LYON VS LIVERPOOL - Wednesday 4th november
by Rush Job » Tue Nov 03, 2009 7:58 pm
LFC2007 wrote:JoeTerp wrote:if you don't want to play Carra or Darby at RB, I guess your only option is:
Reina
Carra El Greco Agger
Kuyt Mascherano Lucas Insua
Yossi
Torres N'gog/Babel
bench: Cavalieri, Darby, Ayala, Aquilani, Ngog/Babel, Voronin, Spearing/Plessis
bring on Aquilani for Lucas if we are drawing, bring on Aquilani for Mascherano if we are losing.
I don't like the look of that at all. I'd much sooner see Darby come in than that (even though I think he's unlikely to make the breakthrough long-term). Primarily because three at the back is generally much riskier than four at the back (it's more than just a single change in player, it's a complete change in system that exposes the CBs to threats from different angles and there's a high risk of getting done in the channels, and so new demands, and that also applies to the wingers who have to be especially aware of activity in behind), but also because because it would maintain Carra and Agger as the central partnership and see Kyrgiakos dropped.
Agreed, that was more or less what I was about to say. Our problems this seasonn have came because we have had to play new or inexperienced players as well as changing the system, to play 3 at the back AND include Kyriacos (yeah I havent bothed to check the spelling either) would be suicide imo.
Not because I think the Greek is sh!te or anything like that but to play that system the players need to be drilled in their role and know each others games in side out.
Plus we wouldnt be able to squeeze the play because you cant play and effective offside trap with three at the back.
Joe no matter who is availiable for sellection you allways (seems that way atleaset) go for that system, why?
Last edited by Rush Job on Tue Nov 03, 2009 7:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Of stupid fools who stand in line...... Like..
Of stupid fools who stand in line...... Like..
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by Rush Job » Tue Nov 03, 2009 8:00 pm
Not having a pop mateyust wondering like.
Dont judge a book by the cover, unless you cover just another, because blind exceptance is a sign,
Of stupid fools who stand in line...... Like..
Of stupid fools who stand in line...... Like..
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by Kash_Mountain » Tue Nov 03, 2009 8:04 pm
Note: As work as been extremely busy these past few days, i've not had a chance to keep up with news relating to our club.
Sorry if the answer has already been posted elsewhere, but I keep hearing (radio mostly) that there are at least 12 players injured at the moment, mostly 1st teamers. I know Gerrard, Torres and Reira- who else?
Gotta say, if this many players (especially if mostly 1st teamers) are injured, i'm F*king worried........... We need big games from the likes of Lucas (or is he injured as well)?
Sorry if the answer has already been posted elsewhere, but I keep hearing (radio mostly) that there are at least 12 players injured at the moment, mostly 1st teamers. I know Gerrard, Torres and Reira- who else?
Gotta say, if this many players (especially if mostly 1st teamers) are injured, i'm F*king worried........... We need big games from the likes of Lucas (or is he injured as well)?
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by NANNY RED » Tue Nov 03, 2009 8:05 pm
Fecking mortified here that Fabio an Johnson have pulled out an all. 
Anyone going take your boots,
But do you know what it has shut some of them fecking idiots up who were suggesting Rafa left a load out on Saturday against Fulham just so they could rest an play in the Champions league, Egg on face time there in it.
Anyone going take your boots,But do you know what it has shut some of them fecking idiots up who were suggesting Rafa left a load out on Saturday against Fulham just so they could rest an play in the Champions league, Egg on face time there in it.
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by kazza » Tue Nov 03, 2009 8:29 pm
No doubt they will be confident when they see our injury list, the fact they beat us at home and I do not think they will have the dicipline to sit back and defend in front of their fans, so they will go for the win which will play into our hands. I think we will win as at Anfield they looked quite average. 2-0 to the good guys.
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by NANNY RED » Tue Nov 03, 2009 9:26 pm
IMO Darby has to play , i dont want Carra at right back,Put a good young right back in his natural position, . the lad will give it everything hes got , An Javier has to be the main man tomorrow, If he ticks the boys will win, big big game for our little chief tomorrow,
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by NANNY RED » Wed Nov 04, 2009 12:16 am
From The Times November 4, 2009
Rafael Benítez wants side to think of Marseilles in Lyons’ den
Tony Barrett
When you have performed a high-wire act as often as Rafael Benítez has, it is perhaps understandable that an ability to maintain your balance when everyone else is waiting for you to fall flat on your face breeds a belief that you may never need a safety net.
