Liverpool FC Forum

Benny The Noon wrote:Where as I think Scott some people think by bringing in a maureen he would win us the title pretty quickly and people would expect that just like what happened with Chelsea but our situation is very much different and what happens when he doesn't win the title - people then start demanding another new manager . A new manager is no guarentee o a quick fix or of doing a better job than rafa has over the years

Reg wrote:S@int you tell us that in every friggin´ message you post and despite that T&T havent sacked him yet. Maybe you should contact them direct as it appears they dont follow these threads.

Come on mate, give us a break.

Mostly new stuff in that post Reg?  I don't think I have used the phrase Rafapologists before ( I saw that on another site and thought it was pretty good)

I haven't mentioned using Degans wages to suppliment our new managers wages before.

I haven't mentioned Rafa wanting half a team of new players before.

So it was pretty much all new stuff mate. It might not be earth shattering or brilliantly original or even what YOU want to read, but neither is most of the stuff defending Rafa.   

Believe me If I thought T&T read this forum my posts would be of a very different nature, but presuming that they don't, I just state my opinion.

As they say like it or lump it mate     

Reg wrote:Is it not the case that you get what you pay for?

Owzat wrote:

s@int wrote:We pay Degan £2million a year to sit on a bench, sell him for 3p and put the £2million we save towards the new managers salary if thats whats worrying people.

I just cannot understand how so many people are willing to believe that this is the best we can do. Rafa has been in the job 6 years and says that we need 5 or 6 more players if we are to be competitive....... half a fecking team short after 6 years!

The Rafapologists seem to believe that this season is just a blip and that he will turn it around next year, yet believe it would be impossible for another manager to do the same?

We have a league position that is a disgrace after the money we have spent and the players that we have at the club. I believe a new manager would bring new belief to both the team AND the fans, and would certainly improve on the pathetic season we have had this year. Hence for me Rafa has to go.

I agree.

What annoys me is we're almost happy with mediocrity, as if any incoming manager couldn't manage what Rafa has on the same budget, same players etc. I may have sarcastically mentioned previously our progress under Rafa as achieving the same as other managers - top 4-5 and the odd cup. As if any incoming manager couldn't get us into the top four and make a fist of 2nd or 3rd minimum, like Rafa has achieved the unachievable. Rafa finished 2nd, so did Houllier. Rafa won a European trophy, so did Houllier. Had the Champions League been as open to non-Champions as it is now, I reckon Evans would be right up there praised for achievements.

heimdall wrote:

Benny The Noon wrote:

Ben Patrick wrote:nail on the head for me from Saint there.

Thats my main gripe with most fans that are still behind Rafa.
It appears to me that they think we are doing all we can and that whoever was manager this season would have been the same.
To me thats ludicrous, someone else could come in and get more from these players.
Christ sake Rafa won the champions league with houlliers failing team.
Sometimes a change is needed.

Maybe the players have just lost motivation with the way the season has gone as opposed to the man in charge - if they cant give 100% for the club because of the guy in charge then they need to take a big hard look at themsleves and ask if they deserve they massive amount of money given to them


People think bringing someone new in would all of a sudden turn things around and watch us win the league etc ?

What happens when it doesnt next season with a new manager ?

Demand another new one ? then the same with the next season

So has Capello NOT improved England then. He has more or less the same players as McClaren did but from my impartial position I would have to say that England look a far far better team now.

It is ridiculous to suggest a new manager can't change the fortunes of a club, when it has happened time after time after time. Were you saying the same thing before Rafa took over?

I don't often say this (in fact i've never said it) but I agree with Heimdall.

Did I just do that?

Scottbot wrote:

maguskwt wrote:so what's the use if the new manager couldn't give us No.19 then? the current anti-rafa brigade's gonna turn upon the new manager after 2 seasons and become anti- 'new manager' anyway... and we'll have thise whole episode of calling the new manager things like clown, fat whatever... bringing the club down, killing the club etc etc.... what's new on here...

Don't tar everyone with the same brush mate. It might get like that on matchdays when people log in to vent there anger but there a significant number of fans on here who have come around to the idea of a new manager slowly, reluctantly and in their own time, who respect and are thankful for great nights he has given but also realistic enough to see that we need a change.

