Liverpool FC Forum

by **devaney** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 7:03 pm

Fed up with the bloke to be honest. Out of the 65 players he has bought there is a handful that are up to the job but Rafa being Rafa he has also sold a handful that really were up to the job and can now be seen working successfully at other clubs wearing broad grins on their faces!

I would actually rather SOS had a serious whinge about Rafa than our fkg annoying owners. Rafa is doing far more harm to the club than those two muppets - FACT !!!!!!!!!

Rafa has spent taking into account the players he has sold about £80m over 5 years which let's face it in todays terms is not massive but can anybody name me one player that cost under £5m (Wenger style!) who will go on and be worth over £12m? I am not actually asking for the world. Insua possibly but very unlikely! I accept that Rafa has done well with Alonso and Torres deals and could probably make a combined profit on the two players of between £60/70m if he sold Torres perish the thought. That is good business but it is only 2 players out of 65.

Lando you bl.eedin muppet (amusing muppet though!) - how's you're husband doing - is he still in Walton servicing any little boy that gives him grief?

by **NANNY RED** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 7:03 pm

Ive been lookin at my head all day Daws :laugh:

few white ones spinging up here an there but other than that , Sound as a pound

by **Bammo** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 7:07 pm

I still think Steve Bruce is worse than Harry Redknapp. If Steve "He's got a big head" Bruce ends up here then we may as well prepare for Championship football. We'll look good for half a season as he spunks money on players who perform every 1 out of 5 games before we slip down the table into mediocrity.

He took Huddersfield from promotion contenders to relegation fodder under Ian Ayre (I wonder where he ended up?

) so God help us if he ends up here.

What this club needs is Rafa to realise that we play best when we attack and are expansive. Sod having 2 defensive midfielders against smaller teams and go for it. At the moment we seem to either be brilliant (Burnley, Hull) or reminiscent of Houllier, with an 8 man defence and 2 attackers isolated 50 yards away.

by **Penguins** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 7:08 pm

Does anyone really believe it will be better?

After this past zero spend summer and after Rafa walks away with 15-20 million and a refinanicing coming up next summer, does anyone believe we will get a top class manager who will get
the resources to build his team or a Yes man who will accept there being almost no money to spend and not complain?

I know where I will be putting my money....

by **Reg** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 7:20 pm

Of course it will get better but only once we get rafa bashing and insulting eachother out of our system.

by **Fowler_E7** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 7:25 pm

Now is not the time to be changing managers, and i do belive is vital to keeping the club going at the moment, with the farcical running of the club by the two american clowns. However Rafa is doing a terrible job this season IMO, his player recruitment and talent spotting is very average if im being generous and his insistence on playing clearly average players who lack the quality to play for this club is beyone belief, especially considering that Rafa Benitez is clealy an extremely knowledgeable and tactically astute manager. I mean you only have to look at the lack of creativity in our midfield to see why we struggle so much. an attack that consists of Mascherano, Lucas, Kuyt and Ngog is never gonna impose themselves against anyone half decent, anyone who knows a little bit about football would tell you that, so why does Rafa Benitez a man with coaching gifts that few others possess persist with such a horribly unbalanced and untalented team? i just dont get it, and to be honest its starting to annoy the hell out of me! i cant remember the last time i saw a Liverpool starting 11 and thought " i really like that, thats a good team" not once this season i think.

by **Bammo** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 7:33 pm

As there's been a few mentions and criticisms of the number of players Benitez has bought I thought I'd take a look at it. Here are his signings split into 1st team and youth players. It's as complete a list as I can find and there is some debate as to which certain players fall into (eg Guthrie/Peltier/Spearing) but it is interesting to see how many of his buys were for the youth team. And no it's not in chronological order. If you want it that way then you do it

1st team:

