Liverpool FC Forum

Santa » Tue Nov 25, 2014 10:34 am wrote:There is a difference between money wasted vs resources wrongly allocated.

Are you seriously arguing that allocating resources wrongly is NOT wasting money........

OK then, there is nothing more I can really say here.

ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Tue Nov 25, 2014 12:58 pm wrote:The owners are cutting him a bit of slack because they know he isn't solely responsible for the signings

Who else is then yakka?

Reg » Tue Nov 25, 2014 1:50 pm wrote:Lets just hope as a bare minimum that BR has been given the shock of his life and he'll learn the lesson and change his philosophy.

Ferguson did and see what he produced.

We are all hoping he does Reginald, but with the dross he has bought in........I'm sorry......he is f**king doomed.

eds » Tue Nov 25, 2014 10:01 pm wrote:

ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Tue Nov 25, 2014 12:58 pm wrote:The owners are cutting him a bit of slack because they know he isn't solely responsible for the signings

Who else is then yakka?

The echo had a breakdown of the committee the other day mate, some fella called Edwards was on it, some other fella who was into statistical analysis was also there, there were a couple of other fella's who identify potential targets and of course Rodgers and Ayre. There may have even been one or two more.
Sounds like a right carry on to me like but that's the road the yanks want to go down.

Interesting article.......

http://www.espnfc.com/liverpool/story/2163535/brendan-rodgers-cool-on-january-liverpool-buys

Reading in between the lines the owners aren't willing to give him any more money to waste in January, so I do think his days are numbered.

ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Tue Nov 25, 2014 10:15 pm wrote:

eds » Tue Nov 25, 2014 10:01 pm wrote:

ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Tue Nov 25, 2014 12:58 pm wrote:The owners are cutting him a bit of slack because they know he isn't solely responsible for the signings

Who else is then yakka?

The echo had a breakdown of the committee the other day mate, some fella called Edwards was on it, some other fella who was into statistical analysis was also there, there were a couple of other fella's who identify potential targets and of course Rodgers and Ayre. There may have even been one or two more.
Sounds like a right carry on to me like but that's the road the yanks want to go down.

That's exactly the constraints I was trying to highlight with Reginald that the owners pass down to our management, but unfortunately he doesn't want to hear a bar of it. The whole model of the way we go out and make a list of players we want is f**ked. The sooner we get rid of this moneyball nonsense the better. If it means having to say goodbye to our owners, then so be it. Thanks for shedding some light on that.

Tuesday's Telegraph


Blame Brendan Rodgers? The six men who must share Liverpool blame

Liverpool manager is not the only one at fault for club's failures this season as Telegraph Sport analyses the fall guys
Blame Brendan Rodgers? The six men who must share Liverpool blame

25 Nov 2014

Mike Gordon, Director
Gordon, who sits on the board of Liverpool and the club's parent company Fenway Sports Group, has been described as the man who runs Liverpool on a day-to-day basis, the link between owner John Henry and chief executive Ian Ayre. In his late forties, he has the deepest knowledge of football of anyone at FSG and is its eyes and ears on Merseyside.

Ian Ayre, Chief Executive Officer 
Born in Liverpool, Ayre was appointed commercial director at Anfield by the club's previous owners. Lifelong Liverpool fan who was appointed managing director by FSG and promoted again to chief executive earlier this year. Is responsible for negotiating transfer fees and contracts. Has explained the transfer committee theory thus: "Your biggest expenditure line can't be the whim of any individual."

Dave Fallows, Head of Recruitment
Joined Liverpool amid great fanfare in the summer of 2012, leaving his role as first team recruitment and scouting co-ordinator at Manchester City, then the Premier League champions. Liverpool had been looking for a sporting director to succeed Damien Comolli, who left the club in April 2012, but dropped that search after Fallows' appointment.

Barry Hunter, Chief Scout 
Former Wrexham and Reading defender who had a spell as Rushden and Diamonds manager which ended when he oversaw their relegation out of the Football League in 2006. Hunter, 43, joined Liverpool from Manchester City with Fallows. Hunter had been City's chief scout for Italy, Switzerland and Russia.

Michael Edwards, Head of Performance and Analysis 
Edwards analysis of potential targets makes him a key figure at Liverpool, where owner John W Henry has regularly spoken of his admiration of a 'Moneyball' philosophy - essentially the use of statistical analysis to find transfer bargains. Ayre has denied Liverpool have directly followed a Moneyball model but Edwards retains a significant influence over targets.

Brendan Rodgers, Manager 
Appointed by Liverpool in 2012 following the departure of Kenny Dalglish, whose demise followed the ill-fated £35m signing of Andy Carroll, still the highest fee paid for an Englishman. Rodgers has input into signings but does not always get his way - players such as Michel Vorm and Ashley Williams might now be at Liverpool if he had have done.

It would be interesting to see the "Moneyball" stats on the players we have bought.
For instance I can't see anything that Markovic has that benefits us - just exactly what stats led us to buy him?

If our current season is an example of Moneyball being applied to football then my conclusion is "it doesn't work - forget it".

Reg » Tue Nov 25, 2014 1:50 pm wrote:Lets just hope as a bare minimum that BR has been given the shock of his life and he'll learn the lesson and change his philosophy.

