Liverpool FC Forum

[adamnbarrett]

Alonso and Garcia both start for Spain.

Vaya España 

[skipper]

So close!  Alonso had a header cleared off the line just before halftime.

Tunisia 1 - 0 Spain at halftime.  Quite surprising, though Spain have had chances.  I expect Espana to respond and play well in the second half.

[kingycrouch]

SPAIN 3 TUNISIA 1 COME ON SPAIN

[pablinho]

MOTM XAVI ALONSO

[skipper]

MOTM XAVI ALONSO

Do you mean Xavi or Xabi Alonso?

[tubby]

Alonso played well, Garcias loose passing coupled with Joaquins good performance will probably cost him his place in the next match but id expect some changes anyway now that Spain have qualified.

Man i wish we had the money to buy Torres! Wheres this investment already! It seems like last year we were hearing that invesment was "near".

[Bad Bob]

Alonso played well, Garcias loose passing coupled with Joaquins good performance will probably cost him his place in the next match but id expect some changes anyway now that Spain have qualified.

Man i wish we had the money to buy Torres! Wheres this investment already! It seems like last year we were hearing that invesment was "near".

Garcia didn't have a bad game--it just looked like Aragones decided to change tactics slightly in the second half.  Joaquin did okay but I don't think he's done enough to bump Luis out of the starting 11.

Alonso played well, though.  I wish he and Fabregas would start together and Xavi would sit...the Barcelona man hasn't impressed me that much in their two games and seems to be a bit of a ball hog in the middle.  When he's around it's as though Alonso is required to feed him the ball and let him start the move.

You know, I'm still not convinced by Torres.  His first goal was a very nice finish but the keeper's positioning was suspect and the pass really set him on his way.  Beyond that, I thought he was somewhat wasteful in possession and blasted away a few times when a team mate might have been picked out.  And, his penalty was poorly placed and only went in due to some soft keeping.  Perhaps I'm being too harsh on the lad but I much prefer Villa leading the line.

[account deleted by request]

I thought Alonso was awesome today the way he sprayed the ball out to all areas( more like his Liverpool form) hardly made a bad pass all the game. I had just started feeling sorry for Raul who had looked a peripheral figure when he goes and scores. Typical lol.

[addicted norwegian]

I thought Alonso was awesome today the way he sprayed the ball out to all areas( more like his Liverpool form) hardly made a bad pass all the game. I had just started feeling sorry for Raul who had looked a peripheral figure when he goes and scores. Typical lol.

obviously you weren`t the only one..

http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com/06/en/060619/1/7wj7.html

I can`t say that I have agreed with them in rating man of the match earlier this World Cup (i.e. when Lamps was named mom after the first England game - I thought he was ), but this time I totally agree   He was the mastermind of evrey build up for Spain last night, IMO a brilliant performance

[Anfield Kop]

He deserved to be man of the match after such a performance.

[48-1119859832]

Right, delusional it is then...

You see something in Frank Lampard no one else see's. How can you sit there and say Lampard's a good footballer who deserves a place in the England squad. You bring his club into it as usual. Jurgen Macho played for Chelsea, did that make him World Class? Pegguy Arphexad played for Liverpool and won six medals does that make him worthy of being selected for the French squad. Djemba-Djemba played for Man Utd, make him World Class does it?

Frank Lampard STARTS EVERY SINGLE GAME for the two-time English champions and was runner-up for World Footballer of the Year last year.  We are not talking about some reserve team waster or washed up has-been here.  You can't compare him to fecking Macho, Arphexad or Djemba-Djemba and you know it.

The fact of the matter is before Roman & merry millions came along, Lampard was a nothing player, he wasn't in the England squad, the papers didn't mention his name and even Chelsea supporters thought he was and as for West Ham fans they were glad to have gotten shot of him.

So in comes Roman, they splash out on Makelele, who is basically there to do all the donkey work for Lampard, so Frank can bomb up field and take a good 20 shots on goal and like with Cisse one's bound to sail in. Then when you buy Essien on top that gives Lampard even more stability at the back to roam forward and have lots of shots. He wouldn't be at Chelsea if it wasn't for him being English, he was seen by Ranieri and Mourinho just like John Terry the core of the Chelsea team, the heart of the Chelsea team.

Lampard would be a nothing player had Chelsea not bought Makelele, it's a simple fact. Lampard made it into the England team on a regular basis in 2003, what happened that year? Oh yeah Roman came in and Ranieri bought Makelele.

