Liverpool FC Forum

by **Big Niall** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 12:02 am

While we can point to a few good signings (torres,alonso,Reina) I think we haven't got good value for the amount of money he has spent.

babel,kuyt and Lucas were close to 30m between them. One top player would be better and the fact that after 5 years in charge he is playing Voronin as centre forward is terrible (Kuyt was bought for 13m to be a centre forward, and Keane was bought and sold for a 10m loss in 6 months to be one and he seems to have a personal issue with Crouch as he just stopped picking him.)

He wanted to sell Alonso for 10m just over a year ago as part finance for....Gareth Barry (not fit to lace Alonso's boots) and now we havee to do without Alonso.

by **tubby** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 12:03 am

You can't give Rafa a weak squad and then give him stick. Feck sake had he spent 20mil per player that would be different but he has been trying to compete with the league leaders on a budget for god knows how long, and with muppet owners. It's not fair to judge him like that.

by **Poolinc.** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 12:04 am

this rafa love-in is doing my head!! Its really like the emperors new clothes!! the man is a con man! he has made terrible buys, terrible tactical decisions and terrible substitutions!! Liverpool will never win the title with him in charge! never!! How long are you willing to give him??? He has to go now! Even now its probably too late to salvage anything this season..... Bring back king kenny!

by **account deleted by request** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 12:09 am

bavlondon wrote:
s@int wrote:Don't try and tell me that we haven't a good enough team to challenge...... because we have. Its about doing whats best for LFC and if Rafa can't get the best out of the team maybe its time we started looking for someone who can. When Rafa came he was chosen because he was supposedly a manager who could win the title WITHOUT spending big money. He couldn't manage that, but he as since HAD big money and we are left with a good team but a very weak squad.

If we are not suddenly going to get showered with money, maybe we should (AT THE END OF THE SEASON) give someone else a go. We have one of the worlds best goalkeepers, one of the worlds best defensive midfielders, THE BEST PLAYER IN THE WORLD and the best striker in the world and yet we can't win games?

Something is going wrong somewhere and imo Rafa makes too many mistakes for a top team like we are.

We have a good enough first 11, but beyond that we struggle.

So why have we lost so many games this season when we are at full strength or almost full strength ?

by **da9thkill** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 12:10 am

i havent read the the whole thread, however i wouldnt get steve bruce, hes a goodmid table manager but not a great manager, big difference. wouldnt go for mourinho, too expensive, and i dont see him betraying cheski. if i were to choose i give a pop at slaven bilic. i know he didnt qualify but i do think if he had a full strength team, they would have qualified, a bit like missing rooney (i do hate hes guts) for england. hell be cheap and itll be a more attacking liverpool team.

i still think we should wait till the end of the season, and IF it was a poor season then sack and get a new one

by **LFC2007** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 12:11 am

Mick mentioned something in another thread that if Rafa were at another big club, the fans would long since have lost patience with him. I see that as a massive virtue that will be instrumental in ensuring the long-term future of the club. A culture of inclusivity, understanding and patience for those who need it most - and for those deserving - will generally provide for a stronger platform for success than any fad culture driven by the need for instant gratification.

If we can accept that Rafa desperately wants to do his best for the club - his club, our club - in a pretty desperate situation, and if we accept the reality that he is our manager and is quite probably going to be our manager for the rest of the season, then it follows we should get behind him and the team until any decision is ever made that alters that state of affairs. Optimism is part of realism because you don't pull yourself out of the sh!t by dwelling on the negatives.

by **NANNY RED** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 12:11 am

Poolinc. wrote:this rafa love-in is doing my head!! Its really like the emperors new clothes!! the man is a con man! he has made terrible buys, terrible tactical decisions and terrible substitutions!! Liverpool will never win the title with him in charge! never!! How long are you willing to give him??? He has to go now! Even now its probably too late to salvage anything this season..... Bring back king kenny!

So you want to bring in a lad who hasnt managed for 12 years , You wanna bring in a lad who is hero worshipped here for him to put his head on the choppin block with these two have his character assasinated by them yeh right , leave Kenny well alone mate, Hes battled his demons without coming back for seconds ,

by **Penguins** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 12:11 am

s@int wrote:Don't try and tell me that we haven't a good enough team to challenge...... because we have. Its about doing whats best for LFC and if Rafa can't get the best out of the team maybe its time we started looking for someone who can. When Rafa came he was chosen because he was supposedly a manager who could win the title WITHOUT spending big money. He couldn't manage that, but he as since HAD big money and we are left with a good team but a very weak squad.

If we are not suddenly going to get showered with money, maybe we should (AT THE END OF THE SEASON) give someone else a go. We have one of the worlds best goalkeepers, one of the worlds best defensive midfielders, THE BEST PLAYER IN THE WORLD and the best striker in the world and yet we can't win games?

Something is going wrong somewhere and imo Rafa makes too many mistakes for a top team like we are.

But we crumble at even the slightest of injuries as our depth is non existant.
Gerrard is gone and Torres is not even close to 100%.
Our 2 best players, not to mention our 17 million rb is incapacitated.
The replacements are players like Degen, Voronin, Babel, etc.
And I say the squad is not good enough to challenge if we have poor luck with injuries.

But the team we put out on the field right now maybe isn't better when it is producing?

Degen... do i need to say more
Carra going downhill
The Greek 1,5 million....
Lucas and Masch. 2 dmc offers little going forward
Kuyt alias mr no skill
A 70% fit Torres

And I know it is like talking to a wall sometimes but when it comes to spending Rafa has been allowed to spend big one year, the rest maybe even less than under Moores.

