Liverpool FC Forum

[aCe']

If he had started, I imagine he would've been looking at playing 60 minutes and not a half hour, and probably at a higher intensity. Plus, I think Rafa would've been working on something without Torres in the lead up to this game - a time when he may not have been sure how fit Torres would be on the day.

Torres played for 60 mins in the cup... surely if hes fit to play for 60 mins a few days back he'd be fit to play atleast 60 mins again in the more important game...

[Leonmc0708]

In my personal first eleven, Torres is up front on his JAck Jones, and KEane is on the bench.

[aCe']

Shocking miss from Torres was the easiest chance of them all imo...

So the misses from Gerrard and Keane from 3 yards out were harder to take than the one Torres hit the post with.

Gerrard was always going to be stretching to get to that ball and Keane's miss was shocking aswell no idea wat he was trying to do there.. but the torres ball was a perfectly weighted cut back... he was in the perfect position... it was easier for him to take the ball than the other two and similar to the other chances, hitting the target would have basically meant him scoring from such a close range...
So yes i think the Torres miss was the most shocking of all the others...

[LFC2007]

Torres played for 60 mins in the cup... surely if hes fit to play for 60 mins a few days back he'd be fit to play atleast 60 mins again in the more important game...

Didn't look very fit the other day though.

[Bad Bob]

I just hope Rafa sticks with the negative tactics, the dodgy subs etc.  His idiocy is working a treat this season!

[rafa09]

i don,t give a TOSS if we win 1-0 or 10-0 3 POINTS count. look at cheatski and mange, and even arsenal over the years.and believe me cheatski WILL slip up This is our best chance in a decade

[account deleted by request]

In my personal first eleven, Torres is up front on his JAck Jones, and KEane is on the bench.

I agree Leon. I have always prefered 4-4-2, but I think with the players we have now 4-2-3-1 is definitely our strongest formation, and best team. 

Still not too sure if Gerrard can do it from that position against the big teams, but certainly against the rest anyway.

[Leonmc0708]

In my personal first eleven, Torres is up front on his JAck Jones, and KEane is on the bench.

I agree Leon. I have always prefered 4-4-2, but I think with the players we have now 4-2-3-1 is definitely our strongest formation, and best team. 

Still not too sure if Gerrard can do it from that position against the big teams, but certainly against the rest anyway.

Gerrard is best when not shackled with the responsibilities of playing with discipline. He is the kidn of player you just have to allow licence to express himself.

Mascherano and Alonso is equally an absolute DREAM pairing in midfield, and Torres is arguably best when up top alone.

Whisper it, but we do have what looks like a strong side.

[Igor Zidane]

Good win, but the amount of clear chances that Liverpool missed today is a worry. Against a better side that may have more serious.

Between both teams there must have been about 8 clear chances missed in that game.

I'm still furious that Rafa AGAIN took off Keane and refused to play a 4-4-2 with him and Torres. I'd have taken off Mascherano.

Agree we should have gone for 2 upfront at 1-0 up when Keane was taken off early in the 2nd half... would have taken Riera off and shifted player around a bit... Gerrard cutting from the left and Keane coming deeper to control the ball better upfront...
Shocking miss from Torres was the easiest chance of them all imo... great pass and looked pretty interested unlike the cup game...

Again Rafa not doin Keane any favors by taking him off after less than an hour... gotta be frustrating cause it doesnt matter if hes scoring, in form or not, whatever it is he has to come off... his confidence must be at a super low especially after that miss and then being taken off...

  No no no  are you seriously suggesting that rafa got his tactics wrong today ? That question is aimed at the pair of you lovebirds .

just cause we won the game doesnt mean that people cant have an opinion or criticize a decision by the manager does it ?!

he didnt get it wrong but the negative tactics could have cost us ... like they did yet and again last season...

What in gods name is there to critisize  2-0 JOINT TOP FACT

[Sabre]

In my personal first eleven, Torres is up front on his JAck Jones, and KEane is on the bench.

I agree Leon. I have always prefered 4-4-2, but I think with the players we have now 4-2-3-1 is definitely our strongest formation, and best team. 

Still not too sure if Gerrard can do it from that position against the big teams, but certainly against the rest anyway.

Gerrard is best when not shackled with the responsibilities of playing with discipline. He is the kidn of player you just have to allow licence to express himself.

Mascherano and Alonso is equally an absolute DREAM pairing in midfield, and Torres is arguably best when up top alone.

Whisper it, but we do have what looks like a strong side.

I disagree part of your post 

I agree the best videos about Gerrard, the most things that are tasty for the eye are when Gerrard is allowed to express himself.

But, I quite agree Stu aswell when he thinks that Gerrard and Alonso made a very good couple in a 4-4-2. Just because Gerrard isn't allowed to do shiny things that often and be in the oppo box often, it doesn't mean he doesn't do GREAT football matches in those more disciplined games.

The question should not be when Gerrard feels more comfortable or we see the most spectacular part of his game, the question should be when the team as a whole is stronger.

And if I'm honest, I can't tell that. He's a hell of a player as a CM, as attacking midfielder and as a right midfielder, and I've seen the team as a whole playing very well in all the cases.

[Bam]

As for taking Keane off, he looked angry but, fook him--had he scored his sitter we would have been firmly in command and in a position to change the formation in order to get Torres some minutes while keeping him on the pitch.

Thats not quite true now is it, WBA at home Keane scores a brace he was firmly in command and the position to change the formation last week. But got subbed.

Anyway I was just merely pointing that out, personally yesteday I wasnt too bothered in him coming off, with Bolton building up a head of steam in the second half. Bringing off a midfielder to play Torres and Keane may of not been a wise move considering Bolton had five accross the middle and had their tails up.

