Liverpool FC Forum

[tonyeh]

What constitutes "negative" though?

If I said "We're going nowhere under the owners", does that bit of negativity get me a ban?

Or is it just reserved for the likes of "We're going nowhere under Benitez"

[parchpea]

I think Benitez will end up at Madrid the way its going and you couldnt blame him going there even if Liverpool where flying high. Home town team and all that, and one hell of a football club. Lets face it not many turn them down. I just think too much has gone on at Liverpool and its taken its toll on Benitez and everyone involved with the club. A fresh start will no doubt do him good and for us its a chance to start looking forward rather than back in anger at mistakes that have been made. Players, managers, they all come and go and all we do is look at whats presented too us and make the best of it through the good and the bad. Familiarity can breed contempt and on top of everything else going on around the club its all a bit too much and time for change next season.

[Benny The Noon]

The problem i have with what you post mick is the fact you do it in an arogant way and dismiss anyone who dares have a different view than yourself and try and demean what they say by using daft labels like Rafapologist ?? and then go on to try and blanket throw the people who want rafa to say and support the manager by saying we have lowered our sights and we are aiming to beat the likes of birmingham etc and that we are happy being down in 6th etc . Far from the truth - when having one of your little gospel posts take a look in the mirror . Just because we support the manager doesnt mean are sights are set any lower than yours and i find it quite insulting when you suggest as such.

[7_Kewell]

you know, i don't buy this whole "other clubs want him, so he must be good" attitude. Juande Ramos was 'wanted' by a whole host of clubs after his disasterous time at Spurs. He then went on to be pretty awful at Real and then the same at CSKA Moscow.

Rafa has had his chance here and it hasn't worked out. I wish him luck, but i won't be sorry he's gone.

[Big Niall]

He wasted 38m last summer on a full back and a crock. He could have bought any full back for a couple of million (no world beater required) and spent 35m on a world class forward e.g. Tevez to play beside Torres (With SG and Masch in the middle) and to score our goals during Torres's his many injuries.

Only SG and Torres score goals regularly and Torres is often injured and SG getting more injury prone with the years.

Did Benitez not even google Aqualini's fitness before he spent a fortune on him? Why spend the balance on a full back leaving us with only one (injury prone) forward who can actually score.

The man is incompetant and should be fired - I am sickened the owners don't have a clause saying they can fire him if he fails to qualify for the CL.

7th place is a disgrace and he should be ashamed, do the honourable thing and quit, but these types never do, he'll hang on , just like Fred the shred for a massive payoff for being useless. 

[LFC2007]

[Penguins]

Mick im not going to nitpick your post as it's only going to go in one ear and out the other. I was trying to find that other thread you made the other day but couldn't find it, anyway you only have to look at that to realise how negative you are at times.

And to everyone look around and ask yourself why is there so little football talk these days?

The thread where I pointed out that in my opinion Rafa was the owners ideal manager got merged with another thread which it had nothing to do with Bav. I'm not sure I can even remember what it was, but "merging" is the new "deleting" this season. If it's not merged, it's kicked into the long grass via a move into "Eurovision song contest general discussion" never to be seen again.

I accept my views were controversial, I said so at the time, but I still don't get how they were "negative". It's funny that although you could have swam around in the mouth foam, only LFC came up with a credible and reasonable argument against my thoughts.

Just to re-ieterate, my thoughts on the subject are:

The owners don't want to pay Rafa off sixteenmillion quid, because they are looking to sell the club and the money would be effectively down the drain (that is to say they couldn't just put up the price of the club by 16 mill to compensate).

Backroom staff-ditto.

Rafa can't criticise the owners from his position of relative prosperity via his contract and control over all things, and from his relative weakness due to our lack of success. He can't say "the squad is sh!t", because he bought them all, whereas a new manager may well say such a thing. He can't demand too much cash because the last few times he's had it he's squandered it, so giving the owners the perfect excuse to keep a tight grip on the purse strings.

Rafa splits the fans right down the middle (not on purpose, he just does) so therefore a lot of the criticism which would be directed at Hicks and Gillete gets diluted.

Rafa's lack of success gives the club what appears to be a potential upside for any new investor.

Rafa is an excellent manager in Europe, whichever competition we find ourselves in.


There, negative or just realistic? In the original post, if you'll remember I went on to say Hicks and Gillette probably have people on the Kop starting the Raffer-Raf-eye-elle chants so keen were they for him to stay. I DIDN'T REALLY MEAN THAT BIT, IT WAS A BIT OF IRONY TO DEMONSTRATE THE POINT.

