Liverpool FC Forum

[GYBS]

The goal saving tackle and then immediate pass to Kompany in yesterdays game typifies Dork Kuyt for me.

One moment cheering on the lad, the very next cursing his soul.

Does he score important goals?

garcia did that also matey, but he aint at lfc anymore.

theres no doubt he is like a shire horse when it comes to workrate, but a donkey when it comes to skill

we could get a thousand players to score important goals like kuyt, and make them work hard, but at the end of the day, they are just not good enough in the skill department.

why the fuck cant some folk see that! it beggars belief, it really does.

why get a thousand players to score important goals when we already have players that do it- torres,gerrard.kuyt,babel.

ive mentioned garcia gybs, please read my post!

plus, i was analysing kuyt, not gerrard n co!

please read my post, and if you have any suitable relavant comment, please add it.

i mentioned skill. gerrard n co have that, but unfortunately kuyt does not.

like i said, aaron lennon is a better option. i feel he would fit in at lfc, and be a better option than kuyt. plus the lad is far more skilful, and i believe under rafa's tutorship, would be a FAR more important goal scorer than kuyt would ever be

IMO

and chances of us getting lennon ?

spurs in the already do you think they would sell another one of their better players to us ?

seen kuyt produce moments of skill - take last week for example when he went round two psv players to set torres on his way - each team also needs its workhorses as well as skill players . you need the balance in their and kuyt provides that for us at the moment .

we know kuyt will never be blessed with skill and pace of other yet he still produces for the team .

look at spurs - spent all that money on skillful players et no workers and now doing .

need a balance in there .

wait till january mate

jan is jan mate - at the moment the window only closed couple weeks ago and with the players we got we are sitting pretty in the league and in the cls so no real major need to be looking to replace players as such - obviously if things gone wrong then we look at getting players in but if we are still up their challenging then rafa wont look to replace players - maybe look to add but not replace . yeah someone like lennon would be good but i cant see us realistically getting him with what i think how little money we have to spend .

i know where we are in the league

january is a further opportunity to buy a creative player with a little flair. lets face it, i reckon we will need a little input if we are to seriously challange for the title!

i believe aaron lennon is that player. better than pennant and better than kuyt - period

if its the lennon of a couple of seasons ago then yeah definatly - the one of last year was no better than pennant imo . seems to look a bit brighter for spuurs but hard to tell with them playing so .

[JC_81]

Aaron Lennon?  Sh.ite in my opinion.  Flatters to deceive and no end product.  Has pace and that's about it.

[account deleted by request]

On this thread in particular, and on one or two others as well, it's become impossible to debate football sensibly. There are a couple of characters kicking about who stifle any sensible discussion with their inane proclamations, half truths and idiocy. There is a complete refusal to even attempt to engage the brain, to think about the other persons point of view before posting, and a style which is the equivalent of sticking their fingers in their ears and singing Ba-ba black sheep louder and louder until they've drowned out any dissent.

If it's not spamming the forum, it's pretty close to it and makes the process pointless. I'm also bound to say Supersub that calling a bloke a "Nobhead" for what was a fairly sensible post (albeit one which was critical of Kuyt) was surely not the way to go. People begin to get worked up, exasperated and the like but there's hardly any wonder. It's akin to trying to have an adult conversation and some silly twelve year old keep sticking his two penneth in (obviously not talking about Supersub in that bit).

I have a message to those who rate Kuyt.

1. Nearly everybody accepts that if the captain isn't going to play there, Kuyt is just about our best option for right midfield.

2. Everybody accepts that he works hard.

3. Everybody accepts that he's a nice bloke. Also, everybody accepts that his Dad died last year.

4. Over the last few weeks, everybody would accept that he has scored some important goals. Three to be precise. One of them resulted in us not having to endure a penalty shoot-out against Standard Liege, the other one resulted in us getting three points rather than one against Man City. Nobody who has seen a video re-run of the two matches, or was "at the game", or who has read a newspaper would dispute that.

So there you go. I think everyone accepts that, so there seems little point in keep answering the various points which crop up with the same answers. "But he scores important goals" or "but he works hard" gets a bit tedious, as does comparing him with Djimitar Berbatov.

The idea is, somebody thinks of a point, and you counter it with a point which is relevent to theirs. That's how sensible discussion works. For instance, if somebody says that I think Aaron Lennon would be a better bet at right midfield, don't counter it with either a) we couldn't afford him, or b) they would never sell him to us, or c) it's pointless talking about Aaron Lennon because he doesn't play for us.