Happy with the win, worried to an extent that yet again we almost let another team back into the game, we really did miss some sitters and put the game beyond doubt. But other than that it was a good day for us and shows the Spurs matches didnt induce us to a yesteryear bliiiiiiiip.

Well done to Rafa for keeping the rotations limited its definately helping !!

[Number 9]

Its just proof that Rafa sees all first players and in fact some skwaaad players as equal!
I think,in fact i know the tactics were spot on today.and I've been drinking from 12 mid day...sobre folk just cant see it!!
Drink lots of carlsberg and jd

[account deleted by request]

In my personal first eleven, Torres is up front on his JAck Jones, and KEane is on the bench.

I agree Leon. I have always prefered 4-4-2, but I think with the players we have now 4-2-3-1 is definitely our strongest formation, and best team. 

Still not too sure if Gerrard can do it from that position against the big teams, but certainly against the rest anyway.

Gerrard is best when not shackled with the responsibilities of playing with discipline. He is the kidn of player you just have to allow licence to express himself.

Mascherano and Alonso is equally an absolute DREAM pairing in midfield, and Torres is arguably best when up top alone.

Whisper it, but we do have what looks like a strong side.

While we seem to have a shortage of top quality replacements for our 14 or 15 man squad (I honestly don't think the rest are up to it at the moment.) I think we can use all 4 players (Keane/Gerrard/Alonso and Masch)resting one and changing between 4-4-2 and 4-3-2-1 depending on circumstances and opponents, without greatly reducing the strength of the side.

The surprising thing for me this season is how quickly Riera AND Kuyt have become key players for us, and how quickly Babel ,Pennant and Benayoun (to an extent)seem to have become poor second choice bit part players.

I don't want to get into the whole rotation argument, but for me playing a more settled side has certainly helped to make it clear that some of our squad players just arn't up to the job. Alternatively maybe we arn't rotating as much because we HAVE better players, or at least players that are playing much better (Kuyt/Alonso).

If we can avoid injuries and maybe strengthen a couple of places at Christmas(even if its just with better squad players) , I think we are in with half a chance.

[Owzat]

Shocking miss from Torres was the easiest chance of them all imo...

So the misses from Gerrard and Keane from 3 yards out were harder to take than the one Torres hit the post with.

Gerrard was always going to be stretching to get to that ball and Keane's miss was shocking aswell no idea wat he was trying to do there.. but the torres ball was a perfectly weighted cut back... he was in the perfect position... it was easier for him to take the ball than the other two and similar to the other chances, hitting the target would have basically meant him scoring from such a close range...
So yes i think the Torres miss was the most shocking of all the others...

Torres had the tougher angle, less of the goal to aim at and his shot was curling inwards - but not quickly enough to avoid the post.

[Owzat]

Well, I'm suggesting that Rafa needs to stop fücking around with Robbie Keane. This business of taking him off on the hour every game cannot be doing him any good at all. It's getting to the point where Keane knows that when the hour's up, he's off. Even when a hat-trick is on the cards like last week.

Before the Torres injury, himself and Keane were looking quite good and they were beginning to gel somewhat and I think it's time to re-engineer that again.

Keane's movement was good today and bar the admitedly awful miss (and he wasn't alone in that today), he was doing well. But it doesn't seem how bad or well he does, he gets subbed![/quote]
Funnily enough it's about LIVERPOOL not Robbie Keane. Keane had plenty of time to complete his hat-trick, both his goals were first half and he was subbed around the usual time Rafa brings on subs which was all or the best part of HALF AN HOUR after his second goal. It's not like he scored his second and Rafa took him off immediately

I don't know how you work out that Keane and Torres were gelling :

- Keane's brace against WBA was scored BEFORE Torres came on

- Torres scored one before Keane came on against Citeh and the other shortly after

- Torres' winner against Sunderland was scored after Keane had come off

- Keane's goal against Atletico came while Torres was out injured

So only Keane's goal against the less than impressive PSV and Torres' brace against an equally unimpressive bitters side could really be used to show some kind of understanding or partnership and that's four goals out of their combined nine - bearing in mind Torres hasn't had much chance to play up front on his own so he should score more with both together since that is more common than Torres on his own.

In addition, Liverpool need to start concentrating on playing with two strikers, after all that is what Rafa paid 20 mil for.

Robbie can't play up on his own, neither can any of the other options bar Torres (and even that's debatable this year). It's that simple, he needs another striker to play with. It's beneficial to Liverpool too as it creates more options in attack, which Liverpool can be sorely lacking in at times.

Rafa paid £20m to bolster the strikeforce, I've said before that just because he is the second most expensive player in the squad doesn't mean he has to start every game or we have to shape the team - potentially at it's detriment - to accommodate Keane.

You sure you support Liverpool for Liverpool or for Keane? Your arrival on here coincides way too much with his at Anfield. Keane has a lot of making up to do, I completely disagree that Torres can't play up front on his own. At the moment the best options are Torres on his own up front, THEN the two together and then Keane on his own. Keane hasn't shown much gelling at all with Torres, THREE (edit) of his four goals have come with Torres off the pitch and all Keane has shown so far is a horrible tendancy to miss chances he should score. Maybe that is pressure, but Keane wanted to sign for his "boyhood club" and did he expect there to be no pressure?

Keane's been given more opportunity than he deserves, because of his price tag. Crouch, Fowler, Bellamy, Morientes etc would be shipped out in January or the summer if they'd been in Keane's boots and missing like he too often does and scoring one in five as he is (one in four or even three if you go for the bigmick school of figure fiddling)