The Liverpool manager’s renowned ability to defy even a seemingly inevitable plunge will be put to arguably its greatest test at the Stade Gerland tonight. Should his team be beaten by Lyons, their Champions League aspirations for this season will probably come to a crashing end, shaking the stability of the Spaniard’s position like never before.
It was the certainty of past successes, not the possibility of future failure, that occupied Benítez’s mind last night, though, as he refused to look down from his increasingly precarious position. Call it win or bust; do or die; or sink or swim, these are the situations that he appears to revel in, as evidenced by an extensive back catalogue of logic-defying escapes that even Harry Houdini would admire.
“We have spoken about the Marseilles game,” Benítez said of Liverpool’s famous visit to France in December 2007, when they needed a victory to ensure qualification for the knockout stage and came up with an emphatic 4-0 win. “We have experience of having to win these types of games. We can take the belief and confidence from those good memories.
“Because we have experience, we try to manage when we are under pressure. It’s easy for a manager when you are winning, but when you are under pressure you have to show character, you try to analyse things and be calm. If you are nervous, you make mistakes. We have experience of the way we need to do things.
“We are very positive but we know it is a difficult situation. We have to have belief we can do it because we have done it in the past. We respect Lyons, but we have to do our job and play well and win.”
The predicament Liverpool find themselves in this time around is made much more stark by the fact that they are in the midst of a crisis not only of form but of fitness. Fernando Torres will start tonight’s match despite Benítez’s confirmation that the forward is suffering from an inguinal hernia, as revealed in The Times yesterday.
If Torres was Benítez’s only fitness concern he would have little to complain about but he is also without several senior members of his squad — including Steven Gerrard, Albert Riera, Glen Johnson and Fábio Aurélio — as well as several more fringe players, a situation that will result in a makeshift side taking to the field for a crucial fixture.
“We had the injuries and we had the virus, too,” Benítez said. “It’s not easy. We maybe haven’t had this amount of players missing at the same time.
“We have good players, but too many injuries. If you think of any top sides in the world and you lose four or five players who would start and four or five players who are on the bench, then it would be a struggle. We know something is going on now, bad luck or injuries or whatever, and when we have the likes of Gerrard, Torres, Riera and Johnson all available, everything will change.
“All the Liverpool players are ready to play. It doesn’t matter if it’s Torres or anyone else. The team spirit, workrate, mentality is very good. We are still working very hard.”
Daniel Agger, who has suffered from a back injury, and Alberto Aquilani, who has had a virus, trained last night, with the Denmark defender most likely to be involved from the start, but given Liverpool’s present plight, Benítez would not rule out the possibility of giving the Italy midfield player his full debut, even in such a high-pressure fixture.
“We will see how Aquilani trains,” Benítez said. “It’s something we have to discuss. We analyse every player. It’s possible he can play from the start, why not? Agger is doing well and we will see how he is also.”
Benítez knows he is under pressure but, other than on Saturday, when the cold weather at Craven Cottage did not stop him from sweating visibly as Liverpool slumped to a 3-1 defeat against Fulham, he is not showing it.
“Always, if you walk through a storm, you hold your head up high,” the Liverpool manager said, borrowing a line from a certain terrace anthem. The golden sky may be some way off but, for the time being at least, Benítez would be more than happy not to be blown from his tightrope.
Rafael Benítez wants side to think of Marseilles in Lyons’ den
Tony Barrett
When you have performed a high-wire act as often as Rafael Benítez has, it is perhaps understandable that an ability to maintain your balance when everyone else is waiting for you to fall flat on your face breeds a belief that you may never need a safety net.
The Liverpool manager’s renowned ability to defy even a seemingly inevitable plunge will be put to arguably its greatest test at the Stade Gerland tonight. Should his team be beaten by Lyons, their Champions League aspirations for this season will probably come to a crashing end, shaking the stability of the Spaniard’s position like never before.
It was the certainty of past successes, not the possibility of future failure, that occupied Benítez’s mind last night, though, as he refused to look down from his increasingly precarious position. Call it win or bust; do or die; or sink or swim, these are the situations that he appears to revel in, as evidenced by an extensive back catalogue of logic-defying escapes that even Harry Houdini would admire.
“We have spoken about the Marseilles game,” Benítez said of Liverpool’s famous visit to France in December 2007, when they needed a victory to ensure qualification for the knockout stage and came up with an emphatic 4-0 win. “We have experience of having to win these types of games. We can take the belief and confidence from those good memories.
