Liverpool FC Forum

by **Torres25** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 2:42 pm

Spending what weve spent............weve spent about 30 million when u think about the money we have recouped this year

thats less then the mancs (again), chelsea(again), spurs(again), man city & round about the same as portsmouth & west ham

i still find it funny when people mention the money we have spent

by **stmichael** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 2:50 pm

The players should be f#cking ashamed of themselves, but the unfortunate thing is that Rafa is inevitably going to take the fall for this because it's easier to replace him than all the players who have so shamefully let him and us down.

by **Big Niall** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 2:54 pm

his record in the league over four years has been appalling - only goal difference stopping us from being 7th.

I think he has no idea what to do, he is hoping to hit on the winning combination. I will cheer as loudly as anyone against Inter Milan (okay, in a pub -not Anfield, but I'm foreign) and whatever games left this season.

The chances of winning the CL are slim - we can't EXPECT to win it or get to final every year but the league PROVES that he has never got to grips with the English game.

Like his signing Morientes - class in a foreign league, can't cope with the English one.

I don't care about the Barnsely game - the league proves he isn't making progress, going backwards in fact.

by **Big Niall** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 2:55 pm

Torres25 wrote:Spending what weve spent............weve spent about 30 million when u think about the money we have recouped this year

thats less then the mancs (again), chelsea(again), spurs(again), man city & round about the same as portsmouth & west ham

i still find it funny when people mention the money we have spent

Everton? Arsenal?

by **Feugo** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 2:56 pm

Carragher said we're not good enough :<
wtf man stop making me sad.

by **ConnO'var** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 2:57 pm

Sabre wrote:Despite puroresu thinks Rafa is a CL manager and not a premiership manager, the game is actually the same. Off sides, goals, the quality of the opposition counts and all that.

Valid point, Sabre..... The rules are the same.... but there is a difference to the type of game played however....

In the premiership, the cost of a draw is massive. You get only one point. That's why most weaker and mid table teams set up for a draw against us and try to hit us on the break. We have to try and break THEM down in order to get the 3 points.

In the Champions league however, this is not an issue as over 2 legs, both teams have to try to win and that suits our defensive style of play..... Especially against the stronger teams who will try to take the game to us..... With Benitez's astuteness in the defensive end game, this will always suit us as we hit them on the break..... We set up not to lose and force the other team to attack.... That's why we tend to do better against the attack minded teams in the Champions League.... Against the weaker (or slower, older) teams who do the same as us, we run out of ideas as WE are then the ones who have to attack.

We are just not set up to take the game to the opponents in attack.... Of course there are always exceptions to the rule.... from time to time, we do let loose against the weaker teams..... but this is only once we get in front by one or 2 goals which forces the opponent to attack and leave space at the back for us to exploit.

This, IMHO, is why Rafa does well in the KO stages of the Champions League... and also why we struggle against weaker teams in the premiership.

Attacking football is not one of his strengths.

by **stmichael** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 3:01 pm

With Man utd and Chelsea, the two teams that have dominated British football since Rafa arrived at Liverpool? There is absolutely no reason why he should be expected to compete with these sides, other than from Reds' fans and the Media's over-expectations, which are rooted in Liverpool's extraordinary European success under Rafa.

Do not forget that since Rafa first arrived, Liverpool have been considerably more successful than Arsenal - they have finished above them for the last two seasons in the league (by 15 points in 2006), have won the Champions League and the FA cup, and been losing finalists in the Champions League and the Carling cup. This is an extraordinary overachievement for a manager who has been at Liverpool for 3 1/2 years.
But the real question is, when Man Utd have 8 players who cost more than £12m, and Chelsea have 10, why should Liverpool, who have 2 (Torres, Babel)be expected to compete over a full season? Why?

There is no reason, other than that Rafa's overachievement has raised the bar so high, people think we're now on a par with these teams. Well, over 38 games, we're clearly not. And people think Rafa should be sacked because of this? It's an absolute joke.

by **Boocity** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 3:02 pm

I really do not know what has gone wrong here, I wonder whether he has lost the respect of the players or the internal politics has got to him. I really do not know if he should be replaced or not, all I do know is that if he is our manager next year I will support him, if he is'nt whoever is here I will give them my full support because only one thing matters, Liverpool FC

by **Boocity** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 3:05 pm

Big Niall wrote:his record in the league over four years has been appalling - only goal difference stopping us from being 7th.

I think he has no idea what to do, he is hoping to hit on the winning combination. I will cheer as loudly as anyone against Inter Milan (okay, in a pub -not Anfield, but I'm foreign) and whatever games left this season.

The chances of winning the CL are slim - we can't EXPECT to win it or get to final every year but the league PROVES that he has never got to grips with the English game.

Like his signing Morientes - class in a foreign league, can't cope with the English one.

I don't care about the Barnsely game - the league proves he isn't making progress, going backwards in fact.