Alberto Aquilani
Glen Johnson
Fernando Torres
Robbie Keane
Ryan Babel
Xabi Alonso
Dirk Kuyt
Albert Riera
Andrea Dossena
Peter Crouch
Lucas Leiva
Jermaine Pennant
Martin Skrtel
Craig Bellamy
Luis Garcia
Jose Reina
Dan Agger
Mohammed Sissoko
Fernando Morientes
Yossi Benayoun
Diego Cavalieri
Alvaro Arbeloa
Sebastian Leto
Jose Miguel Gonzalez
Mark Gonzalez
David Ngog
Scott Carson
Andriy Voronin
Damien Plessis
Charles Itandje
Philipp Degen
Robbie Fowler
Javier Mascherano
Nabil El Zhar
Danny Guthrie
Lee Peltier
Fabio Aurelio
Jan Kromkamp
Boudewijn Zenden
Mauricio Pellegrino
Martin Kelly
Antonio Nunez
Emiliano Insua
Kyrgiakos

Youth team:

Gabriel Paletta
Mikel San Jose
David Martin
Antonio Barragan
Besian Idrizaj
Jack Hobbs
Alex Cooper
Alexander Kacaniklic
Krisztian Nemeth
Andras Simon
Victor Palsson
Gary Mackay Steven
Vitor Flora
Nikolay Mihaylov
Emmanuel Mendy
Marvin Pourie
Dani Pacheco
Nikola Saric
Lauri Dalla Valle
Hakan Duyan
Gerardo Bruna
Peter Gulacsi
Vincent Lucas
Ryan Crowther
Mihail Alexandrov
Ryan Wilkie
Miki Roque
Mark Smyth
Jay Smith
Stephen Darby
Craig Lindfield
Adam Hammill
Paul Anderson
Godwin Antwi
Robbie Threlfall
Ryan Flynn
Calum Woods
Paul Willis
Danny O'Donnell
Ramon Calliste
Steve Irwin
Ronald Huth
Jordy Brouwer
Francisco Manuel Duran
Ray Putterill
Martin Hansen
Jay Spearing
Dave Roberts
David Mannix

by **Dazzer** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 7:49 pm

NANNY RED wrote:Other managers I take a pop at are peter reid , Glen hoddle , zola , or even Steve bruce cos lets face it those managers know our league inside out.

An you wanna know why i said some are half A.sed fans, Dazzer. How could any Liverpool fan even think about having anyone of them as our manager, Its not a Xbox or Nintendo game here, There not good enough to be on our coaching staff never mind manage us, Im still shakin me head in disbelieve here , Bruce an gobs.*i*e Reid. Fecking hell Marcello Lippi betta be dead worried .

Not even gonna responed to ya nan I have my views on things if you don't like it thats your problem.

End of day you got rafa so high up on a pedalstool you will only be very dissapointed in the end.

by **Reg** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 7:52 pm

On the subject of talent spotting, its probably a good time to remind ourselves that if Rafa is sacked an extensive Spanish contingent of talent spotters and back room staff plus probably a few players would follow him out.

Thats not the kind of instability we need in mid october is it?

by **maypaxvobiscum** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 8:00 pm

Reg wrote:On the subject of talent spotting, its probably a good time to remind ourselves that if Rafa is sacked an extensive Spanish contingent of talent spotters and back room staff plus probably a few players would follow him out.

Thats not the kind of instability we need in mid october is it?

thats what everyone said when Mourinho left Chelsea but it didnt happen. besides, the talent spotting team is cack and their existence or lack of, makes no difference. if they were smart, our scouts would be scouting the Arsenal scouts.

by **Dazzer** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 8:22 pm

maypaxvobiscum wrote:
Reg wrote:On the subject of talent spotting, its probably a good time to remind ourselves that if Rafa is sacked an extensive Spanish contingent of talent spotters and back room staff plus probably a few players would follow him out.