Lampard was no mug prior to Roman's arrival: he was a talented midfielder who was coming of age.  Ranieri thought highly enough of him to have him start every game and Mourinho has continued that trend.  If he was as sh!te as you suggest, don't you think he'd have been replaced by now--especially since Chelsea have the deep pockets to buy whoever they like?  And, don't give me the "it's because he's English" rubbish--Wenger has demonstrated that top managers won't field English players just because...they have to be worthy of their place.

As for the Makelele/Essien argument, I agree to a point: they have made Lampard better buy allowing him to focus on getting forward.  However, we can make a similar argument about Alonso/Sissoko freeing up Gerrard.  It's no coincidence that Stevie scored 20 goals for us this season, with those two chipping in the middle of the park.

Again, to clarify, Gerrard is TWICE the player Lampard is but that doesn't make Lampard sh!te.

f Lampard is as great as you say he is, then why doesn't he swap positions with Gerrard? Let Lampard defend and Gerrard roam uptop? After all Frank Lampard is such a great player, ain't that right, Bob?

Never said he was great...only said he was worthy of a place in this England squad.  Lampard can't do the holding role--as many have noted (a point I've never disputed)--on his day he can get you goals and that's obviously what Sven's banking on.  Since he seems to be out of form at the moment, though, I'd consider dropping him for Carrick to let Gerrard roam. 

Let me be clear about this: I am no fan of Lampard's.  I think he's vastly overrated and lacks the all-round game that would make him a truly "world class" player.  But, to sit there and suggest that he doesn't even deserve a place in the England squad is ridiculous.  I've got no beef with people who criticize his performance over the last two games: he's been woeful, end of.  But it simply goes too far to say he shouldn't be in the squad (who should be in Germany in his place then?).  And, to suggest that you are I could do his job better than him is so laughable that I assumed you were joking until you repeated yourself.  Your head needs checking, son.

As for the insults...you'll get over them and I've seen you take the p!ss with plenty of others on here so...pot, kettle, black...you get the picture.

I'll discuss Ferdinand another time...

Lampard starts every game because like him or not, he's got a decent shot, but that's all, I don't see him tracking back, defending, creating chances for others. The truth is Frank Lampard is playing professional becoz his dad was a Scout for West Ham, that's all. I watch Lampard and all he does, perhaps three or four passes a match and takes about twenty shots on goal in which one or two might sale in.

I can compare him to those players, because he's as good as them, he offers nothing that Gerrard doesn't offer, I'd happily accept Lampard being in the England team if he was a better player than Gerrard or was a better attacking player than Gerrard but he's not, he should be on the bench or on stand by. He's only in the England team because the scummy tabloids kiss his a.rse. It's no secret that Sven goes along with what the media want. It's the media who run England, and Frank is a hot favourite with those trash rags.

Lampard is a very basic midfielder who excels in virtually nothing, for every attribute he can pull off effectively there's always one or two midfielder who can pull it much better and that's a fact.

Yeah Gerrard did get help from Sissoko and Alonso, but Gerrard brings so much to the table. He's a leader, he's loyal, he's a better footballer than Lampard. The only thing Lampard offers is shots on goal and even at times that looks way above his station.

It's not laughable to suggest that Lampard's not good enough to be in the England squad. There are quite a few players who you could question them being in the England squad. I don't believe this England squad currently in the World Cup is the best team iof English players, just because a player plays for a big club or a club that challenges for major honours doesn't mean they are  great players. You gonna tell me Sean Dundee, Mario Stanic were good players? Sam Delle Bona too?

[Bad Bob]

Lampard starts every game because like him or not, he's got a decent shot, but that's all, I don't see him tracking back, defending, creating chances for others. The truth is Frank Lampard is playing professional becoz his dad was a Scout for West Ham, that's all. I watch Lampard and all he does, perhaps three or four passes a match and takes about twenty shots on goal in which one or two might sale in.

I can compare him to those players, because he's as good as them, he offers nothing that Gerrard doesn't offer, I'd happily accept Lampard being in the England team if he was a better player than Gerrard or was a better attacking player than Gerrard but he's not, he should be on the bench or on stand by. He's only in the England team because the scummy tabloids kiss his a.rse. It's no secret that Sven goes along with what the media want. It's the media who run England, and Frank is a hot favourite with those trash rags.

