Liverpool FC Forum

by **GYBS** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 7:53 pm

Fully Deserved as well - well done

by **Toffeehater** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 5:31 am

Has been immesne this season so far , hopefully he can keep up the good work and hit 15 to 20 goals from a wing postion , would be hard to see people complaining about his lack of goal threat and goals than ..

by **Owzat** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 2:15 pm

Toffeehater wrote:Has been immesne this season so far , hopefully he can keep up the good work and hit 15 to 20 goals from a wing postion , would be hard to see people complaining about his lack of goal threat and goals than ..

15 to 20 might be a tad optimistic, that would be a half decent return for a striker - 1 in 3 was around what Crouch managed from a purely striking role. 10-15 would be pretty good, bear in mind I doubt many of our recent past wingers have scored 10 goals in total let alone in one season!

by **DanAn** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 3:09 pm

So far Dirks on track for 1 in 3. Love to see it continue for the season.

by **bigmick** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 8:02 pm

Owzat wrote:1 in 3 was around what Crouch managed from a purely striking role.

Just to clarify Owz with this casually thrown in stat, does that include the three minutes as sub cameos, do they count as an appearance in the 1 in 3? No doubt the stat also includes the sixteen games at the start or whatever it was before Crouch scored a goal at all. My suspicion is though, that once he got off the mark his record was a wee bit better than one in three, particularly if we don't count the three minute cameos.

Anyway fair play to "Dirky boy" who is without question in the richest run of form since he's been at Liverpool. His play at times is still maddeningly up and down, but his goals contribution from mostly the right side of midfield has been good. Long may it continue.

by **GYBS** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 8:14 pm

Did you know that crouch never reached double figures in the league ? thought he did in first season but saw a report in the telegraph i think it was .

by **bigmick** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 8:27 pm

GYBS wrote:Did you know that crouch never reached double figures in the league ? thought he did in first season but saw a report in the telegraph i think it was .

I'm going to break a vow and answer this point.

If it is the case that Crouch didn't ever get into double figures in the league, it is as surprising to me as you say it is to you. That said, as a striker Crouch was and is a good player. Many of us were/are of the opinion that AS A STRIKER he is a far better player than Kuyt. Many of us also believed that when he played up front with Torres, there was the beginnings of a handy partnership.

All that said, I don't think Crouch is as good a player as Keane, and as such I agree with the decision to cash in on him. Owz by no doubt his own admission had/has a pathological dislike though of Crouch, and does tend on occasion to lob the odd hand grenade into the mix in which he mentions the big fella. Some of us try and get in quick to diffuse the bomb before it explodes, it's kind of a ritual around here.

To cut a long story short, Owz likes Kuyt and thinks he's amuch better player than Crouch. Some of us preferred Crouch (AS A STRIKER), that's essentially what this exchange is all about. Such things make the forum go round.

by **GYBS** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 8:37 pm

Find it strange for anyone to have a dislike for crouch tbh . I know towards the end his attitude was a bit off and started getting a bit too big for his boots and worried about his england career but he did good things for us . As a striker i think it would be hard to split the two - sometimes crouch looked like he would score from anywhere but i also remember a lot of glaring misses from him . he had a lot of negatives about his overall game which is where i think kuyt is better than crouch but no one can really complain for what crouch did for us in his time here - in the end just dont think he is good enough to lead a line for a team wanting title ambitions.

by **account deleted by request** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 8:42 pm

Crouch only played 90 mins 35 times in the league for Liverpool. Came on as a sub 41 times and was subbed off 58 times. Best season he scored 9 league and 9 cup goals, with 7 of those goals in Europe, but it still didn't get him a starting place in the final.

by **Number 9** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 8:45 pm

s@int wrote:Crouch only played 90 mins 35 times in the league for Liverpool. Came on as a sub 41 times and was subbed off 58 times. Best season he scored 9 league and 9 cup goals, with 7 of those goals in Europe, but it still didn't get him a starting place in the final.

The bit about the final confirms that Rafa hated Crouch,maybe even as much as Owzat!
PATHOLOGICALLY as Mick said! lol

by **Bam** » Thu Nov 13, 2008 1:13 am

I have to hold my hands up here and salute Kuyt, as for now he is definately proving my theory on selling him totally wrong.

He has been one of a best players this season, and had any of the players out there tonight (Spurs) would of had the guts and determination Kuyt plays with then they'd of been in with a chance. I think the good thing about Kuyt is obviously his work rate, that energy he shows while on the pitch can only serve to inspire his teamates. When he's pressing and hassling like a mad man possesed that will no doubt lift the others around him and inspire them.

I hope he keeps his scoring flurry up, its amazing what a bit of confidence does.

by **Owzat** » Thu Nov 13, 2008 8:40 am

bigmick wrote:
Owzat wrote:1 in 3 was around what Crouch managed from a purely striking role.

