Liverpool FC Forum

[JC_81]

And yet Didi didn't start the game? But I agree he was a fantastic DM. Not sure that I agree with your assessment of  Harry Kewell. Was never a massive fan. If somebody far.ted in his general direction he'd be out for a month !!!
.

As my name hints, I was a fan of Harry, but injuries robbed us of his best years. His first season was a blinder and he also played a big part in our 3-1 over Olympiarcos, setting up two and running their full back ragged.

His first season was his best but do you really think that 7 goals and 2 assists in 36 Premiership games can be regarded as playing a blinder given the position he played? Definitely talented but I was never sure about his overall commitment.[/quote]

Kewell had a decent first season, but with alot of dips in form, then there was injuries. I believed his best season in a red shirt came in 2005/2006.

He was part of the best midfield I've seen at Liverpool when we had him on the left, Gerrard on the right, Momo and Alonso in the centre.[/quote]

You seriously do get the rose-tinted glasses on when you talk about previous sides.

The 'best midfield you've seen at Liverpool'?  Of that midfield you constantly slated Benitez for playing Gerrard on the right (can't have been that bad a decision if it was the best midfield you've seen though!).  You also constantly singled out Sissoko for abuse due to his lack of ability in passing (again he can't have been that bad if he held down a place in centre mid in the best Liverpool midfield you've seen!).  

[Stu the Red]

And yet Didi didn't start the game? But I agree he was a fantastic DM. Not sure that I agree with your assessment of  Harry Kewell. Was never a massive fan. If somebody far.ted in his general direction he'd be out for a month !!!
.

As my name hints, I was a fan of Harry, but injuries robbed us of his best years. His first season was a blinder and he also played a big part in our 3-1 over Olympiarcos, setting up two and running their full back ragged.

His first season was his best but do you really think that 7 goals and 2 assists in 36 Premiership games can be regarded as playing a blinder given the position he played? Definitely talented but I was never sure about his overall commitment.

Kewell had a decent first season, but with alot of dips in form, then there was injuries. I believed his best season in a red shirt came in 2005/2006.

He was part of the best midfield I've seen at Liverpool when we had him on the left, Gerrard on the right, Momo and Alonso in the centre.[/quote]

You seriously do get the rose-tinted glasses on when you talk about previous sides.

The 'best midfield you've seen at Liverpool'?  Of that midfield you constantly slated Benitez for playing Gerrard on the right (can't have been that bad a decision if it was the best midfield you've seen though!).  You also constantly singled out Sissoko for abuse due to his lack of ability in passing (again he can't have been that bad if he held down a place in centre mid in the best Liverpool midfield you've seen!).   [/quote]

Again another clueless, idiotic post designed to cause an arguement.

I singled out "Sissoko" for abuse? So because Benitez compared him to Vieira and I had the balls to say he'd never be that good and he wasn't fit to lace Vieira's boots...

That means I slagged him off and thought he was rubbish?

       

By the way, who was right about Sissoko... me? Or Benitez?

[kazza]

From Skysports

As Sir Ian Botham's cricket career entered its twilight years and his bowling lost its nip, his former England captain Mike Brearley opined that there might be a role for the erstwhile all-rounder as a specialist batsman. But the outspoken Geoffrey Boycott was adamant: Botham had become accustomed to doing everything and lacked the discipline to focus his efforts on making himself the very best batsman he could be.

Like Botham, Gerrard is one of his sport's great all-rounders. A physically robust player with strength and stamina, the ability to score and create, tackle and head the ball. If you were building a player with the key attributes to master the game's core disciplines, he'd look a lot like Gerrard. At his best, the Liverpool captain resembles the complete player, bestriding the field like a colossus and at the heart of everything.

Now it is Gerrard in the autumn of his career and he too must adapt to survive. But some have doubts about his ability to use his brain once the body falters. The infamous words of the great Italian coach Arrigo Sacchi have long provided a weapon for the critics. "Gerrard's a great footballer, but perhaps not a great player," Sacchi suggested. "Strength, passion, technique, athleticism, all of these are very important. But they are a means to an end, not an end in itself."

Liverpool manager Brendan Rodgers appears to have decided that Gerrard does have the necessary nous to thrive in a role that requires expert positional discipline. Rodgers switched the skipper with Lucas Leiva for Sunday's 5-3 win at Stoke City in the belief that Gerrard's trademark passing qualities from deep could give the Reds a new dimension. "That's what he brings that perhaps Lucas doesn't in that position," explained former team-mate Jamie Carragher. "Lucas is great defensively but he adds more with the ball. From that position, he's like the quarterback."

Speaking after the game, there was a typically excitable tone to Rodgers' voice as he enthused about Gerrard's potential in that holding role. "I think you see in his range of pass he is someone I feel that has the profile to play that role," Rodgers told Sky Sports. "How he co-ordinates the game, his range of passing, his leadership, his personality. You need a player with big personality to play in that controlling role because you are on the ball a lot you've got to make choices whether to play deep, whether to play short and I thought he was outstanding in that."

Rodgers is quite right in his assertion that good decision-making is an essential tool for the holding midfielder to possess. But Gerrard's range of passing is not necessarily an easy fit with the demands of a role that necessitates a degree of caution. Surrendering possession in the final third is understandable. But giving away the ball in deep areas, even if attempting long passes, can be a problem if a team is committed to a possession-based game. If it's a quarterback Rodgers wants, it's tempting to conclude he's in the wrong game.

Consider the statistics of those Premier League players associated with the position. Arsenal's sitting midfielders Mathieu Flamini and Mikel Arteta both boast pass completion rates of 92 per cent. For Lucas it is 91 per cent and Chelsea's John Obi Mikel also finds a team-mate with nine of every 10 passes. Even Manchester United's Michael Carrick and Manchester City's Fernandinho - holding midfielders with an eye for progressing the attack - have completion rates of 87 per cent.