It's isn't if you have the best player in the world that is going to decide if you win titles, it is if you have proper backup when that player is injured...

I still maintain that there aree very few managers right now that could do a better job with the resources he has at his disposal.
With Gerrard and Torres off the team is filled freebies and -10 million players and that will never get you anywhere in todays
harsh football climate...

by **account deleted by request** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 12:14 am

Penguins wrote:
s@int wrote:Don't try and tell me that we haven't a good enough team to challenge...... because we have. Its about doing whats best for LFC and if Rafa can't get the best out of the team maybe its time we started looking for someone who can. When Rafa came he was chosen because he was supposedly a manager who could win the title WITHOUT spending big money. He couldn't manage that, but he as since HAD big money and we are left with a good team but a very weak squad.

If we are not suddenly going to get showered with money, maybe we should (AT THE END OF THE SEASON) give someone else a go. We have one of the worlds best goalkeepers, one of the worlds best defensive midfielders, THE BEST PLAYER IN THE WORLD and the best striker in the world and yet we can't win games?

Something is going wrong somewhere and imo Rafa makes too many mistakes for a top team like we are.

But we crumble at even the slightest of injuries as our depth is non existant.
Gerrard is gone and Torres is not even close to 100%.
Our 2 best players, not to mention our 17 million rb is incapacitated.
The replacements are players like Degen, Voronin, Babel, etc.
And I say the squad is not good enough to challenge if we have poor luck with injuries.

But the team we put out on the field right now maybe isn't better when it is producing?

Degen... do i need to say more
Carra going downhill
The Greek 1,5 million....
Lucas and Masch. 2 dmc offers little going forward
Kuyt alias mr no skill
A 70% fit Torres

And I know it is like talking to a wall sometimes but when it comes to spending Rafa has been allowed to spend big one year, the rest maybe even less than under Moores.

It's isn't if you have the best player in the world that is going to decide if you win titles, it is if you have proper backup when that player is injured...

I still maintain that there aree very few managers right now that could do a better job with the resources he has at his disposal.
With Gerrard and Torres off the team is filled freebies and -10 million players and that will never get you anywhere in todays
harsh football climate...

I ASK AGAIN .....So why have we lost so many games this season when we are at full strength or almost full strength

by **NANNY RED** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 12:15 am

LFC2007 wrote:Mick mentioned something in another thread that if Rafa were at another big club, the fans would long since have lost patience with him. I see that as a massive virtue that will be instrumental in ensuring the long-term future of the club. A culture of inclusivity, understanding and patience for those who need it most - and for those deserving - will generally provide for a stronger platform for success than any fad culture driven by the need for instant gratification.

If we can accept that Rafa desperately wants to do his best for the club - his club, our club - in a pretty desperate situation, and if we accept the reality that he is our manager and is quite probably going to be our manager for the rest of the season, then it follows we should get behind him and the team until any decision is ever made that alters that state of affairs. Optimism is part of realism because you don't pull yourself out of the sh!t by dwelling on the negatives.

TOP TOP POST :nod

by **account deleted by request** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 12:19 am

LFC2007 wrote:Mick mentioned something in another thread that if Rafa were at another big club, the fans would long since have lost patience with him. I see that as a massive virtue that will be instrumental in ensuring the long-term future of the club. A culture of inclusivity, understanding and patience for those who need it most - and for those deserving - will generally provide for a stronger platform for success than any fad culture driven by the need for instant gratification.

If we can accept that Rafa desperately wants to do his best for the club - his club, our club - in a pretty desperate situation, and if we accept the reality that he is our manager and is quite probably going to be our manager for the rest of the season, then it follows we should get behind him and the team until any decision is ever made that alters that state of affairs. Optimism is part of realism because you don't pull yourself out of the sh!t by dwelling on the negatives.

But if you don't accept and learn from your mistakes you will never progress. We are making the same mistakes now as we have made before much to our cost.

by **DAV** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 12:20 am

ok forget the past what ever your think of rafa. the end of last last season. what did he have to spend what did he have to sell and what did he actually do.
as with the premiership, your either a player or one of the rest
and this season has he made the right choices?
in transfers, tactics, etc
because as we all no with teams such as leeds one season can destroy a football team

by **account deleted by request** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 12:24 am

The problem is the clock is running and time is running out. Last season we lost a great servant and player in Hyypia. Its starting to look like Carra is running out of time now....... and what happens when we need to replace Gerrard.

by **NANNY RED** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 12:24 am

Anyway im goin to bed ive got an headache, Goodnight an god bless everyone, :;):

by **The Real Deal** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 12:26 am

bavlondon wrote:You can't give Rafa a weak squad and then give him stick.

Come off it mate!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Do you know anything about football!!!!!!!

??

WHO GAVE RAFA HIS SQUAD THIS SEASON!!

???

JESUS!

This is Rafa's squad, players picked by him!!!!

He has let quality like Alonso, Sissoko, Garcia, bellamy, Crouch, Pennant, Keane, all go through the door and keep the likes of Lucas, Voronin, N'gog, etc stay playing for us.

No one but RAFA is responsible.

If fearing now, the likes of Tores or even stevie going to REAL MADRID come the summer!

people started getting well cheesed off with Houllier after three seasons, this is rafa's sixth.

If we do happen to lose to lyon this week

Season is over, totally.!

rafa has to be hel accountable.

his tactics are too defensive. Lucas, mascharano holding !?

its the " we are scared to get beat " formation " iMo.

enough is enough.

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