Lampard is a very basic midfielder who excels in virtually nothing, for every attribute he can pull off effectively there's always one or two midfielder who can pull it much better and that's a fact.

Yeah Gerrard did get help from Sissoko and Alonso, but Gerrard brings so much to the table. He's a leader, he's loyal, he's a better footballer than Lampard. The only thing Lampard offers is shots on goal and even at times that looks way above his station.

It's not laughable to suggest that Lampard's not good enough to be in the England squad. There are quite a few players who you could question them being in the England squad. I don't believe this England squad currently in the World Cup is the best team iof English players, just because a player plays for a big club or a club that challenges for major honours doesn't mean they are  great players. You gonna tell me Sean Dundee, Mario Stanic were good players? Sam Delle Bona too?

Oasis, mate, I've highlighted a few of your comments that I take issue with...

1) Lampard only starts every game for the 2-time English champions because his Dad used to be a scout for West Ham?  Utter bollox mate and you know it.  He may be over-rated but he's got enough in his locker to keep some of Chelsea's squad players off the pitch each week--squad players who would be starters at most clubs in England.  I'm through arguing this point with you, though.  If you honestly think that the fix is in to get him into Chelsea's side week in, week out I'm not going to waste my time trying to make you see reason.

2) So you admit that he should at least make the bench for England now?  This was my whole point in criticizing your first post--you said he wasn't good enough to even be selected for England!  Now, you've come around to a reasonable position....kudos! 

3) So, who would you have preferred Sven select this time around, out of curiosity?  Who rates a call-up for England and which of the current squad simply should not be in Germany?  And if you include Lampard and Ferninand in the latter list you're off your trolly! 

4) You're right, playing for a big club doesn't mean a player is good enough for England (Heskey! Butt!) but Lampard, for all of his many flaws, is good enough to make this England squad--a squad that many rate as one of the best England squads in a long while.

As for the Gerrard vs Lampard debate there is no debate: I never once said that Lampard was anywhere near Gerrard in terms of ability, versatility, heart, stamina etc.  Gerrard is England's best midfielder by a long stretch and he puts Lampard firmly in the shade.  Given that the pair are not clicking, Sven is right to experiment.  I will continue to challenge your view that Lampard isn't good enough to at least make the bench for England, though.

[48-1119859832]

No, Bob, Lampard only plays for Chelsea because he has a good shot and can shoot from distance, he also scores goals. Ranieri bought Lampard to Chelsea because at the time he was an up and coming young midfielder who had potential to be a good player. Lucky for Lampard he's able to score goals and shoot from far out. With Mourinho he was bound to stay a midfielder who scores goals is what Mourinho wanted and that's what Mourinho has in Lampard. Mourinho likes his midfield to score a vast majority of his teams goals and Lampard can do this and Lampard has been able to do this because he has a great player like Makelele behind him and now has more reinforcements with Essien. The test with Lampard is will he be able to continue to continue to keep up this scoring run now that Chelsea have Ballack.

Lampard shouldn't be in the team unless Gerrard, Carrick and the Man on the Moon is injured, I'd rather we had Reo-Coker, Carrick and Parker ahead in the pecking order. They all offer more to the team than Lampard does.

Well Reo-Coker, Pennant, Asthon, Bent, Defoe and Parker all deserve call ups. Beckham, Hargreaves, Robinson, Ferdinand and Lampard should all be dropped. I spose we haven't got anyone better than Paul Robinson, as Kirkland is injured.

The squad is good with individual talent, yes, if you look at it like that then England have one of the best teams in the World and be right we should be second favourites. But individuals can't win matches, it takes an effort from all eleven players and from what I've seen of England down the years we have never really gelled like a proper team. Probably 1990 was the last time England looked like a compact, well organised and great football team and even that wasn't enough.

You can continue to challenge it Bob, it won't make a blind bit of difference, I'm not going to comment on this anymore, seeing as neither of us will agree with each other. We can go around in circles but that would be a total waste of time.

[radun5]

You gonna tell me Sean Dundee, Mario Stanic were good players? Sam Delle Bona too?

I can't argue about Sean Dundee, but surely Mario Stanic was a good enough player. I have not seen him often at club level, but for Croatia (and for Parma, when he played there) he was producing the goods in his best years. I do believe you're harsh on him.

[El Nino_#9]

Beckham, Hargreaves, Robinson, Ferdinand and Lampard should all be dropped.

Why?