Pay Me Back - Peter Crouch Discussion

Liverpool Football Club - General Discussion

Postby mikopool » Tue Sep 18, 2007 12:14 am

But the England hitman is determined to show Benitez that he deserves to be a permanent fixture in the side.

"It has been frustrating," he said in The S*n. "Every footballer wants to play and the manager has told me it's not possible to be involved in every game.


Fox sports

Hope thats an error for Peter's sake.
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Postby Emerald Red » Tue Sep 18, 2007 12:57 am

You know what it is, Torres should play every single match, and I mean them all, if fit. I'm not sure if I've seen Torres and Crouch being paired, but on the evidence of Kuyt/Torres up front this season, and the odd game with Voronin, Crouch just does not seem to click with any he is put with. I say stick with Torres/Kuyt or Torres/Voronin as these are certainly our best options. To replace Torres in games for Crouch starting is just madness IMO, and would p*ss me off to see it happen often. I'd have to say, that Crouch is now a bench warmer.

Who knows, though. Maybe people's minds will change (including my own) once the CL starts. He could hit a good bit of form there and prove everyone wrong. We'll need him for the cups at least.
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Postby account deleted by request » Tue Sep 18, 2007 12:59 am

Crouch has looked out of sorts and off his game on the few occasions he has been picked this season. Maybe its a hangover from the end of last season when although our top scorer in Europe he was dropped for the final against Milan. Whatever the reason, he hasn't looked the same player so far, but its a bit early to be looking to sell him.

I always felt he was at his best played in a 4 -5 -1 formation, which doesn't appear to be the way we are setting up to play in the league this season. Whether he can adapt to the new faster flowing game that we seem to be adopting with Torres and Babel only time will tell (Christmas and a few full games at least)

At worst he is still a great "plan B" player and one of the best 4th choice strikers in the league. Unless we are going out to buy another high profile striker or a creative second striker (which I have wanted for a long long time) I would stick with him, and wait for him to get his form back.
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Postby maguskwt » Tue Sep 18, 2007 3:30 am

s@int wrote:At worst he is still a great "plan B" player and one of the best 4th choice strikers in the league.

that depends on whether he can make an impact when he comes on as a sub... and so far he has not...

he's at his best when he play from the beginning... but now that we have torres... we cannnot afford to play crouch...

I'd sell him...
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Postby LiverpoolMadman » Tue Sep 18, 2007 6:10 am

maguskwt wrote:
s@int wrote:At worst he is still a great "plan B" player and one of the best 4th choice strikers in the league.

that depends on whether he can make an impact when he comes on as a sub... and so far he has not...

he's at his best when he play from the beginning... but now that we have torres... we cannnot afford to play crouch...

I'd sell him...

I agree.... sell him quick before he's value "drop".

The Toons want to buy him, maybe we can exchange with Steven Taylor (defender).
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Postby heimdall » Tue Sep 18, 2007 9:26 am

murphy0151 wrote:I dont care what anyone says.  Hes got to go!!!!

If we can get anywhere near 10 million id be well happy. 

Im I on me own here?

I 100% agree, Crouch is a :censored: striker, and has a horrible attitude, this season Bellamy, lets get rid asap.
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Postby 66-1112520797 » Tue Sep 18, 2007 10:12 am

Crouch is a good footballer, and a decent striker. He needs more football IMO, and needs to accept the rotation policy like some of us here.
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Postby muzodziwa » Tue Sep 18, 2007 12:25 pm

I am trying to be cautious over this one but if i am being honest, no matter how i look at it Crouch being a decent footballer is not good enough to be our first choice striker and indeed for me he is our forth choice. Combining this with his attitude (no matter how hard we can bury our heads in the sand the guy is showing he is not content with rotation, it is glaringly obvious), I think he is surplus to requirements.

This does not mean he is :censored:, but rather the "possibilities" that we have for his position are many and varied; we might see Babel playing there a few games when Youssi and Pennant are all playing, we might see Gerrard playing higher up the pitch when the going gets tough.

Agreing with Emerald, our normal combination up front is Kuyt/Torres and with some games it will be Torres/Voronin.

A word of advice to Crouch, he does not owe Rafa anything but he owes us a performance week in week out and im sorry mate what you gave us on Saturday was just the opposite of our expectations of anyone wearing the red shirt; Kuyt is having a barren spell but at least he gives us a performance week in week out.
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Postby JC_81 » Tue Sep 18, 2007 1:42 pm

I've said it before but I think Crouch's days are numbered at Liverpool.  For me his body language says it all.  Last season there were no tantrums when he got subbed.  Against Portsmouth he was visibly raging at getting subbed.  Add that to his several digs he's made in interviews at not getting selected.  It's understandable that he doesn't like getting subbed or being a sub, what footballer does?  But it's looking increasingly likely he isn't happy with being rotated and probably feels he's 4th in the pecking order at the moment.

His statement the other day about being happy to fight for his place is all well and good.  But that's not what I saw on Saturday.  He certainly doesn't look happy to me.

Overall I think he was a good signing.  At 7 million I think we got our money's worth out of him.  He's also benefited as a player as he's become established in the England set up.  He's scored a reasonable amount of goals and for a couple of seasons when our football wasn't exactly flowing, he provided a crucial outlet ball to enable us to build our attacks.  But now we've moved on.  For Crouch's sake too, I think if he stays with us he'll gradually fall out of the England reckoning.

