Liverpool FC Forum

by **Zidane** » Sun Feb 15, 2009 9:50 pm

boodiddy1 wrote:i disagree. Makalele was not a controller of the midfield. He held it together like mascharano. At madrid, redondo first, then zizou and guti etc. At chelsea lamps controlled it. For france, zizou again and viera. Mascha is very similar to makalele, but for me, his aggression and tackling purity edge it for me.

But, thats why this is a discussion forum and not a bitching website:O

Well yeah, I didn't mean to compare him to a Zidane or a Lampard. I'm just comparing him to other holding midfielders, but yeah I still believe Makelele was better than Masch atm.

by **Owzat** » Thu Feb 19, 2009 4:34 pm

fittemod wrote:
Rorschach26 wrote:OMFG its unbelievable how some people talk about his shooting hes a DEFENSIVE midfielder thats his job in the team & theirs no 1 better then him in world football at it

"errr well Carras a world class defender hes an absolute rock at the back no1 hardly gets passed him............but hes overrated coz he never scores"

unbelievable

hmm there is a bit of difference between a midfielder not being prolific and a CB though, isn't there?
In my opinion Mascherano is a terrific midfielder but I wouldn't mind a few more goals form him but at least he's been having a few more shots at goal lately.

Being a DM shouldn't stop Mascherano scoring, any more than being a CB or FB should stop other outfield players posing a goal threat. But he isn't in the team primarily for that, however he does need to maintain possession better and pass better, sometimes I think having someone like Agger in that role would work equally well if not better.

It's funny how we say CBs aren't there to score, yet they can be quite a threat and come up with goals when the side really needs one - except our's (Sami possibly excepted)

Centre Back/Defender Goals (Premiership 08/09)

4 Vidic (Man Utd)
3 Johnson (Portsmouth)
3 Lescott (Bitters)
3 Turner (Hull)
3 Belletti (Chelsea)

Hyypia, Aurelio and Arbeloa have one Premiership goal each. And those listed have as many or more as most of our midfielders - Alonso (3), Riera (2), Babel (2), Benayoun (2), Mascherano (0), Plessis (0) and Lucas (0)

We should know better than most sides how annoying it is when the likes of Ferdinand, Vidic and O'Shea score. It shouldn't be their main role, but contributions of goals from those not in the side for scoring abilities can be as crucial as defensive contributions from attacking players. Some real threat from corners would be welcome, when did Carragher or Skrtel last (or ever) score from a corner? I'd almost be inclined to play Agger for his superior dribbling, passing and scoring ability. He could be just like Vidic or Ferdinand, same can't be said for the rest of our CBs - that's not to say they're no good as CBs, just not nearly as good in terms of all-round ability.

by **stmichael** » Fri Feb 20, 2009 2:05 pm

boodiddy1 wrote:He never scores? Neither did Makalele and the world and his dog raved about him (Me too). Yet, i honestly believe that when Mascha is at top form he is better than makalele ever was!!!

I never got the Makelele love in either, especially the belief that he almost invented that role. It's an absolutely ridiculous notion.

Makelele was basically a quicker but more limited version of Didi Hamman that happened to play alongside some great players. He didn't make them great and he wasn't great himself. He had one job and he did it well. Then again, so did Didi, and Didi also scored a few screamers aswell from time to time.

by **europian-kings** » Fri Feb 20, 2009 2:23 pm

i have a feeling he is going to regain his top form at old trafford after beign sent off there last season he needs to let sum frustration out.....
maybe it's worth getting him sent off in the final minutes breaking ronaldo, rooney, berbatov and countryman tevez's legs

Then maybe out 4 strikers won't seem as bad :buttrock

by **stmichael** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 12:36 pm

Why Mascherano, not Torres, is the real Benítez masterstroke
The Argentine rivals Claude Makelele as the best

Not often does the person sitting at home see more than the spectator in the stadium, but it happened on Saturday when Liverpool beat Manchester United at Old Trafford. A couple of minutes before the kick-off, while the television camera was lingering on the teams lining up in the tunnel, something happened that gave a fascinating portent of the upset to come.

We had just learnt that Alvaro Arbeloa, the Liverpool right-back, had tweaked a hamstring during the warm-up and would not be playing. Rafael Benítez had reconfigured his defence, moving Jamie Carragher from centre-back to fill Arbeloa's position and bringing in Sami Hyypia alongside Martin Skrtel. In the light of the lengthy preparations that would have gone into a fixture of this magnitude – not the match of the season, perhaps, but a very important one to both sides – this represented a serious adjustment.

What the roving camera in the Old Trafford tunnel showed was a little huddle at the rear of the Liverpool line. At the centre of a group of defenders Javier Mascherano was delivering an impassioned speech, complete with heated gesticulations. It was the sort of thing one might have expected to see from Steven Gerrard, the team captain, or from the vastly experienced Hyypia, his predecessor. Two hours later, however, Mascherano had given a display confirming my belief that he rivals Claude Makelele as the best exponent in modern British football of an art to which, even now, too little importance is attached.

