Liverpool FC Forum

by **JBG** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 9:24 pm

Stu.Murph wrote:Fowler's clearly unfavoured. Bellamy's not going to stay for my money.

Kuyt is clearly favoured and Rafa's golden boy and he's already said Crouch is going nowhere.

Thats probably right.

Kuyt and Crouch going nowhere.

Fowler will definitely be going.

Bellamy will probably be sold to Aston Villa or Celtic to make way for a big name signing.

I cannot fathom where Voronin is going to fit. He's actually rather handy on the ball but if people think Kuyt is goal shy just wait until they see Voronin. :help

by **Stu.Murph** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 9:26 pm

JBG wrote:
Stu.Murph wrote:Fowler's clearly unfavoured. Bellamy's not going to stay for my money.

Kuyt is clearly favoured and Rafa's golden boy and he's already said Crouch is going nowhere.

Thats probably right.

Kuyt and Crouch going nowhere.

Fowler will definitely be going.

Bellamy will probably be sold to Aston Villa or Celtic to make way for a big name signing.

I cannot fathom where Voronin is going to fit. He's actually rather handy on the ball but if people think Kuyt is goal shy just wait until they see Voronin.

I've seen Voronin's record.

That scares me. No matter what anyone says about Fowler and I've read some :censored:

on here about him, the fact is, he's scored goals and some bloody important ones aswell.

by **JBG** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 9:49 pm

Voronin is a reasonably handy player. He's good on the ball with an eye for a pass. At a stretch he could be described as a Peter Beardsley type player. But for a striker he's goalscoring record is below par, and I cannot see how he's going to improve on what we have.

Strange signing.

by **KennyisGod....still** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 10:22 pm

I'd take Kuyt's effort and work rate and maybe 15 goals a season above an 'out and out ' striker gettin 20 with little else a season. Kuyt makes chances, diverts defenders and generally makes teams watch his movement for every minute he's on the pitch, and thats a huge help to any strikeforce. And one look at the first goal against PSV shows he gets in the right place but has the nous to make way for a better positioned player. (I thought Gerrard was gonna $hag his arSe as he put that one away!!)

As many stats as we like could make good a call for Robbie, but we have to be honest and say his best days have gone, great as they were. Crouch will stay, of that I'm sure.....shame he can't have a nose op on a regular basis if it means a hat-trick on every come back! Bellamy? Truth again be said, I doubt he'll ever settle anywhere without some kinda trouble followin his moves.

Kuyt could easily become a cult hero at Anfield, I don't recall a harder workin non-scouser in the team for a long long time. (Maybe Kewell could take a few notes on that one) I personally hope we're still discussin Kuyt's inclusion for years to come, and with at least the same level of success as now, but preferably after he's settled in even better next season.

by **kazza** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 10:51 pm

Owzat wrote:I am disappointed with Kuyt's goals tally, his overall play is fine.

Dirk Kuyt

Home - 8 goals in 20 appearances (0.400 goals/app)
Away - 3 goals in 21 appearances (0.143 goals/app)

Overall - 11 goals in 41 appearances (0.268 goals/app)

And to compare with current other Liverpool strikers :-

Fowler : 13 goals in 32 appearances* (0.406 goals/app)
Crouch : 30 goals in 90 appearances (0.333 goals/app)
Kuyt : 11 goals in 41 appearances (0.268 goals/app)
Bellamy : 9 goals in 36 appearances (0.250 goals/app)
Luis Garcia : 30 goals in 121 appearances (0.248 goals/appearance)

*since Fowler returned to Anfield.

It is interesting that many consider Fowler 'past it', yet he manages a pretty good scoring rate and that in spite of limited time on the pitch. When given a full game he scores, when used as a sub he is much less effective yet half his appearances have been as a sub

Robbie Fowler

0-32 mins on pitch

1 goal in 16 appearances (0.063 goals/app)
1 goal in 240 mins (240 mins/goal)
240 mins over 16 appearances (15 mins/app)

60-79 mins on pitch

4 goals in 10 appearances (0.400 goals/app)
4 goals in 688 mins (172 mins/goal)
688 mins over 10 appearances (69 mins/app)

80-90 mins on pitch

8 goals in 6 appearances (1.333 goals/app)
8 goals in 524 mins (66 mins/goal)
524 mins over 6 appearances (87 mins/app)

Overall

13 goals in 32 appearances (0.406 goals/app)
13 goals in 1452 mins (112 mins/goal)
1452 mins over 32 appearances (45 mins/app)

So effectively Fowler is scoring roughly 4 goals for every 10 appearances while playing on average only 45 mins per appearance. While all three of his Premiership goals this season have come from the penalty spot he has still managed a pretty good record when given a decent chance. It's not like we have a better penalty taker or indeed any of our strikers are scoring so frequently that they're undroppable.