As a side point, I think Morrientes would have been a good partner for Torres, better than DK

by **The_Rock** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 3:10 pm

lakes10 wrote:Hamann still feels that us coming back and winning the CL had nothing to do with Rafa, he says it was down to two of our players picking the team up at half time, the two players being Jamie Carragher and Steven Gerrard.
he said they gave the team belief that that could turn it around when Rafa was just standing there saying nothing.

Let this put to the end the myth of rafa's brilliant motivation talk during halftime @ istanbul......

Rafa was never a motivator....he is just a coach....nothing more.

by **LFC2007** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 3:11 pm

Already discussing his fu.cking successor on the eve of one of our biggest games .

Pathetic.

Those endorsing Mourinho so enthusiastically -F.UC.K O.F.F.

You can spot those who haven't been to a game.

In summary, don't be such a bunch of cu.nts, we've got a game.

Tara.

by **JoeTerp** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 3:15 pm

stmichael wrote:With Man utd and Chelsea, the two teams that have dominated British football since Rafa arrived at Liverpool? There is absolutely no reason why he should be expected to compete with these sides, other than from Reds' fans and the Media's over-expectations, which are rooted in Liverpool's extraordinary European success under Rafa.

Do not forget that since Rafa first arrived, Liverpool have been considerably more successful than Arsenal - they have finished above them for the last two seasons in the league (by 15 points in 2006), have won the Champions League and the FA cup, and been losing finalists in the Champions League and the Carling cup. This is an extraordinary overachievement for a manager who has been at Liverpool for 3 1/2 years.
But the real question is, when Man Utd have 8 players who cost more than £12m, and Chelsea have 10, why should Liverpool, who have 2 (Torres, Babel)be expected to compete over a full season? Why?

There is no reason, other than that Rafa's overachievement has raised the bar so high, people think we're now on a par with these teams. Well, over 38 games, we're clearly not. And people think Rafa should be sacked because of this? It's an absolute joke.

it is a mission improbable, but its one in which the fans need to know can happen, which in itself doesn't make sense. Even though I am pro rafa, some points in your argument are flawed in where you chose the cut off, Alonso was cheap (not saying he was a bad signing) and neither was Kuyt. So if you add in them two plus Gerrard and Carra, and consider how much some of the players rafa has bought are worth now (proving rafa has the ability to improve a players value) the gulf in class is still there, but not as wide as readers would have been lead to believe from your post. Nevertheless, the task of winning the league against that kind of opposition under the same kind of money situaiton as we have been is still a mission improbable.

Another reason to keep Rafa around for at least one more year, is that he seems to be doing a fine job at improving the overall quality of the team year in and year out. Meaning that even if he does get sacked for having poor league tactics, the new successor will have a lot less to do in term of player movement (most likely just shrinking the squad and then trying to buy one REALLLy good wide player)

by **The_Rock** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 3:17 pm

s@int wrote:
nobybob wrote:
Feugo wrote:1 - Jose
2 - Hiddink
3 - Klinsman
4 - Southgate

Rafa has just had a massive vote of confidence over on RAWK 87% support him and think he should stay.

At last a bit of loyalty and common sense to balance out against the PEEWEES of the world. I an still shocked at some of the two faced so called fans here who have on many occasion called Moreen a CUN>T and now cry out for him. You might just as well be crying out for old whiskey nose himself as far as i am concerned!

It seems most mancs agree with RAWK as well

True....all my manure mates and colleagues hope that rafa stays with liverpool for life... :veryangry

by **The_Rock** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 3:20 pm

Sabre wrote:
Boocity wrote:
Reg wrote:Benetiz to stay, G&H out, then get rid of all the mediocre players who are holding us back.

Is'nt Rafa responsible for bringing in the mediocre players in the first place, what make you think he can offload them and get the right players in and not just another load of mediocrity.

Even when it comes to a mediocre player, Sissoko, he has sold more expensive than bought. Let alone Agger, probably a reference CB in top european football in Europe.

He'd sell more expensive than bought Alonso and Reina too. He had some eye to spot a player that didn't count on West Ham, Mascherano. No doubt some journo-fúckwit-pundit was writting about Mascherano that "he hasn't adapted to the pace and rythm of the premiership" back then. But here we go.

Ok, of course, then you have Kuyt who's been a failure. But I don't know how now Rafa can be denied the players in which he got it right.

If you think rafa is doing such a smashing job..then why do most of the ex-liverpool players are against rafa ? I have never witnessed so many ex-liverpool players being against our managers before ....

Even during houllier's last days here.....it was not like this.....during souness days it also wasn't like this....

:cool:

by **The_Rock** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 3:23 pm

Torres25 wrote:Spending what weve spent............weve spent about 30 million when u think about the money we have recouped this year

thats less then the mancs (again), chelsea(again), spurs(again), man city & round about the same as portsmouth & west ham

i still find it funny when people mention the money we have spent

Did you conduct an audit on the finance dept ? How did you come up with these figuares ?

Have you forgotten how much money was spent on tieing up some of our players on super long contract ? (Alonso....Reina). Did you take the signing on fees into consideration ?

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So who do you want to replace him ?

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