Anyway, you obviously think that on the contrary, the owners would love to get rid of the manager which is fair enough. I don't agree with you, but I don't get where it makes me "negative".

But the owners want/need CL football to fill their coffers and maybe they think like you and believe any manager would still come "just cause of our great history and heck with the finances" then if RM comes along they don't need to pay the 16 million and look at CL football the next season with this new miracle worker.


And you really think a new manager would be allowed to critizise the owners...sigh. There will be no money just cause the manager changes, get that please. Which means it helps noone if a new manager comes in and says the squad is s**t as that is the squad he'll be stuck with.
And once again, just cause we get a new manager what makes you believe a new manager will be able to demand more or less cash than if Rafa was manager. Mindboggling really...
It is not like the owners are keeping a tight grip on the purse strings, THEY HAVE TO.

And it is because of anti Rafa supporters who fail to see the bigger picture we have that split with deflects the attention away from the vermin.

And yes, a lack of success appear to be a potential upside for a new investor, so why would the owners want him still here then??? That means it would be bad for them as their bargaining position gets worse!

[dawson99]

The pro Rafa also fail to see the bigger picture.

We need a manager who has actually put on the Liverpool shirt I say. And yes, we need those two yank kunts out ASAP

[Penguins]

But that is sentimental drivel really.
Souness had worn the red shirt and look where that got us.
Just cause you worn the shirt, doesn't mean it translates into success. It sentimental to mention Daglish and Carra as managers. Daglish hasn't managed for eons and we know nothing of Carra's skill as a manager and we can not afford to take a chance just cause he wore the shirt.

The bigger picture is that as long as the vermin are here there will be no investment in the team, be it the squad, the stadium or anything else which means the development of the club will at best stand still. With a new manager, an old manager or mother Teresa as manager.

Which means that there is no future for us as a top club anymore.

[crazyhorse]

Hang on... I am sure i have worn the shirt..... might apply!!

[dawson99]

Hang on... I am sure i have worn the shirt..... might apply!!

I'd give you the job mate

[crazyhorse]

But that is sentimental drivel really.
Souness had worn the red shirt and look where that got us.
Just cause you worn the shirt, doesn't mean it translates into success. It sentimental to mention Daglish and Carra as managers. Daglish hasn't managed for eons and we know nothing of Carra's skill as a manager and we can not afford to take a chance just cause he wore the shirt.

The bigger picture is that as long as the vermin are here there will be no investment in the team, be it the squad, the stadium or anything else which means the development of the club will at best stand still. With a new manager, an old manager or mother Teresa as manager.

Which means that there is no future for us as a top club anymore.

A bit pessamistic there mate. The "squad" is plenty good enough in its current form to do good things. Remember a squad inferior to this one won the Cl and reached another final as well in a very short space of time.

The players need to be moulded into a cohesive unit and play with freedom and confidence. The right man in charge would be a lift and improvement in itself.

[crazyhorse]

Hang on... I am sure i have worn the shirt..... might apply!!

I'd give you the job mate

Ah....I thank you!!

[tubby]

He wasted 38m last summer on a full back and a crock. He could have bought any full back for a couple of million (no world beater required) and spent 35m on a world class forward e.g. Tevez to play beside Torres (With SG and Masch in the middle) and to score our goals during Torres's his many injuries.

Only SG and Torres score goals regularly and Torres is often injured and SG getting more injury prone with the years.

Did Benitez not even google Aqualini's fitness before he spent a fortune on him? Why spend the balance on a full back leaving us with only one (injury prone) forward who can actually score.

The man is incompetant and should be fired - I am sickened the owners don't have a clause saying they can fire him if he fails to qualify for the CL.

7th place is a disgrace and he should be ashamed, do the honourable thing and quit, but these types never do, he'll hang on , just like Fred the shred for a massive payoff for being useless. 

Give me examples of full backs we could have aqquired for 'a few mil'. How often have we let our first target slip? So id love to hear some names Nial.

And as for spending 35Mil on a world class forward what if that player turned out to be a crock or a flop? The lingo would then be 'Rafa wasted 35Mil on a crock striker, we could have picked up a decent one for 15Mil'.

It's too easy to judge on highnsight. Maybe he was advised otherwise on Aquilani that his injury was fixed? Wasn't there talk at the time that he was mistreated by doctors in Rome? I don't know what goes on behind the doors at Melwood and neither do you so quit with the Nostradamus footy .

[dawson99]

But he wasnt told the injury was fixed, he said he wouldnt play til October.. and right back shouldnt have been a priority. Everyon on the planet knew we needed another striker