“Because we have experience, we try to manage when we are under pressure. It’s easy for a manager when you are winning, but when you are under pressure you have to show character, you try to analyse things and be calm. If you are nervous, you make mistakes. We have experience of the way we need to do things.
“We are very positive but we know it is a difficult situation. We have to have belief we can do it because we have done it in the past. We respect Lyons, but we have to do our job and play well and win.”
The predicament Liverpool find themselves in this time around is made much more stark by the fact that they are in the midst of a crisis not only of form but of fitness. Fernando Torres will start tonight’s match despite Benítez’s confirmation that the forward is suffering from an inguinal hernia, as revealed in The Times yesterday.
If Torres was Benítez’s only fitness concern he would have little to complain about but he is also without several senior members of his squad — including Steven Gerrard, Albert Riera, Glen Johnson and Fábio Aurélio — as well as several more fringe players, a situation that will result in a makeshift side taking to the field for a crucial fixture.
“We had the injuries and we had the virus, too,” Benítez said. “It’s not easy. We maybe haven’t had this amount of players missing at the same time.
“We have good players, but too many injuries. If you think of any top sides in the world and you lose four or five players who would start and four or five players who are on the bench, then it would be a struggle. We know something is going on now, bad luck or injuries or whatever, and when we have the likes of Gerrard, Torres, Riera and Johnson all available, everything will change.
“All the Liverpool players are ready to play. It doesn’t matter if it’s Torres or anyone else. The team spirit, workrate, mentality is very good. We are still working very hard.”
Daniel Agger, who has suffered from a back injury, and Alberto Aquilani, who has had a virus, trained last night, with the Denmark defender most likely to be involved from the start, but given Liverpool’s present plight, Benítez would not rule out the possibility of giving the Italy midfield player his full debut, even in such a high-pressure fixture.
“We will see how Aquilani trains,” Benítez said. “It’s something we have to discuss. We analyse every player. It’s possible he can play from the start, why not? Agger is doing well and we will see how he is also.”
Benítez knows he is under pressure but, other than on Saturday, when the cold weather at Craven Cottage did not stop him from sweating visibly as Liverpool slumped to a 3-1 defeat against Fulham, he is not showing it.
“Always, if you walk through a storm, you hold your head up high,” the Liverpool manager said, borrowing a line from a certain terrace anthem. The golden sky may be some way off but, for the time being at least, Benítez would be more than happy not to be blown from his tightrope.
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by Owzat » Wed Nov 04, 2009 7:59 am
Despite Rafa having a reputation for success in Europe, his record is not that impressive.
P73 W40 D17 L16 (Won 54.79%)
Bear in mind FIVE of those wins were in the qualifying rounds we had to play in 05/06, in fact let's have a look at Rafa's record by stage.
Qualifiers : P14 W10 D2 L2 (Won 71.43%)
Group Stage : P33 W18 D8 L7 (Won 54.54%)
Last 16 : P10 W7 D0 L3 (Won 70.00%)
Quarter-Final : P8 W4 D3 L1 (Won 50.00%)
Semi-Final : P6 W2 D2 L2 (Won 33.33%)
Final : P2 W0 D1 L1 (Won 0.00%)
I've always maintained the competition starts "in earnest at the Quarter-Final stage", by then all the rubbish teams are gone and any of the bigger clubs left must have done something right. The record isn't bad, don't get me wrong, but it isn't great either. Only winning just over 50%, mostly in the earlier stages and still losing one in five is not great. In EIGHT semis and finals we've won just twice, one of those a much disputed goal by Luis Garcia (should have been a penalty but how many fans of other clubs would concede that technicality) QF's record is ok, a skin of the teeth, and looking nearly out on the night, win over Arsenal in 07/08, a home and away win over lesser opponents PSV in 06/07 and a slightly more convincing passage past Juve on the way to Istanbul in 04/05. Half those QF wins over a relatively weak side doesn't make for convincing reading.
This isn't the first time we've looked dodgy for qualification from the group stages, in fact we've often looked dodgy well before finally being found out (or not at all as in 04/05) We struggled past Standard Liege last season, in 07/08 we had one point from three games in the group stages and needed to win the last three and I doubt I need to remind anyone how we were 0-1 down at Anfield against Olympiakos. We weren't exactly comfortable in 2-1 aggregate wins over AK Graz in 04/05 and CSKA Sofia in 05/06, suffering home defeats and winning by one goal aggregates
So it's crunch time again, another run of wins needed to save Rafa's skin. Pains me to see the mancs and Chelsea are already through and Arsenal must only be one win away from joining them. Tonight might well decide if we join them, we should win in Hungary and at home to Fiorentina but then we should have beaten Lyon at home..................................... These days can we make predictions with any certainty, perhaps we should have match threads with a poll of the result (win, draw, lose) as a record
P73 W40 D17 L16 (Won 54.79%)
Bear in mind FIVE of those wins were in the qualifying rounds we had to play in 05/06, in fact let's have a look at Rafa's record by stage.
