Liverpool v Everton 5th May 2013 1.30pm

Liverpool Football Club - Games

Postby Thommo's perm » Mon May 06, 2013 11:29 am

Benny The Noon » Mon May 06, 2013 10:11 am wrote:I haven't said anything - you're the one making all the comments and judgements.

You can point out which goals Downing has been at fault for if you wish - that should be no problems for you.

If you want to involve Downing in our defensive problems then you need to ensure its across the board and you include other players.

The majority of our defensive problems have been from set pieces and a lack of an aerial dominant centre back meaning we have suffered against teams that bully us through the middle - a problem that has been very evident through most of our defeats this season - you can blame Downing for that if you want but it's quite clear to most where our problems lie this season.

Or you can just clutch straws and blame Downing

But at the very least try and show you're a mature adult by responding without throwing insults around - it adds nothing to any debate.


They are not insults they are observations.
How could I and why would I blame Downing for our defensive problems? That shows your small mind in that you cannot grasp the concept that I am not happy with Downings "contribution" both in attack AND defense. He is an average at best player who will do nothing to push us forward to competing for honours. He is ineffective going forward (most of the time) and pretty useless defending. This is due to his poor attitude and lack of bottle. Its a simple point but you are muddying the water with your accusation that Im blaming Downing for everything wrong with the team.
Silly and childish
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Postby Benny The Noon » Mon May 06, 2013 11:32 am

I know you're not happy with Downings contributions

Everytime we don't get a positive result you point to Downing

You are remarkably quiet when we win though and Downing is a part of that win. It's prob the reason why the Downing thread goes quiet regulary.
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Postby Thommo's perm » Mon May 06, 2013 11:51 am

Benny The Noon » Mon May 06, 2013 10:32 am wrote:I know you're not happy with Downings contributions

Everytime we don't get a positive result you point to Downing

You are remarkably quiet when we win though and Downing is a part of that win. It's prob the reason why the Downing thread goes quiet regulary.


Most of the time I cant be ar'sed because Im sick of moaning about him, but you may have noticed that I gave him credit on a couple of occassions when he deserved it?
Nearly everyone I was sitting by groaned when Henderson was brought off and Downing was left on so Im not alone.
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Postby Benny The Noon » Mon May 06, 2013 11:56 am

Yes taking off Henderson was the wrong choice - haven't disputed that.

Downing didnt have his best game - along with others including Sturridge ( who was by far the worst ) who was the main reason why we didnt win - he was the one who missed the chances to win the game for us.

But there isn't many players in the team who have played well week in week out.

What I do know is that Downing this season since getting back into the starting line up has done well for us and Downing returning to the line up was alongside us getting our better results and improved attacking output.

We have IMO far more pressing areas to solve than Downing.
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Postby Thommo's perm » Mon May 06, 2013 12:13 pm

Benny The Noon » Mon May 06, 2013 10:56 am wrote:Yes taking off Henderson was the wrong choice - haven't disputed that.

Downing didnt have his best game - along with others including Sturridge ( who was by far the worst ) who was the main reason why we didnt win - he was the one who missed the chances to win the game for us.

But there isn't many players in the team who have played well week in week out.

What I do know is that Downing this season since getting back into the starting line up has done well for us and Downing returning to the line up was alongside us getting our better results and improved attacking output.

We have IMO far more pressing areas to solve than Downing.


I stand by my original point
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Postby Benny The Noon » Mon May 06, 2013 12:16 pm

Glad we cleared that up.
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Postby stmichael » Mon May 06, 2013 12:22 pm

easily the worst derby games i can remember for a while, probably since the 0-0 at anfield in 06/07 when andy johnson was playing for them.

neither side could pass water, gerrard aside who was exceptional. they had more control in the second half but i can't remember reina making a save. we still had the better chances.

not one that will live long in the memory.
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Postby ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Mon May 06, 2013 3:50 pm

stmichael » Mon May 06, 2013 11:22 am wrote:easily the worst derby games i can remember for a while, probably since the 0-0 at anfield in 06/07 when andy johnson was playing for them.

neither side could pass water, gerrard aside who was exceptional. they had more control in the second half but i can't remember reina making a save. we still had the better chances.

not one that will live long in the memory.


everton had a goal dissallowed so it will be remembered forever.
i`m not joking either, tim howards in the echo saying everton were shafted
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Postby Benny The Noon » Mon May 06, 2013 3:51 pm

It was a perfect legit goal as well.
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Postby Kenny Kan » Mon May 06, 2013 11:32 pm

Benny The Noon » Mon May 06, 2013 9:49 am wrote:
Kenny Kan » Mon May 06, 2013 9:57 am wrote:
Benny The Noon » Mon May 06, 2013 8:48 am wrote:
In saying that, Downing was shocking yesterday, even the crowd began to groan at his misplaced passes and efforts that fruited nothing. Couldn't blame them, he was frustrating to watch and predictably had no end product.



