Liverpool FC Forum

[hello_red]

we need a 23 year old Totti or a Kaka type player.

We need some serious quality in the creative department. otherwise we will be left wanting every season!

Who do we buy who the knows. try a youngster in the role.

I defended Kuyt at the start of this season and he has let me down badly.

[Ace Ventura]

Crouch must play, he brings the best out of Torres and Gerrard. Other than that, he's capable of chipping in with goals, unlike Kuyt or Voronin.

how exactly does crouch bring the best out of Gerrard?  I can understand you arguing he's a good decoy for torres... but he brings the best out of Gerrard??? the mind boggles

I know you wasnt quoting me but felt i could reply anyway.
Crouch holds the ball up and lays it off for advancing midfield players, Gerrard has benefitted from this loads of times, namely last season home and away against Newcastle.

I would try and name further examples but the big man hasnt been given enough time on the pitch this season for their understanding to develop further.

[stmichael]

according to the mirror, we've opened talks with crouch over a new contract. stops him leaving on the cheap i suppose as he's only got 16 months left.

[Rockthekop]

I think if Crouch does get a contract it will be for that reason only (stop him going on the cheap).  I just can't see him being at Liverpool much longer.  Way too many average players at the club, it's time to be ruthless.

[Big Niall]

His not going to be wanted by a club as big as LFC but I wouldn't blame him if he joined a lesser team to get regular football.

I don't think he is good enough to play up front for a title winning team, he is decent and Man City or somebody like that would do well to buy him for £8m or so.

The fact that he is waaaay better than Kuyt and should be starting every game shouldn't confuse people that he isn't good enough to be a first teamer for a title winning team (maybe a squad player though)

[Reg]

Daily Telegraph today;

Peter Crouch starts Liverpool contract talks

England striker Peter Crouch has started negotiations over a new contract to stay at Anfield according to reports this morning.

Liverpool homepage | Football fans' forum
Crouch, 26, who has been picked for Liverpool's last two games by manager Rafael Benitez, has 16 months remaining on his current deal.

Rumours suggesting that Aston Villa coach Martin O'Neill was planning a move for the tall centre-forward this summer have prompted the Merseyside club to begin talks with the player.

A move to Villa Park would be familiar ground for Crouch, who spent three seasons in Birmingham where he scored just seven goals in 41 appearances following a £5 million move from Portsmouth.

Crouch joined Liverpool from Southampton in a £7 million transfer in July 2005 and initially struggled to make an impact, needing 19 games to score his first goal for the club.

Following the signing of Dirk Kuyt and Fernando Torres in successive seasons his opportunities have been limited but Crouch has scored eight goals this season.

However, Crouch may want to move away from Anfield in a bid to secure more regular football as he seeks to convince new England manager Fabio Capello that he can fit into the Italian's plans for the World Cup qualifying campaign beginning in the autumn.

[Owzat]

His not going to be wanted by a club as big as LFC but I wouldn't blame him if he joined a lesser team to get regular football.

I don't think he is good enough to play up front for a title winning team, he is decent and Man City or somebody like that would do well to buy him for £8m or so.

The fact that he is waaaay better than Kuyt and should be starting every game shouldn't confuse people that he isn't good enough to be a first teamer for a title winning team (maybe a squad player though)

Do Arsenal play a tall target man? Do Man Utd play a tall target man? Do Chelsea? No, of course they don't. Only some managers like MON, Houllier and it seems Rafa think a target man is the way to do things. What is the sign of a title winning side is the ability to score goals regularly and from all parts of the field, sadly our wide players contribute too few from there and only Gerrard scores enough from midfield. Torres is a one man show up front, we've played 40 games this season and Torres has scored 18 goals while the other two have managed 8 each - albeit they have played between 65% and 80% of the games.

Maybe we should give Crouch a run alongside Torres, more to put him in the shop window but also having a regular partner for Torres probably won't harm our end of season as much as the irregular shuffling has. Kuyt's first seven goals of the season came in the first 25 games of which he played 18 (11 of which he played the full 90 mins) Then he played only four full 90 mins in the next 13 games and didn't score until he played back to back 90 mins in the last couple of games

Crouch in contrast scored only once in the first 18 games of the season, playing the full 90 mins just three times. He's played four full 90 mins in the last nine games and scored four goals - he should have added to that tally yesterday. The point being when the players get the full 90 mins they score goals, even Torres' goalscoring dips when he doesn't play the full 90 - one goal in five appearances of under 60 mins, he doesn't often play less than 75 mins with 22 of his 29 appearances lasted 75 mins or more

[bigmick]

His not going to be wanted by a club as big as LFC but I wouldn't blame him if he joined a lesser team to get regular football.