Just to clarify Owz with this casually thrown in stat, does that include the three minutes as sub cameos, do they count as an appearance in the 1 in 3? No doubt the stat also includes the sixteen games at the start or whatever it was before Crouch scored a goal at all. My suspicion is though, that once he got off the mark his record was a wee bit better than one in three, particularly if we don't count the three minute cameos.

Anyway fair play to "Dirky boy" who is without question in the richest run of form since he's been at Liverpool. His play at times is still maddeningly up and down, but his goals contribution from mostly the right side of midfield has been good. Long may it continue.

So it's ok for YOU to do selective stats but not me? Like Owen starts every game, or Fowler did, or any other striker you could mention. Jeez, it was just an example and yet we're back on that booooooooring bitching over Crouch. Get over it, if he was anything like a 1 in 2 striker then he'd still be playing for Liverpool.

This thread is ABOUT KUYT, excuse me for picking Crouch as an example to show how 1 in 3 might be a bit much to expect from a player out wide. (should have guessed someone would jump straight back on defence of Crouch duty)

by **Owzat** » Thu Nov 13, 2008 8:50 am

Number 9 wrote:
s@int wrote:Crouch only played 90 mins 35 times in the league for Liverpool. Came on as a sub 41 times and was subbed off 58 times. Best season he scored 9 league and 9 cup goals, with 7 of those goals in Europe, but it still didn't get him a starting place in the final.

The bit about the final confirms that Rafa hated Crouch,maybe even as much as Owzat!
PATHOLOGICALLY as Mick said! lol

What have I done, casual mention of Crouch and off everyone goes on that tedious debate over the lanky streak of p1ss.

I didn't hate Crouch, I hated seeing a "striker" as ordinary as him in the Liverpool shirt. Ever considered the reason I said so much to his detriment is that I was fed up with people who made out like he was better than he is, was or ever will be?

four goals in 16 appearances for Portsmouth this time around, I guess that's because he hasn't played every minute. Except he has played 89-90 minutes in all but two games I can find substitution records for, and he played 69 minutes in both of those. Next excuse? I guess we ought to review Owen's record, he's probably scoring a goal every start. Didn't of course know that not starting meant you couldn't score, just like playing on the wing doesn't mean you can't score

S@int - if you and bigmick do wish to break Crouch's record down to such small detail that it means next to nothing, maybe you'd care to break down his records by opponents. ie good record against :censored:

opposition, and 1 in dozens against the mancs or Chelsea - barring that freak hat-track against Arsenal who gave him way too much space. What do you know, the sides he's scored against this season are Fulham, Stoke, bitters and spudz (before the revival)

by **Owzat** » Thu Nov 13, 2008 8:57 am

Bam wrote:I have to hold my hands up here and salute Kuyt, as for now he is definately proving my theory on selling him totally wrong.

He has been one of a best players this season, and had any of the players out there tonight (Spurs) would of had the guts and determination Kuyt plays with then they'd of been in with a chance. I think the good thing about Kuyt is obviously his work rate, that energy he shows while on the pitch can only serve to inspire his teamates. When he's pressing and hassling like a mad man possesed that will no doubt lift the others around him and inspire them.

I hope he keeps his scoring flurry up, its amazing what a bit of confidence does.

I think some people's views on Kuyt depend very much on his goals, if the goals aren't there then some will simply state he works hard and nothing else. Of course when he's not there you can see what he gives the team, if you're not so anti-Kuyt that he could score a hat-trick and you'd still say "but apart from his lucky goals..........."

He scored the winner (of the tie) against Standard Liege and the flak still came his way until the last few weeks. Ironically Robbie Keane did FA for the first 10 games and got better support, it's all about perspective. Could I favour Crouch if I was a big fan? Possibly. But then he took 19 games to get off the mark and still got more support than Kuyt, just the way it is. Maybe it is that annoying tendancy to back losers that I hate so much. With Kuyt his goalscoring record was not good enough, but his role and contribution is now different yet some still regard him as "failed striker". He is now success out wide, took time to convert the mentality of some fans to the new role and contribution.

I am somewhat surprised Crouch is only knocking in 1 in 4 at FP, he did well there before and for Southampton (1 in 2 bigmick!) But he didn't make a lasting impression or contribution at spudz, QPR, villa or Anfield. Easy to say "given the chance he would have come good", Fowler wasn't, nor was Voronin and Bellamy didn't either. Fowler got even less chance than Crouch and still managed 1 in 3 second time around, don't see that quoted by anyone else but me

EDIT : and despite me yet being impressed by Robkeaneho, I still think he should have played last night. Still think his inclusion is not on merit as it should be, but on the fee paid and making it work.

by **redmikey** » Sun Nov 16, 2008 5:00 pm

i think it is criminal the lad hasn't got a good song!!!!!!!!!!!! works his balls off for the team week in week out

the goals are starting to come this term, even playing out of position as a right sided stiker, heard babel moaning about lack of chances but never a peep out of dirk(derek) kyut, legend!!!!!!!!!!

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