Why not? well:

1) and 2) are simply ridiculous comments. They've just sold Berbatov and keane, and previously sold Michael Carrick. Given they've just bought David Bentley and that Lennon hasn't even been a regular starter, of course they would listen to offers. Teams do. As far as the money goes, ditto. We aren't talking about Lionel Messi here, we're talking about Aaron Lennon. His transfer fee would be between 6-14 million I should think, therefore we could afford it. On number 3) well I think most people know he doesn't play for us. I think it is legitimate however, that if you don't rate a player, say so and get asked by people 'well who's better then?" to actually offer an alternative. To ask the question "who's better then, pray tell" and then dismiss an answer because "they don't play for us" is patently ridiculous.

So, if somebody suggests Aaron Lennon as a potential alternative at right midfield and you don't agree, you have two choices it seems to me if the forum makes any sense. Either let it go and don't bother answering, or offer sensible reasons as to why you don't like the idea. I'll start. Although he offers plenty going forward, I think given the fact we have Riera on the left it would leave us unbalanced with not enough stickability going backwards. There, thats my view on Lennon.

We're in danger around here just now of rendering the forum a complete waste of everybodies time.

Good post Mick, just about sums up my views on Kuyt AND this thread mate. I think if we are going to actually win the league or even maintain a challenge, we will need to strengthen at Christmas and one of the places I would be looking to strengthen would be Right midfield.

[bigmick]

if this forum was around 20 years ago how many people would be slagging off players like sammy lee and graig johnston etc ?

I can only assume you are quite young and never saw either Sammy Lee or Craig Johnston play. There is absolutely no comparioson, not an iota.

I refer you to my four points on Dirk earlier. But seek out some video footage of the two comparisons you are going with now. They aren't possibly in the Djimitar Berbatov league, but they aren't far off.

Amazon'll have some stuff, seek it out and do yourself a favour.

[GYBS]

oh dont worry im old enough to remember seing them both live at the matches , while both of them were blessed with much skill and pace they worked there bloody socks off to make up for it .

[NANNY RED]

FFS let the SWP rest we didnt want him he dosnt play for us an he never will hes at Man city an is gonna stay there . An at no time were we even speak or make any contact with any agent.

Have you got a cob on Mick

I do see similar comparisons though with Johnston as i said in another thread, Works hard. runs around alot . Johnstone was no prolific goalscorer for us Mick,Ok he scored a few but he was never up there imo

[maguskwt]

So, if somebody suggests Aaron Lennon as a potential alternative at right midfield and you don't agree, you have two choices it seems to me if the forum makes any sense. Either let it go and don't bother answering, or offer sensible reasons as to why you don't like the idea. I'll start. Although he offers plenty going forward, I think given the fact we have Riera on the left it would leave us unbalanced with not enough stickability going backwards. There, thats my view on Lennon.

if he's for sale and we can afford him, buy him, why not. But not SWP. SWP is clearly overrated, he couldn't even break into england's starting 11 regularly and is only slightly better than Pennant. My opinion on this is don't replace kuyt immediately but find a cheap and promising youngster as back up because kuyt has put in good performances for the team and he, keane and torres are starting to gel. Why change something that's working and disrupt the team spirit?

[Kharhaz]

So, if somebody suggests Aaron Lennon as a potential alternative at right midfield and you don't agree, you have two choices it seems to me if the forum makes any sense. Either let it go and don't bother answering, or offer sensible reasons as to why you don't like the idea. I'll start. Although he offers plenty going forward, I think given the fact we have Riera on the left it would leave us unbalanced with not enough stickability going backwards. There, thats my view on Lennon.

Or any other right midfielder. But not many are in the class of C. Ronaldo. Hate him all you like, he is a key player in the united side. Mock Kuyt all we like, but who could be better. Yes Pennant is an alternative for crosses, and for goals, he scored a beauty against Chelsea. But he doesnt perform enough. At one point he did, when he played a few games Pennant was one of our most improved players. But injuries or whatever he has proved to become unreliable. So if we replace Kuyt who would we replace him with? Someone good going forward, Ronaldo, Cole, Wright Phillips? yes and no. We are now used to what Kuyt offers. Workrate. Gerrard is the one. He can work as hard as Kuyt, and has. He can offer goal opportunities and will help out the entire right side of the pitch. Replacing Kuyt may sound easy but it isnt. From what I can see, Gerrard is the only option, you name someone who can offer the commitment that Kuyt offers and the quality that Gerrard offers and suddenly, the choices for right midfield or winger if you like are not as clear cut as picking from Lennon, SWP, or Ronaldo.