Gerrard and Fernando Torres, who ran the United defence ragged and scored a goal apiece, won the battle of the headlines. But it was Mascherano who carved out the space and time in which they could play, as he had done the previous Tuesday night when Liverpool produced the second of their great performances of the season in routing Real Madrid. The first of those great performances came at Stamford Bridge in October, when Liverpool's midfield squeezed the life out of Chelsea and ended the west London club's run of 86 home league matches without defeat. The third came, of course, on Saturday – when, significantly, United took the field without an equivalent player. Mascherano's excellence was a thread running through all three games.

I first saw him in 2004, when he was 20 years old and winning an Olympic gold medal with an Argentina squad including Carlos Tevez and Gabriel Heinze. No one in Britain pays much attention to the Olympic football tournament, for the simple and patently inadequate reason that there are no British representatives. Other nations, however, take it extremely seriously, making it a good opportunity to see young talent on the way up. In Athens, Mascherano, who had made his senior debut for River Plate less than a year earlier, sat in front of the defence and controlled the traffic with a calmness and technical excellence reminiscent of Barcelona's Pep Guardiola.

Four years later in Beijing he was doing much the same thing, this time as an over-age player in a squad including Lionel Messi and Sergio Agüero. The impression was the same, and so was the result: another gold medal for a man who by this time had moved from River Plate to Corinthians in Brazil and thence to England, first to West Ham – where Alan Pardew saw fit to give him only seven appearances in half a season – before finding a home at Anfield.

Most people would probably claim that Torres is the best of Benítez's many expensive acquisitions, and the coltish striker is undoubtedly a wonderfully compelling performer who adds a sense of possibility to any match in which he takes part. But my choice would be Mascherano, a player who rose above a set of tangled transfer dealings and above the inability of his first English club to understand exactly what it is that he adds to a team. Benítez could see what Pardew failed to spot, and spent £18m on a player whose contribution is proving to be priceless.

In the absence of Xabi Alonso, his usual partner at the base of midfield, Mascherano's tackles, his interceptions and his distribution laid the solid foundation for Saturday's tumultuous victory. His competitiveness and his footballing intelligence were on full view as he fetched and harried with marvellous humility and unfailing relevance. Nobody writes poems about such players, but they should.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport....benitez

:buttrock

by **GYBS** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 12:41 pm

still find it amazing that some people dont rate the guy and think we can do better - he was a little off form earlier in the season but once again like so many players proves his worth

by **we all dream...** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 2:43 pm

I read this article on my lunch and headed striaght here knowing someone will have posted it. Good read and spot on my my opinion he has been the linch pin in our team on many of our better outings. As the article says he played fantastic in our best games of the season Chelsea away Madrid at home and ManUshited away. He could have been MoM in all three.

I've always liked him but this season, even the season before, he has shown he is vital to the team and a world class assett to the club. Looking back at the united sending off its quite funny realy, obviously it was well out of order and a disaster but looking back it shows his firey character in a bad light but this season he has shown he can mould it to his and the teams benefit.

by **stmichael** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 2:45 pm

I think it was fair to say that he struggled for a long time at the start of the season. Going to Olympics didn't help one bit, in the same way that Torres literally burnt himself out playing in the Euros aswell.

Good to see him back to his best though.

by **Argentinian** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 3:50 pm

Love Masch, he is a real monster and he gives all he has for his team. I will miss him in the next champions leg.

by **Toffeehater** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 4:59 pm

Mascherano is a beast , he's getting back to his best , last 2 games he was immense , never gave their midfield space , closed down well , his passing has seemed to improve and his workrate is immense . Great article St Mike , worth every fecking penny

by **meissler** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 4:46 pm

Mascherano is the man. He has really been shutting things down in the mid lately. I love his personality too.

by **account deleted by request** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 9:21 pm

Really glad to see that he finally seems to be getting his form back. He really seemed to struggle earlier in the season to show anything like the form he showed last season (as did Lucas and Babel the other players who went to the Olympics)I thought Masch AND Lucas had terrific games against the mancs.

by **dunc09** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 9:25 pm

should sell all the players there rubbish and sack the spanish waiter

by **Sabre** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 9:41 pm

I never saw Mascherano as poor this season, but I do see he's at a very top level again and I'm made up for him.

The team needs him, and besides needing his football capabilities, he has a great attitude, he seems to have a passion for the club, it's been one of the great successes that we can count on him. Worth the money we paid for him.

by **tubby** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 9:41 pm

He started of a bit slow this season but he is back to his best now imo. Good to see the media taking note also. I love how passionate he gets after an important win. If we are going to be league champions we need people like him.

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