A new man might not deleiver number 19 BUT I don't think he'd have us struggling in 6th/7th position crossing our fingers for help to snatch 4th place on the last days of the season either.

stmichael wrote:If that's your opinion Saint that's fair enough.

My view is that when Rafa took on the job, he took it for the long haul and with a clear vision of where the club should be heading in the future; crikey he bought Aquilani for the next five years, not the short term when his injury record has been so poor in the past.

Unfortunately, in the time he has spent with the club I cannot recall one season where there has not been something hanging over his head. I honestly thought this season would finally be the one that had no excuses attached to it, until I saw our net spend for the summer transfer window. When he first started out he was slated in the press for making Europe his number one priority and not giving precedence to the elusive League title. But what they failed to grasp (and a number of fans for that matter) was the perilous financial state the club had been placed in, and the need for financial rewards the Champions League offered the club.

s@int wrote:

stmichael wrote:If that's your opinion Saint that's fair enough.

My view is that when Rafa took on the job, he took it for the long haul and with a clear vision of where the club should be heading in the future; crikey he bought Aquilani for the next five years, not the short term when his injury record has been so poor in the past.

Unfortunately, in the time he has spent with the club I cannot recall one season where there has not been something hanging over his head. I honestly thought this season would finally be the one that had no excuses attached to it, until I saw our net spend for the summer transfer window. When he first started out he was slated in the press for making Europe his number one priority and not giving precedence to the elusive League title. But what they failed to grasp (and a number of fans for that matter) was the perilous financial state the club had been placed in, and the need for financial rewards the Champions League offered the club.

Good post mate, I think thats probably as good a defence as I have read lately on Rafa.

Personally I think that 6 years is a long time in football, and there will always be many reasons (excuses)to why we have failed. The hard part is overcoming the obstacles and still winning, not in finding good reasons for us failing.

Money , injuries, loss of form, unhappy players, all have to be overcome if a team is going to actually achieve something, the other option is just to accept that you can't win because of them.

Ok then let's get a new manager and win no. 19... who wants to apply.... 

maguskwt wrote:

s@int wrote:

stmichael wrote:If that's your opinion Saint that's fair enough.

My view is that when Rafa took on the job, he took it for the long haul and with a clear vision of where the club should be heading in the future; crikey he bought Aquilani for the next five years, not the short term when his injury record has been so poor in the past.

Unfortunately, in the time he has spent with the club I cannot recall one season where there has not been something hanging over his head. I honestly thought this season would finally be the one that had no excuses attached to it, until I saw our net spend for the summer transfer window. When he first started out he was slated in the press for making Europe his number one priority and not giving precedence to the elusive League title. But what they failed to grasp (and a number of fans for that matter) was the perilous financial state the club had been placed in, and the need for financial rewards the Champions League offered the club.

Good post mate, I think thats probably as good a defence as I have read lately on Rafa.

Personally I think that 6 years is a long time in football, and there will always be many reasons (excuses)to why we have failed. The hard part is overcoming the obstacles and still winning, not in finding good reasons for us failing.

Money , injuries, loss of form, unhappy players, all have to be overcome if a team is going to actually achieve something, the other option is just to accept that you can't win because of them.

Ok then let's get a new manager and win no. 19... who wants to apply.... 

maguskwt wrote:

Scottbot wrote:

maguskwt wrote:so what's the use if the new manager couldn't give us No.19 then? the current anti-rafa brigade's gonna turn upon the new manager after 2 seasons and become anti- 'new manager' anyway... and we'll have thise whole episode of calling the new manager things like clown, fat whatever... bringing the club down, killing the club etc etc.... what's new on here...

Don't tar everyone with the same brush mate. It might get like that on matchdays when people log in to vent there anger but there a significant number of fans on here who have come around to the idea of a new manager slowly, reluctantly and in their own time, who respect and are thankful for great nights he has given but also realistic enough to see that we need a change.

A new man might not deleiver number 19 BUT I don't think he'd have us struggling in 6th/7th position crossing our fingers for help to snatch 4th place on the last days of the season either.

I ask then would the new manager be as successful as Rafa in Europe? Bar this season, Rafa's record in the CL spoke for itself.