[LFC Uber Elite Super Member]

My opinion on this is don't replace kuyt immediately but find a cheap and promising youngster as back up

Agreed Messi or Aguero absolute bargains

[maypaxvobiscum]

My opinion on this is don't replace kuyt immediately but find a cheap and promising youngster as back up

Agreed Messi or Aguero absolute bargains

  i found this funny

[maypaxvobiscum]

On this thread in particular, and on one or two others as well, it's become impossible to debate football sensibly. There are a couple of characters kicking about who stifle any sensible discussion with their inane proclamations, half truths and idiocy. There is a complete refusal to even attempt to engage the brain, to think about the other persons point of view before posting, and a style which is the equivalent of sticking their fingers in their ears and singing Ba-ba black sheep louder and louder until they've drowned out any dissent.

If it's not spamming the forum, it's pretty close to it and makes the process pointless. I'm also bound to say Supersub that calling a bloke a "Nobhead" for what was a fairly sensible post (albeit one which was critical of Kuyt) was surely not the way to go. People begin to get worked up, exasperated and the like but there's hardly any wonder. It's akin to trying to have an adult conversation and some silly twelve year old keep sticking his two penneth in (obviously not talking about Supersub in that bit).

I have a message to those who rate Kuyt.

1. Nearly everybody accepts that if the captain isn't going to play there, Kuyt is just about our best option for right midfield.

2. Everybody accepts that he works hard.

3. Everybody accepts that he's a nice bloke. Also, everybody accepts that his Dad died last year.

4. Over the last few weeks, everybody would accept that he has scored some important goals. Three to be precise. One of them resulted in us not having to endure a penalty shoot-out against Standard Liege, the other one resulted in us getting three points rather than one against Man City. Nobody who has seen a video re-run of the two matches, or was "at the game", or who has read a newspaper would dispute that.

So there you go. I think everyone accepts that, so there seems little point in keep answering the various points which crop up with the same answers. "But he scores important goals" or "but he works hard" gets a bit tedious, as does comparing him with Djimitar Berbatov.

The idea is, somebody thinks of a point, and you counter it with a point which is relevent to theirs. That's how sensible discussion works. For instance, if somebody says that I think Aaron Lennon would be a better bet at right midfield, don't counter it with either a) we couldn't afford him, or b) they would never sell him to us, or c) it's pointless talking about Aaron Lennon because he doesn't play for us.

Why not? well:

1) and 2) are simply ridiculous comments. They've just sold Berbatov and keane, and previously sold Michael Carrick. Given they've just bought David Bentley and that Lennon hasn't even been a regular starter, of course they would listen to offers. Teams do. As far as the money goes, ditto. We aren't talking about Lionel Messi here, we're talking about Aaron Lennon. His transfer fee would be between 6-14 million I should think, therefore we could afford it. On number 3) well I think most people know he doesn't play for us. I think it is legitimate however, that if you don't rate a player, say so and get asked by people 'well who's better then?" to actually offer an alternative. To ask the question "who's better then, pray tell" and then dismiss an answer because "they don't play for us" is patently ridiculous.

So, if somebody suggests Aaron Lennon as a potential alternative at right midfield and you don't agree, you have two choices it seems to me if the forum makes any sense. Either let it go and don't bother answering, or offer sensible reasons as to why you don't like the idea. I'll start. Although he offers plenty going forward, I think given the fact we have Riera on the left it would leave us unbalanced with not enough stickability going backwards. There, thats my view on Lennon.

We're in danger around here just now of rendering the forum a complete waste of everybodies time.

i think this is the best post ive read in this thread. i totally agree with it.

[Judge]

Aaron Lennon?  Sh.ite in my opinion.  Flatters to deceive and no end product.  Has pace and that's about it.

absolute tosh mate

[LFC1982]

Lennon's got bags of pace and would be a good liitle player down the right, he'd be better then Kuyt is on the right simply for attacking the full back and his pace would make it easier for Stevie and Xabi to put the diagonal balls in behind the oppo's defence but you would however lose a little defensively and our fullback becomes more exposed.

More goals then Kuyt?  Who knows

More Assists?  Probably

Are there better players we could get?  Probably but at what price? (£20m+)

And he's English and with the new rules in Europe it could be one of our better options!!!

[GYBS]

yeah lennon would be an option - he is better than pennant , for the last couple of seasons thou he been off the boil a lot - maybe needs a move to get him back how well he was playing two seasons ago . end product is better than pennants but still not perfect.

If we had lennon we would need to have a more defensive minded full back behind him.

would prob pay around 6-8 mil for him . but not sure spurs would sell.

[Judge]

that french director of spurs sales has sold almost all their best players, so who knows

im not an expert on pricing players, but i think 6 mill for lennon would be a fair price. also as you say, he is english, and that would be better for us with the euro player capping