Thats not the kind of instability we need in mid october is it?

thats what everyone said when Mourinho left Chelsea but it didnt happen. besides, the talent spotting team is cack and their existence or lack of, makes no difference. if they were smart, our scouts would be scouting the Arsenal scouts.

yep they can go as well they suck clearly. :nod

by **DAV** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 8:25 pm

i started this thread, and i must say their have been alot of interesting posts on it since.
The only thing i really don't understand is this. At the begining of the season we all new we had a decent starting 11 but no real depth in the squad. If we new this, then i am sure RAFA new this. The writting was on the wall for alonso nearly a year ago. RB'S call, as he is manager. So fair play, real madrid came in off he goes, fair play to the lad. Our squad as we and RB knows lacks several positions. One being another striker, no striker was signed with the budget he had or from the sale of alonso. Torres gets injured we fall apart. no shock their. We had a decent enough right back and the degan bloke as back up. Not a position i considered needed looking at. We sell our right back and use probabley most of our budget on another right back. So back to square one, the squad is the same with possibley a slightly better rightback in place. The Alonso money goes on a player who for all i no could be better than pele. Only thing is he wont play for 4 months. So for those 4 months our squad is even weaker than last year. RB like us must already no this. This is the bit i really don't understand, being a tactical genius and one of the best managers in the world. How did he plan to get us through 4 months of the season in one of the toughest leagues in the world and the group stages of europe?

??
And please dont anyone say, he didnt expect injurys.

by **bigmick** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 8:33 pm

Unfortunately the argument begins to go down a well trodden path which I suppose is inevitable. Those who think that Rafa is possibly culpable are branded glory hunters, fickle, not real fans etc. Those who think he ought to be supported are accused of having their heads in the sand. At the more extreme end of the spectrum as usual there are those who don't wish to engage in discussion at all, preferring to just go straight for personal insults.

People ask "well who could replace him" which always seems like an odd question to me. We haven't won a trophy for three seasons and counting, and look in serious danger of stalling in any "progression" we were making this time around, so replacing him perhaps wouldn't be as hard as some pretend. I did see that somebody mentioned Harry Redknapp until it was pointed out that Rafa has actualy one more trophy than him :laugh:

. I guess the fact that Redknapp won his with Portsmouth who he took up from bottom of the Championship via winning the league, into the top eight of the Premiership and won them their first trophy possibly ever is irrelevent. I guess that this time last last year the fact that Spurs had two points after eight games and were wondering where their next bowl of babyfood was coming from, or wondering who's name was going to come out of the hat this week is by the by also. That they have managed to vault us and leave us trailing in their wake (who were top of the league at the time) is purely down to money, and means Redknapp is still a sh!t manager?

I don't think we should sack Rafa, nor do I think we should make Harry Redknapp manager. I never get involved in answwering the "who do you think could replace him" arguments though, because people lose all sense of reality. Mourinho was slagged off to high heaven when his name got mentioned a year or so ago, people said he was tactically inept, only ever won titles at clubs where it was on a plate, could only do it when he spent bucketloads of money etc. If they can't even redcognise all of that to be nonsense, there is absolutely no point whatsoever in throwing any other name into the mix.

If you replace rafa now, whoever the new manager is won't have a chance with a sizeable portion of the fans. They'll still be clinging onto their mantra that "Rafa never was given a fair go" regardless of what happens. I had a chat with someone on here last week who said Rafa will only be given "a few more years" to win a trophy, and it wasn't right. Presumeably, if we win something before 2020 then all is good.

No, wait till the end of the season and re-assess. By then, we'll have given Rafa plenty of opportunity to turn things around, plenty of chance to convince everyone. If we continue anything like as we are right now and we do have to get rid, at least a new manager whoever it is will come in and get the instant support of the majority of the fanbase. Despite what they may say (and they will say it) I'm not convinced that would be the case were it to happen next week.

by **dawson99** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 8:34 pm

who DID say harry? Id rather have fat sam than that kunt

by **bigmick** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 8:37 pm

The funny thing was not that someone suggested him, it was that his trophy record got compared to Rafa. Not taking into account one of them was at Portsmouth and one of them is at Liverpool is laughable.

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