I don't think he is good enough to play up front for a title winning team, he is decent and Man City or somebody like that would do well to buy him for £8m or so.

The fact that he is waaaay better than Kuyt and should be starting every game shouldn't confuse people that he isn't good enough to be a first teamer for a title winning team (maybe a squad player though)

Do Arsenal play a tall target man? Do Man Utd play a tall target man? Do Chelsea? No, of course they don't. Only some managers like MON, Houllier and it seems Rafa think a target man is the way to do things. What is the sign of a title winning side is the ability to score goals regularly and from all parts of the field, sadly our wide players contribute too few from there and only Gerrard scores enough from midfield. Torres is a one man show up front, we've played 40 games this season and Torres has scored 18 goals while the other two have managed 8 each - albeit they have played between 65% and 80% of the games.

Maybe we should give Crouch a run alongside Torres, more to put him in the shop window but also having a regular partner for Torres probably won't harm our end of season as much as the irregular shuffling has. Kuyt's first seven goals of the season came in the first 25 games of which he played 18 (11 of which he played the full 90 mins) Then he played only four full 90 mins in the next 13 games and didn't score until he played back to back 90 mins in the last couple of games

Crouch in contrast scored only once in the first 18 games of the season, playing the full 90 mins just three times. He's played four full 90 mins in the last nine games and scored four goals - he should have added to that tally yesterday. The point being when the players get the full 90 mins they score goals, even Torres' goalscoring dips when he doesn't play the full 90 - one goal in five appearances of under 60 mins, he doesn't often play less than 75 mins with 22 of his 29 appearances lasted 75 mins or more

Tell me this. I don't always agree with Owzat, particularly when his stats don't prove that I'm right  , but here he is statistically putting accross a point which surely all football fans would agree with. Strikers play better when they are given the chance to play together regularly, with the same partner. They play better when they play regularly, they get "match fit", get "sharp", and almost always (though not in the case of Kuyt unfortunately), their performance levels go up.

I've asked this question a million times. Are we now to beleive that Keegan and Toshack, Dalglish and Rush, Beardsley and Aldridge didn't actually have a telepathic understanding of what the other one was going to do? Is my mind playing tricks with me or did I see Toshack back head it into Keegans path, Dalglish pass it to Rush without looking, Beardsley do "the eyes" before slipping Aldridge in? Didn't those players play together regualrly, hone an understanding? TBPH, I'd even take a Torres/Voronin partnership if they were played in every game, together, to form a partnership.

[The_Rock]

When crouch plays...it only makes sense to play pennant. Rafa didn't do this yesterday and also against chelsea... So how do you expect him to score ?

There were hardly any worthwhile crosses for him from the right...Any other manager would have started pennant if he goes with crouch....But not rafa. Rafa has another tactic which only he understands... 

[LegBarnes]

we need a 23 year old Totti or a Kaka type player.

We need some serious quality in the creative department. otherwise we will be left wanting every season!

Who do we buy who the knows. try a youngster in the role.

I defended Kuyt at the start of this season and he has let me down badly.

mabye go in for silva (Valencia) prob get him for 18-24 mil he is top class plays up middle to wide left pacey great crosser like gerrard but more creative.

But i also would love to see us make a move for Sergio Aguero (at.Madrid) he looking like he gonna be one hell of a striker also can play wide as well(good for 4-3-3) massive pace and great when ball played to his feet (like torres) could see him as a good pace partner for torres plus only 19 years old.

Also i think we need a midfielder who can get forward more and score goals and young tallent i been looking at in spain also is Javi Martinez (Athletic Club Bilboa) he is looking good and think he will become a fair better player then alonso and lucas.

[john1992]

so this all falls down to raffa not playing the stratgies and the combinations to suit the players
and this has slowed down our goal tally to vurtually dregs.  Is that wat were all saying ?

[NANNY RED]

Could Crouch be now looking for a way out

Peter Crouch could add to Rafa Benitez's woes
By Andrew Warshaw
Last Updated: 12:05am GMT 17/02/2008




England striker Peter Crouch could add to Liverpool manager Rafa Benitez's problems by quitting the club while still under contract as a result of a landmark legal case that has been described by Fifa president Sepp Blatter as having "far-reaching and damaging effects".

The case has also opened the way for dozens of Premier League stars like Chelsea's Frank Lampard - despite Avram Grant's denial yesterday - to leave their clubs while still under contract.

