks before the punts which is something you don't see unless you're at the ground.

I agree this point you make about that being a thing that cannot be seen often in the TV. Football is a complicated game and TV ofen focus one player or a small portion of the game, not the movements. Still, I remember some poor passings of Hyypia, but I can't go deeper on this because I cannot remember specific games right now (My memory concerns me, I'm getting old).

Just realised that your nickname reversed is "Get a clue, lad" and can't stop laughing

[Forever_Red]

Agger's young and in time he'll only get better, it's pointless knockin the lad....look at what people used to say about carra and look at him now. I have to say that Kuyt and Bellamy are hard workers but if i had to choose it would easily be kuyt over bellamy, he just more of a complete player imo, with a good poacher he would it would be great (thats where david villa comes in). But to be honest i expected a lot more out of out strikeforce this season. 

When i look at the squad i cant see many places where we're very weak (except the wings) scoring goals is clearly the problem so theres no need to go diggin into the budget for defenders. No way id want woodgate, although the class player he is he'd probobly slip down the stairs and break his leg the second we sing him so i wouldnt bother. Like john said free or loan and id deffo snap him up and i also have to agree that sissoko is worth his place in the team mate.

I cant say much regarding alves cos i havent seen the lad play

Ladeulcateg, got anything supportive to say mate?

[skipper]

Rafa did not pick a good team today, that's for sure.  However, I once again did not like his substitutions.  He's waiting far too long to change things and when he does decide to make a sub, it's not the best option.  Pennant for Sissoko and putting Gerrard in the middle and Fowler for Kuyt would've been better for our attack.  Benitez's substitutions in the premiership have been poor at times.  We know he's a bit stubborn but he's got to know that things aren't going to fix themselves.  If we look lackluster and in dire need of some changes, Rafa's got to make those changes.

He's a brilliant manager and he has my support but I'm just hoping that his substitutions can improve (earlier and more effective, especially attacking).

[kobashi]

shocking performance.  Aurelio really needs to step it up to prove his worth.  Kuyt a great worker and will run all day but I aint sure if his good enough.  His 1st touch isnt that great at all and he said Rafa gave him a target of 18 goals.  He aint getting 18 goals!!

Bellamy had a real lack of service.  No point him being out there as the team did nothing for him.  We need 2 full backs, 2 wingers and a striker at the least.

[metalhead]

There's also no way I'd play Alves at right back.  He's weak defensively, but his crosses are class, he can go by a man and he's a goal threat.  He's a winger.  He's some bloody player.

I disagree with you john, and I have to agree with the other fella, he isn't a winger, he is a right back, an attacking right back, like cicinho, cafu and like any other brazilian full back. Yes he can go past a man and crosses, thats what top class brazilian full backs usually do. I think he is a good tackler, he isn't weak defencively, he is average, but he is a technical threat and he has loads of pace.

[murphy0151]

everyone was today.   thats the worst game i have seen gerrard have in a long time.

[The Manhattan Project]

Boring game. Nothing happening.

I should have watched Star Trek on Sky One instead.


Still, at least we got a point. Arsenal lost, so that's OK.