Liverpool FC Forum

Penguins wrote:

Greavesie wrote:

shabelle50 wrote:Benitez gave up on fourth some time ago. After the Wigan game when he said "It doesn't matter what people think about what I said before". The team is functionless and without direction.

and that's Rafa's fault

In all honesty though we need investment in the squad, not just a new manager - I dont think that alone would get us back into the top four

Thank you. Another person that realises that.

Rafa has had around 12-15 million a season on average to spend before sales. That in my book is not a lot and the club would make big money if all players he bought would be sold. That means he has increased the value of the squad.

Yes, Aqualiani was a mistake, but I don't know if it was solely up to Rafa or if he got bad advice.
But 0 spend that last couple of years vs teams chansing us like City who has spend twice what Rafa has spent during his whole tenure, in those 2 years just spells doom no matter who manage.
The Keane money and Alonso money just went into thin air and the Aquilani transfer will probably eat into the summer transfer budget since we had no money last summer....

Yes, Rafa plays boring negative and seems to learn very slowly from mistakes but this team needs investment!
Torres will be injured a couple of months every season, that seems to be the norm since he is always playing both for club and country. And a new manager will not change the fact that we have Ngog as the replacement and a new manager will not help Ngog put the ball into the net.

Rafa has spent  £228,976,000
i dont give a if it come from sales or he got it from begging on the streets, the fact stands he spent that money to build the team we have today.......waste of money

he is the only one that has got it wrong.

lakes10 wrote:this is how Rafa is making our best players feel

Torres Gerrard reaction

lakes10 wrote:

lakes10 wrote:this is how Rafa is making our best players feel

Torres Gerrard reaction

Gerrard's reaction says it all, i just wonder what he was thinking at that point.

yes i do fear that if Rfa stay at the club then we will see the end of top players at our club, but i am so sure that he will not be here next year.

its all just a big mess Lakes it really is, the dark clouds are well and truly over Anfield, new owners and manager are on my Chirstmas list 

bigmick wrote:People can dress it up all they like in a final desperate attempt to hang onto a hope that they may actually not have been hopelessly wrong all along, but it won't wash. 20,000 words couldn't sum it up any better than the facial expressions of Torres and Gerrard yesterday, even Lucas looks slightly nonplussed by the whole situation (even more so than usual).

The inescapable conclusion from the reaction of our two best players and one of our worst, is that the players are wondering what the fecking hell the manager is up to this time. Had N'gog managed to score with the numerous chances which fell his way after he came on (amazing what happens if you attack in numbers) we'd have had to endure some of these numpties telling us it was a stroke of tactical genius. IT MAKES NO DIFFERENCE WHETHER N'GOG SCORES OR NOT, IT WAS A FECKING RIDICULOUS CALL. They told us years back that when Gerrard was inexplicably dragged off whencontrolling the game single handedly against Everton that it was tactical genius. That was because Lucas had a shot which resulted in a handball thirty seconds from time. They told us it was genius when we played a ridiculous team at Pompey last season, before bringing our best players off the bench and winning it with two goals in the last three minutes.

It wasn't genius, it was ridiculous. If you persist in making ridiculous decisions, sooner or later they will backfire.

agreed

It's as if Rafa's handing out the feckin ammunition - he hasn't learnt at all, six years and he STILL makes the same mistakes he's always made

I can see him reading this and thinking 'I'll prove you wrong one day' then persist in doing the same things he always has

In case you are reading this Rafa - do one 

Scottbot wrote:

EmeraldRed10 wrote:It's also interesting how not a single one of you is yet to name a viable suitor that is up to the task of running this rat infested ship; one that will require little to no funds to land the title, or even to usurp the current top four, not to mention the likes of City who will be intent on spending at least another 100 million come the summer.

Emerald it's just as interesting to me how not one of you (hate to use pro/anti terminology) seems to EVER be willing to acknowledge any of the mistakes (see below) Rafa has made over the course of this season. It's like you (and a few others) are happy to gloss over them NO MATTER WHAT. Yesterday's substitution of Torres is a prime example. Depsite the exasperation on the faces of our two best players, despite the fact we drew a game we desperately needed to win and despite the fact it was Torres's replacement (Ngog) who missed three golden chances, I still have to read how 'we played much better once the sub was made', and 'Torres body language was all wrong from the start'.

Forget the owners and the money and the other stuff you would normally shift the debate towards for a moment. I'm not belittling them but I'd love it if you (and Benny, Lando + anyone else who still feels Rafa is the man for the job) would please address the following areas in debate. To be honest I think the failure to even acknowledge Rafa's failings in terms of selection of personnel (based on what he has), tactics on match days, substitutions and perhaps most of all, our depressing style of football this season by some of the posters on this board is as much to blame for the arguments that go on as anything else you could point your finger at.

1/ Rafa's substitutions. Always so late in the game, often he has failed to use them all in matches this season despite the fact we have desperately needed to win them. How many times has he brought on a skill player with 6-7 minutes left in a game we need to win? I mean what's the point? It's nonsensical at times.

2/ Sticking with players who are so clearly struggling for form. Usual suspects Lucas, Insua and Kuyt spring to mind but Ngog played a long stretch this season as an impotent replacement for Torres while Babel sat on the bench chewing his finger nails.

3/ A complete reluctance to try something different. We've plodded on ALL SEASON with the same ideas. The two defensive midfielders, playing Gerrard in the hole despite the fact it only seems to work for him there when TORRES IS PLAYING AHEAD OF HIM. Playing one up front 95% of the time when we are struggling to score goals, unwilling to give a youngster like Pachecho a game when all else seems to be failing.

4/ Injuries - This one does my head in the most. Please comment on the injury problems suffered by our rivals this season. The mancs played a Champions League game earlier this season with no centre-halves (they won the game 3-0), they have lost Vidic and Ferdinand for much pretty much a whole season between them, Hargreaves hasn't played, Rafael has struggled and Owen is lost for the season + Van De Sar has missed chunks. Arsenal have just lost Gallas and Fabregas (who has been in and out all year), Van Persie has missed most of the year, Eduardo has been out, Rosicky has missed time, same goes Almunia and there only fit forward for a few weeks was Arshavin, they have been so desperate Sol Campbell has been playing centre-half! Chelsea have lost Essien for the season, had the African Nations Cup to contend with, Carvallho has missed time, Ashley Cole is out and Joe Cole hasn't been on it all year. TELL ME OUR SITUATION HAS BEEN ANY WORSE THAN ANYBODY ELSE'S. IT HASN'T.

5/ Last point. Aquilani. Need I say anymore.

Scott this is a brilliant post mate, and you are absolutely on the money with your assertion that the refusal of some parties to accept even the glaringly obvious has destroyed the board as a decent way to spend a few minutes. Not only will some of them not accept what is as plain as the nose on their face, but they abuse people while they're denying it.

All your points are salient, but I definately wouldn't hold your breath on getting any answers or any concessions. I sense some frustration in your posts. You'll get used to it are the only words of comfort I can offer  .

Greavesie wrote:

lakes10 wrote:

lakes10 wrote:this is how Rafa is making our best players feel

Torres Gerrard reaction

Gerrard's reaction says it all, i just wonder what he was thinking at that point.

yes i do fear that if Rfa stay at the club then we will see the end of top players at our club, but i am so sure that he will not be here next year.

its all just a big mess Lakes it really is, the dark clouds are well and truly over Anfield, new owners and manager are on my Chirstmas list