Ferguson did and see what he produced.

fergie is a corrupted a..s..s who bullied refs to give manus a unfair advantages.
one day the truth will be out, when the old man is dead.

Octsky » Wed Nov 26, 2014 3:43 am wrote:

Reg » Tue Nov 25, 2014 1:50 pm wrote:Lets just hope as a bare minimum that BR has been given the shock of his life and he'll learn the lesson and change his philosophy.

Ferguson did and see what he produced.

fergie is a corrupted a..s..s who bullied refs to give manus a unfair advantages.
one day the truth will be out, when the old man is dead.

This, there are probably 4 titles they should not have won.

I really believe someone else will be in charge of Liverpool next season. Unless he makes a turn around pretty soon, we'll definitely finish in the lower half of the table and to fsg, that is never good enough, the King finished at 8th and he was sacked. TBH, based on current form, we'll not even finish 8th at all. Brendan also said he won't be making anymore signings in January. He didn't cite reasons for that. My logic tells me that fsg have lost confidence in him regarding transfers and don't want him to waste more money. I remember fsg didn't fund Kenny a single cent in his last Jan window either because like Brendan he also wasted over 100 million on average Joes. And I don't blame fsg if that's really the case because I wouldn't if I were them. Just let him continue till the end of the season with his 117 million signings and see where Liverpool will finish and if we finish in bottom half or mid table, then for sure they will give him his P45.

What really interests me now is, who will they appoint? I hope we have learnt the lesson of never appoint a mid table manager to be in charge of Liverpool. He must be someone who have won titles in the tough leagues someone like Rafa whom I will take back in a heartbeat or guys in the calibre of Hiddink, Guardiola or even Klopp. F*ck this fsg policy of having a young manager signing young players building for the future. If you concentrate too much on the future, the ship in the meantime will be sunk. Look at manure, they appoint a 60+ year old legend and they were signing good quality established players and they're are now 4th. We are doing the diametric opposite and that's why I believe fsg need to go next. Because it has really convinced me that to win the PL, you need mega rich owners besides having a great manager. Question, if Mourinho were in charge of Liverpool and have to work within the constraints of fsg ie signing kids(under 21) and building for the future, do you think we would be champions? Unlikely. Changing manager without changing fsg will not get us very far either. Both Brendan and fsg need to go. Please don't tell me to go and support Chelsea and City, Liverpool football club is in my red blood and in my genes forever.

BR has given his response to what Carra said the other day, he blasted back "

"We hear criticism of the team but this team has character, it showed it last season. It has shown it’s got resilience. Okay, we concede more than we would like at times but you can’t question the character”.

That can’t be criticised. We have players who’ve shown they have spirit but when you don’t get victories it affects confidence and you don’t perform quite as good. My job is to keep instilling that confidence"

This response made me laugh. "Character- last season", well BR, what about this season?  "My job  is to keep instilling that confidence"  er, hello, what confidence? BR has completely shot everyone's confidence to pieces.

On another note, I've heard rumours that FSG are looking for the right DOF. Cruyff would be the choice,of a lot of fans  imo.  However, I don't think he really wants another big job.  Rumour has it  they may go with someone they know within the U.S. They like and respect Bruce Arena a lot , so they may look at him for this role. Definitely would not be my choice.

Cryuff is way too old, forget it. Bring in someone who is up to the job.

Reg » Tue Nov 25, 2014 10:26 pm wrote:Tuesday's Telegraph


Blame Brendan Rodgers? The six men who must share Liverpool blame

Liverpool manager is not the only one at fault for club's failures this season as Telegraph Sport analyses the fall guys
Blame Brendan Rodgers? The six men who must share Liverpool blame

Its not the transfer comitee that picks the team or decides how the team should play. The players we have should be more than enough to beat crystal palace. I doubt the rest of the transfer comitee can sign players that Rodgers dont want either.

Last season it was quite clear we needed to improve our defense, but so far we have done nothing to try and improve upon it and we are actually even worse defensively than last season. Yet still we play with Gerrard as a "defensive midfielder/deep-lying playmaker" when he doesnt contribute defensively. The opposition have long since figured out how to stop his offensive contributions, especially with the strikers we have now.

Yes we did well last season because we had what was probably the best player in the world in top form that dragged the rest of the team along with him, but even I would have been successful as the manager of that team.

Our biggest problem isnt one or two players or the transfer comitee, its the manager.

Rodgers admits in his latest interview that he created this deep lying quarterback role for Gerrard because he thought it would extend his career and benefit the team.
The problem with that though is that we have deviated away from Rodgers original blueprint and you can plainly see it in the way we don't press teams anymore and the way we hit long balls from front to back.
When he first arrived Rodgers was very single minded, he got rid of the likes of Carroll, Aquilani, Kuyt, Adam and Spearing and he talked about only bringing in players that could press the ball. He spoke about keeping the ball for long periods to tire out the opposition and to also give our players a rest after working hard to win the ball back.
Even though results weren't great when he first arrived you could at least see what he was trying to do, we had an identity and a clear style of play.
Ever since Gerrard has moved to this QB role we have gradually moved further and further away from Rodgers original idea, we looked more like the 'British Barcelona' in his third ever game against United (the one where we lost 2-1 but played them off the park even with 10 men after Shelvey got sent off) than we do now 3 years down the line.
We have to go back to that style of play that we were playing 3 years ago.