Well from experience most of the "groans" where for both Sturridge and Johnson. Downing was too concerned with trying to contain Baines.


No. Downing got more than his fair share. He should have been dragged off way before Henderson too.


I guess it appeared different on the telly or stream[/quote]

Yeah because the audio and visuals on my tele communications don't work  :laugh:

whopper.
Champions of England 2020.

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Postby Benny The Noon » Tue May 07, 2013 6:57 am

Kenny Kan » Mon May 06, 2013 11:32 pm wrote:
Yeah because the audio and visuals on my tele communications don't work  :laugh:

whopper.


It would explain things :laugh:
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Postby devaney » Tue May 07, 2013 7:01 am

Very disappointing day at the office !!  Easy to single out individuals that didn't perform and no one player was responsible for the result.

The Downing discussion however clearly shows what some supporters are beginning to accept as an acceptable standard. Downing has improved since very late December and that was partly due to BR telling him he could leave in January if he wanted to. Prior to that Downing ponced around as if he owned the club. Before Downing joined Liverpool he had considerable International and Premiership experience and for his first 15 months at Liverpool he was nothing short of a disgrace and very few would argue with that except possibly Downing's mother !! You can argue that it takes time to settle but just how long did this lad need. We paid a high price for an experienced player and we expected him to quickly start making an impression. Compare his stats with Cortinho and Sturridge who have both done more than Downing in just a few months.  Downing made a very serious contribution towards Kenny's demise and certainly didn't help Andy Carroll's case considering he was bought to provide ammunition for Andy which he failed to do regularly.Downing featured in 36 games (started in 28) last season and didn't have one goal or one assist to his name. During his career at Liverpool Downing has been substituted  in more than 30% of the games he has started. Argue that it was tactical if you really want to but the real reason is that he simply wasn't doing the job that he is paid to do. Downing was appalling and that should not be overlooked. He has improved but from a very low base and I am amazed that some supporters are actually willing to accept that he is good enough to play on the wing for Liverpool FC. My standards are considerably higher than that. When I look at Stevie Heighway and Stuart Downing I find it extremely difficult to accept that they were both employed to do the same job at Liverpool. Downing against tough opposition disappears. Heighway on the other hand revelled in it !!
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Postby Reg » Tue May 07, 2013 12:17 pm

I don't know why Johnson played, he made no effort whatsoever.  I thought at one stage he'd taken money to screw things up he was that bad.
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Postby ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Tue May 07, 2013 12:47 pm

devaney » Tue May 07, 2013 6:01 am wrote:Very disappointing day at the office !!  Easy to single out individuals that didn't perform and no one player was responsible for the result.

The Downing discussion however clearly shows what some supporters are beginning to accept as an acceptable standard. Downing has improved since very late December and that was partly due to BR telling him he could leave in January if he wanted to. Prior to that Downing ponced around as if he owned the club. Before Downing joined Liverpool he had considerable International and Premiership experience and for his first 15 months at Liverpool he was nothing short of a disgrace and very few would argue with that except possibly Downing's mother !! You can argue that it takes time to settle but just how long did this lad need. We paid a high price for an experienced player and we expected him to quickly start making an impression. Compare his stats with Cortinho and Sturridge who have both done more than Downing in just a few months.  Downing made a very serious contribution towards Kenny's demise and certainly didn't help Andy Carroll's case considering he was bought to provide ammunition for Andy which he failed to do regularly.Downing featured in 36 games (started in 28) last season and didn't have one goal or one assist to his name. During his career at Liverpool Downing has been substituted  in more than 30% of the games he has started. Argue that it was tactical if you really want to but the real reason is that he simply wasn't doing the job that he is paid to do. Downing was appalling and that should not be overlooked. He has improved but from a very low base and I am amazed that some supporters are actually willing to accept that he is good enough to play on the wing for Liverpool FC. My standards are considerably higher than that. When I look at Stevie Heighway and Stuart Downing I find it extremely difficult to accept that they were both employed to do the same job at Liverpool. Downing against tough opposition disappears. Heighway on the other hand revelled in it !!


its pointless comparing downing to heighway, you could go right through the entire side doing that, are you happy with agger and carragher when you could have hansen and lawrenson? are you happy with suarez`s 30 goals when rushie scored 49 one season? why dont our midfielders dominate games like graeme souness etc?
downing isnt the second coming of peter thompson but he`s a decent wide player who does a good job, instead of going back 40 years lets look at the recent past. out wide we`ve had players like kuyt, riera, pennant, mark gonzales and even at times doubled up our fullbacks with dossena and aurelio playing out there. i`d rather have downing than any of them.
yes we all wish it was the old days where we would just click our fingers and the best players from the other teams like gareth bale would crawl over broken glass for the chance to play for us but it`s not the old days anymore.
at the moment downing is doing his job, he`s not ripping the league to shreds but he`s not a liability either. our liabilities are the center of our defence and the center of our midfield, not wide midfield.
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Postby Benny The Noon » Tue May 07, 2013 1:10 pm

Well said
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