2005/6 : 6 goals in 14 appearances (0.429 goals/app)
2006/7 : 7 goals in 18 appearances (0.389 goals/app)

His record against top four, top half and bottom half sides in the Premiership is consistently at or over 0.333 goals per appearance so what more can he do to get half a chance?

All we are saying is give God a chance..........

What about assists and balls won (tackles made)?

It is not just about scoring. Kuyt is a team player that works hard for the team and never quits. A coach's player!

by **metalhead** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 11:31 pm

JBG wrote:Voronin is a reasonably handy player. He's good on the ball with an eye for a pass. At a stretch he could be described as a Peter Beardsley type player. But for a striker he's goalscoring record is below par, and I cannot see how he's going to improve on what we have.

Strange signing.

maybe use him in the flanks i guess, he can play both right and left wing.. well not naturally ofcourse, he played on the wings before, and I think we can use him as a winger.

by **Stu.Murph** » Mon Apr 09, 2007 12:09 am

metalhead wrote:
JBG wrote:Voronin is a reasonably handy player. He's good on the ball with an eye for a pass. At a stretch he could be described as a Peter Beardsley type player. But for a striker he's goalscoring record is below par, and I cannot see how he's going to improve on what we have.

Strange signing.

maybe use him in the flanks i guess, he can play both right and left wing.. well not naturally ofcourse, he played on the wings before, and I think we can use him as a winger.

If he's buying him to play him out of position then that makes it even worse.

by **stmichael** » Mon Apr 09, 2007 12:28 am

Stu.Murph wrote:
metalhead wrote:
JBG wrote:Voronin is a reasonably handy player. He's good on the ball with an eye for a pass. At a stretch he could be described as a Peter Beardsley type player. But for a striker he's goalscoring record is below par, and I cannot see how he's going to improve on what we have.

Strange signing.

maybe use him in the flanks i guess, he can play both right and left wing.. well not naturally ofcourse, he played on the wings before, and I think we can use him as a winger.

If he's buying him to play him out of position then that makes it even worse.

Exactly.

I know Voronin can also play on the right wing but that fills me with dread. Voronin on the right is probably worse option than Pennant, Gerrard and Garcia there!

by **JBG** » Mon Apr 09, 2007 2:59 am

I think Voronin will surprise people. He's a good positive player who can make things happen.

Unfortunately he'd be fine at Man City but Liverpool?

by **LFC #1** » Mon Apr 09, 2007 6:02 am

JBG wrote:Voronin is a reasonably handy player. He's good on the ball with an eye for a pass. At a stretch he could be described as a Peter Beardsley type player. But for a striker he's goalscoring record is below par, and I cannot see how he's going to improve on what we have.

Strange signing.

He's versatile though, he cna play on the flanks if needed. Perhaps thsi is Rafa's intention.

I agree with you, it's a strange signing. It's on a free though so maybe it'll turn out to be a shrewd bit of business.

by **metalhead** » Mon Apr 09, 2007 12:36 pm

Stu.Murph wrote:
metalhead wrote:
JBG wrote:Voronin is a reasonably handy player. He's good on the ball with an eye for a pass. At a stretch he could be described as a Peter Beardsley type player. But for a striker he's goalscoring record is below par, and I cannot see how he's going to improve on what we have.

Strange signing.

maybe use him in the flanks i guess, he can play both right and left wing.. well not naturally ofcourse, he played on the wings before, and I think we can use him as a winger.

If he's buying him to play him out of position then that makes it even worse.

Not necesseraly, if what jbg said that he is a good passer and good on the ball, also he is pacey, i think he can do a good job as a winger... but what do i know

by **JBG** » Mon Apr 09, 2007 1:45 pm

He's a strange signing. If Vornonin is an unqualified success (or for that matter, a qualified one) at Liverpool I'll eat my hat. :blues:

by **7_Kewell** » Mon Apr 09, 2007 1:54 pm

can't really complain on a free transfer. He'll probably be our 4th choice striker and if he doens't set the world alight then i'm sure Rafa will be able to ship him out again.

by **Stu.Murph** » Mon Apr 09, 2007 2:09 pm

JBG wrote:He's a strange signing. If Vornonin is an unqualified success (or for that matter, a qualified one) at Liverpool I'll eat my hat.

Strange or stupid?

One thing I garentee, he's adding unnesseccary pressure to himself by doing this. No-one can deny that. Even if its only a little bit. Its a very unpopular decision.

by **Paul C** » Mon Apr 09, 2007 6:44 pm

I've been a little disapointed with Kuyt, yeah he works his ar5e off every game but at the end of the day strikers are there to score goals and he misses too many chances for my liking

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