Qualifiers : P14 W10 D2 L2 (Won 71.43%)
Group Stage : P33 W18 D8 L7 (Won 54.54%)
Last 16 : P10 W7 D0 L3 (Won 70.00%)
Quarter-Final : P8 W4 D3 L1 (Won 50.00%)
Semi-Final : P6 W2 D2 L2 (Won 33.33%)
Final : P2 W0 D1 L1 (Won 0.00%)
I've always maintained the competition starts "in earnest at the Quarter-Final stage", by then all the rubbish teams are gone and any of the bigger clubs left must have done something right. The record isn't bad, don't get me wrong, but it isn't great either. Only winning just over 50%, mostly in the earlier stages and still losing one in five is not great. In EIGHT semis and finals we've won just twice, one of those a much disputed goal by Luis Garcia (should have been a penalty but how many fans of other clubs would concede that technicality) QF's record is ok, a skin of the teeth, and looking nearly out on the night, win over Arsenal in 07/08, a home and away win over lesser opponents PSV in 06/07 and a slightly more convincing passage past Juve on the way to Istanbul in 04/05. Half those QF wins over a relatively weak side doesn't make for convincing reading.
This isn't the first time we've looked dodgy for qualification from the group stages, in fact we've often looked dodgy well before finally being found out (or not at all as in 04/05) We struggled past Standard Liege last season, in 07/08 we had one point from three games in the group stages and needed to win the last three and I doubt I need to remind anyone how we were 0-1 down at Anfield against Olympiakos. We weren't exactly comfortable in 2-1 aggregate wins over AK Graz in 04/05 and CSKA Sofia in 05/06, suffering home defeats and winning by one goal aggregates
So it's crunch time again, another run of wins needed to save Rafa's skin. Pains me to see the mancs and Chelsea are already through and Arsenal must only be one win away from joining them. Tonight might well decide if we join them, we should win in Hungary and at home to Fiorentina but then we should have beaten Lyon at home..................................... These days can we make predictions with any certainty, perhaps we should have match threads with a poll of the result (win, draw, lose) as a record
Last edited by Owzat on Wed Nov 04, 2009 8:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
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by Owzat » Wed Nov 04, 2009 8:09 am
NANNY RED wrote:IMO Darby has to play , i dont want Carra at right back,Put a good young right back in his natural position, . the lad will give it everything hes got , An Javier has to be the main man tomorrow, If he ticks the boys will win, big big game for our little chief tomorrow,
The other problem with playing CBs out of position, besides not being used to the role and its requirements, is it strains the CB resources to. We have four CBs in Carra, Skrtel, Agger and Kyrgiakos, that means three would start which would increase the risk of injury, especially if Agger is just coming back from injury and playing Carra RB would leave Agger the obvious one of two CBs.
Need Mascherano to keep his head, no silly challenges and can someone have a word with him about his shooting. Every time he shoots I, and probably half or more of us, expect it to go high, wide or both. It's a waste of possession, give it to Agger if you want to shoot, or better still cover him and let him go forward with the ball to shoot
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by europian-kings » Wed Nov 04, 2009 9:27 am
Off to the pub for this one.
Had Chelsea to win in an accumilator last night for £360.
Trust it to be the man in my Sig to do the damage! lol.
I think it will be a very tight game with Lyon taking a lead about midway through, Kuyt will then grab an equaliser at around the hour mark before Torres shows his magic in the final 10.
Had Chelsea to win in an accumilator last night for £360.
Trust it to be the man in my Sig to do the damage! lol.
I think it will be a very tight game with Lyon taking a lead about midway through, Kuyt will then grab an equaliser at around the hour mark before Torres shows his magic in the final 10.
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by account deleted by request » Wed Nov 04, 2009 9:50 am
I am in optimistic mood that we will get a win tonight. We all know no one is better when the chips are down than Liverpool. Tonight is just one more chance to prove that to the rest of the world. Although even a draw tonight could be enough to see us through (?) I think we will win 1-2 although I would be a lot more confident if Gerrard was available.
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by made in UK » Wed Nov 04, 2009 9:57 am
Lyon Vs Liverpool XI
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