With Torres on board as top man and with Kuyt and Voronin both effective partners for Torres, Crouch's chances will be limited.  There's no point holding on to him as an option from the bench either, he's a terrible substitute, can't effect games.  If we aren't starting him we should sell him.  IMO we should at least get our money back - someone will pay between 7-10 million for him I reckon.  It's the best move for both parties.
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Postby Owzat » Tue Sep 18, 2007 1:47 pm

I read rumours Juventus want him, Turin zoo must be all out of giraffes. There was suggestion Man City want him too, I would sell while his value is high and before a lack of regular first team football sees his price drop. He ended on a relative high last season with the hat-trick against the goners, selling in the summer would have brought in some £££
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Postby polygemus » Thu Sep 20, 2007 1:08 pm

We should offload him and buy an African striker with tons of potential. He is really too slow and he doesn't win much headers, contrary to what people think. Wenger was enterprising enough to offload Anelka for 20 million pounds many years ago.

Also, Beni MacCarthy, Adebayor, Yakubu, Drogba, Obafemi Martins are all excellent gambles that paid off. We do not have luck with Diouf but that doesn't mean we will stay unlucky with African talents.
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Postby dawson99 » Thu Sep 20, 2007 2:40 pm

yeah, always good with the african nations to buy a player then lose him for 10 games of a campaign ???

doesnt matter where the guys from geographically, just buy someone whos good for the club, and recently crouch just hasnt been. i know he has in the past, but the past is over
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Postby bigmick » Fri Sep 21, 2007 12:19 pm

Some very interesting observations on Crouch, and clearly the fact that in his case it's very early as far as this season goes is no barrier to many deciding his time is up. I think the situation needs to be looked at carefully and with a clear head.

All this "he ain't good enough for Liverpool" stuff is patently nonsense if you consider that four or five months ago he was our most potent striker. If you cast your mind back into the dim and distant past of around a year ago, he was just about the hottest striker in Europe as evertime he swung his boot he scored a goal. Clearly however, all is not well with the big man right now and something needs to be done.

Selling at the right price is clearly an option, but only if you have a viable alternative in reserve. If we are belatedly going to secure the services of a Samuel Eto then obviously there wouldn't be a problem. More realistically, if we are going to buy a genuine International class striker who hopefully wouldn't do a "Morientes" to take his place then once again I'm all for it. My suspicion is however that those who advocate moving on Crouch are willing to do so without securing an alternative which would be a huge mistake IMHO. I'm not quite as prepared as many to accept at this stage that Voronin is going to have a significant impact on our season, whereas Crouch could be brought in for the biggest of fixtures and he'd have my full confidence that he would do the job. Kuyt continues also to flatter to decieve, while Babel hasn't even been tried up top yet so my feeling is that we still very much need Crouch, or at least a credible alternative.

The main problem for Crouch at the moment it seems to me is that he needs to find a way to play. It is true to say that we aren't playing in entirely the same way as last season, and I don't think the big man has managed to make the adjustment yet as he hasn't really figured out what he should be doing. He also was a touch unlucky in that his only League start came in the only game where we didn't really perform as a team and he was by no means alone in looking poor on the day. Whether it was down to selection or whatever else, very few people came out of the Portsmouth game with credit.

Just to explain myself a bit in terms of him needing to figure out a way to play. I actually think his form began to tail off a bit last season once Gerrard moved inside. Gerrard on the right was perfect for Crouch as it stretched the play, gave him some fantastic deliveries to score goals with, and provided him with a good foil to get involved with when Gerrard followed the play in. Once Gerrard plays inside and Pennant goes right , he misses out on two fronts. Firstly, Pennants delivery is nowhere near as good with the ball not being fizzed into the gap between the keeper and defence a la Gerrard, and secondly Pennant sticks to the touchline like glue. Allied to that, Gerrard moving centrally causes the play centrally to contract a touch with the opposition holding midfielder sitting in a bit more and Crouch is a little harder to hit. Even furthermore, since Torres has come in and really began to work the channels (as opposed to Bellamy who used to work much wider and Kuyt who works much deeper) my feeling is Crouch is searching for an area to operate in. Playing him with Voronin wouldn't appear to be a good match for me because in terms of where they go they are very similar, and neither will work off the other. At least when he played with Kuyt the Dutchman waould sweep in and around him and provide some interplay.

For me Crouch needs to back away from the play more. If the ball is with the left back he needs to back off into the outside right position, giving us an alternative outball to Torres in the channel. This would have the dual effect of stretching the centre-halves a bit and giving Torres the option of circling around in front of Crouch if the full-back goes diagonal. Previously his movement would have been towards the player in posession and he just needs to do the opposite a bit more, if you get my drift.
Last edited by bigmick on Fri Sep 21, 2007 12:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby account deleted by request » Fri Sep 21, 2007 1:05 pm

Has anyone else heard that 8 clubs including Liverpool have made new approaches for Owen to join in the Jan transfer window? Supposedly Liverpool are willing to do a straight cash deal or a player exchange deal (not necessarily Crouch)

Would the arrival of Owen signal Crouch's departure or that at last he has a player who he can play with? Personally I cant see us keeping 5 strikers, so if a new striker comes in, one will have to go, and that would presumably have to be Crouch. Certainly we can't afford to lose Crouch without signing an adequate replacement, and I don't think Owen would risk his England place by joining Liverpool, and  becoming a rotated striker. ( He misses enough games through injury )

If Crouch is to stay I think he needs to get his head right and fight for his place as he did both in his first season and to a lesser extent last season. I still think he's a bit miffed not to be picked for the CL final, and may need a little time to get his disappointment out of his system. I think he was harshly treated last season, both by England and Liverpool, but he has to accept that at the top level he's never going to be an automatic first choice, and needs to perform every time he gets a chance.
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Postby dawson99 » Fri Sep 21, 2007 1:06 pm

i didnt think the offer applied in january for the owen mark down, only available in the summer transfer
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