   
All smiles: but for how much longer will Peter Crouch be at Anfield?
In what is regarded as the most dangerous precedent since the Bosman decision, which only applies to out-of-contract footballers, former Wigan defender Andy Webster was the first player to take advantage of Article 17 of Fifa's regulations on the status and transfer of players.

This effectively allows players to hand in their notice if they have fulfilled three years of a four or five-year contract and are under the age of 28. If they are over 28, they can do it after two years.

Webster invoked the escape route when he walked out on Hearts to join Wigan after being frozen out at the Edinburgh club when he refused to sign a new contract. He was ordered by Fifa to pay £625,000, but when the case went to tribunal the Court of Arbitration for Sport reduced the payment to a mere £150,000 which, it said crucially, reflected Webster's wages rather than his transfer value - a bitter blow to his former club who believed he was worth £4.6 million.

To add salt to Hearts' wounds, Webster spent only a few months at Wigan before moving back to Scotland and is now at Rangers.

Crouch, who is expected to be left out of Liverpool's starting line-up for this week's high-profile Champions League showdown against Inter Milan, is the latest big name to consider using the loophole.

The Sunday Telegraph understands that Crouch is carefully considering exploiting the ruling, one of several options open to the England striker whose current deal expires at the end of next season.

Although both Liverpool and Crouch's agent Jonathan Barnett refused to confirm that similar action was being taken by the player, it is understood that the threat of buying out his contract and leaving for far less than his market value is likely to form part of Crouch's negotiations.

Barnett said clubs had nothing to worry about if they behaved responsibly: "Certainly it will change the way things are conducted and we are probably heading for a period of shorter contracts. But I've never heard of a player volunteering to leave a club when he is happy and being well-paid." Whether Crouch is happy is another matter, however; he played yesterday, but has started only six Premier League games this season.

Although the rule applies only to cross-border transfers, Graham Shear, one of the country's top sports lawyers, says this was an unviable restraint and "would certainly be challenged".

[redhayesy]

imho i sincerly hope crouch starts on sunday! i think that although our formation
has been spot on in recent weeks, for me the derby is as, if not more important
this time round that this really is the 6 pointer! & crouch will defientley give us
so more of a threat in our attacking play for obivious reasons, that if we need
to or have to be more direct to win the game so be it!

i"m a big fan of crouch & would rather see him start the game, throw everything
at the bitters, rather than bring him on to try & change the game if things
don"t go to plan (feck, i don"t even what to think like this) but you know where
i"m coming from.
i predict a usuall derby encounter, fast, little space in midfield, little time
on the ball etc, which is why i would change the formation for this game.
not make wholesale changes, but imo i think the derby will always be a game
where i don"t care if we play well or not it"s the result that counts!!
3 points is all that matters on sunday, & for this game i think the bitters
will hate crouch"s ariel threat, i also think he could be a great provider
of knock downs etc.

btw does anyone think that if crouch doesn"t get more starts or
involvement between now & the rest of the season, he might
put in a transfer request in the summer?
i would sincerly hope not, but i do think in this day & age the
likes of crouch has to be playing on a regular basis for his own
sake as well as for his confidence, momentem etc, & what better
way than to get a starting place this sunday, as i think he can
handle the pressure of a derby game, also to get on the score
sheet sunday would enhance the above.
as for the formation sunday simple for me 4-4-2 come on red men!

[maypaxvobiscum]

who the hell told kuyt he could play soccer anyway
disgusting!

[Owzat]

Crouch didn't start, however he is bound to start one of the three games against Arsenal and I'm backing the league game. I think Rafa long since realised none of the strikers bar Torres was up to it and changed formation, that in itself has seen the chances of Crouch starting diminish. He said in the Times interview that the new system "makes it complicated for him".

There's no hope he'll dislodge Torres as the single striker in the formation and if he signs more strikers in the summer then it's curtains for Crouch unless they are as bad or worse than him. Crouch will leave in the summer I'm sure, he'll head to a team lower in the Premiership and that's the main reason he will want to stay. Any striker worth his salt would have asked to leave, especially if he's not playing regularly. Good luck to him, he did his best but it wasn't good enough for Liverpool. If he goes off to villa, pompey, bolton or hopefully everton, then he'll find his level and maybe improve his England chances (beyond benchwarming) It has to be the daftest signing based on theory ever, a tall striker to cause problems in the air - the main problem being he's often useless in the air amongst his other lacking qualities. That Rafa cannot find a use for him in the current system says it all, that he won't play 4-4-2 says it all about him and Kuyt