Steven Gerrard was ambitious with his passing from deep at Stoke (red = unsuccessful)
As his interpretation of the role at the Britannia Stadium showed, Gerrard remains an altogether different beast. His pass completion rate against Stoke was just 76 per cent. That desire to look forward with his passing saw him surrender possession on 18 occasions, unusual for a player in that role and three times as many as Lucas, despite the Brazilian receiving the ball in trickier positions higher up the field.

It's not that Gerrard failed to do the conspicuous dirty work of the defensive midfielder. He won possession more than any player on the pitch and nobody on either side made more tackles. But the three goals that Liverpool conceded suggest that this tactical tweak was not an unqualified success, particularly given that a two-goal lead was surrendered. The holding midfielder must be expected to play a part in shutting down the game at that stage, something Liverpool failed to do.

More specifically, Gerrard was at least partially culpable for two of the goals conceded. Looking to dart forward rather than provide fellow midfielder Jordan Henderson with a simple lay-off option, a misunderstanding allowed Charlie Adam the opportunity to find space in a central position 20 yards out to blast home an equaliser. After the interval, the skipper then surrendered possession to allow Stoke to break and score a third through Jonathan Walters.

Gerrard himself seemed to hint at these teething problems in his post-match interview. "We've been working on it in the week," he told Sky Sports. "The manager has told me that going forward I'll play this role a lot more. It's going to take a little bit of time to get used to but I've played it many times for England and a few times for Liverpool in the early days so I'll be comfortable in there once I've got a few games in."

Heart of the issue

In a sense, this cuts to the heart of the issue. Gerrard can learn this role, but is it one he really wants? Is he committed to making a success of it? Or is it the lure of glory and responsibility that comes with being involved in events in the opposition area that still drives the Anfield hero? Perhaps the response to questions regarding the penalty award for a foul on Raheem Sterling was telling: "I was far away from it with this new holding role so I couldn't really tell."


The hero of Istanbul in 2005
Former Liverpool holding midfielder Dietmar Hamann, a player who embodies like no other the significance of the role after his game-changing introduction as a substitute in the 2005 Champions League final in Istanbul, believes Gerrard's mind-set is key. "Naturally, when you get a bit older you get a bit slower and the further backwards you move," said Hamann. "I think he's so good he can play in any position but this is the position in which he can play the longest for. It's up to him. If he wants to put his mind to it he can play there for the next two or three years."

Another former team-mate Jamie Carragher recognises that a change in attitude is vital if his old friend is to embrace this new role. "I think the longer it goes on, the more he'll realise that he's not the Steven Gerrard of Istanbul, charging about the pitch creating goals and scoring goals," Carragher told Sky Sports. If Gerrard can make that change and adapt, he can succeed where Botham failed and extend his career at the top. If not, this could be an experiment that Rodgers is forced to abandon.

[kazza]

From Skysports

As Sir Ian Botham's cricket career entered its twilight years and his bowling lost its nip, his former England captain Mike Brearley opined that there might be a role for the erstwhile all-rounder as a specialist batsman. But the outspoken Geoffrey Boycott was adamant: Botham had become accustomed to doing everything and lacked the discipline to focus his efforts on making himself the very best batsman he could be.

Like Botham, Gerrard is one of his sport's great all-rounders. A physically robust player with strength and stamina, the ability to score and create, tackle and head the ball. If you were building a player with the key attributes to master the game's core disciplines, he'd look a lot like Gerrard. At his best, the Liverpool captain resembles the complete player, bestriding the field like a colossus and at the heart of everything.

Now it is Gerrard in the autumn of his career and he too must adapt to survive. But some have doubts about his ability to use his brain once the body falters. The infamous words of the great Italian coach Arrigo Sacchi have long provided a weapon for the critics. "Gerrard's a great footballer, but perhaps not a great player," Sacchi suggested. "Strength, passion, technique, athleticism, all of these are very important. But they are a means to an end, not an end in itself."

Liverpool manager Brendan Rodgers appears to have decided that Gerrard does have the necessary nous to thrive in a role that requires expert positional discipline. Rodgers switched the skipper with Lucas Leiva for Sunday's 5-3 win at Stoke City in the belief that Gerrard's trademark passing qualities from deep could give the Reds a new dimension. "That's what he brings that perhaps Lucas doesn't in that position," explained former team-mate Jamie Carragher. "Lucas is great defensively but he adds more with the ball. From that position, he's like the quarterback."

Speaking after the game, there was a typically excitable tone to Rodgers' voice as he enthused about Gerrard's potential in that holding role. "I think you see in his range of pass he is someone I feel that has the profile to play that role," Rodgers told Sky Sports. "How he co-ordinates the game, his range of passing, his leadership, his personality. You need a player with big personality to play in that controlling role because you are on the ball a lot you've got to make choices whether to play deep, whether to play short and I thought he was outstanding in that."

Rodgers is quite right in his assertion that good decision-making is an essential tool for the holding midfielder to possess. But Gerrard's range of passing is not necessarily an easy fit with the demands of a role that necessitates a degree of caution. Surrendering possession in the final third is understandable. But giving away the ball in deep areas, even if attempting long passes, can be a problem if a team is committed to a possession-based game. If it's a quarterback Rodgers wants, it's tempting to conclude he's in the wrong game.

Consider the statistics of those Premier League players associated with the position. Arsenal's sitting midfielders Mathieu Flamini and Mikel Arteta both boast pass completion rates of 92 per cent. For Lucas it is 91 per cent and Chelsea's John Obi Mikel also finds a team-mate with nine of every 10 passes. Even Manchester United's Michael Carrick and Manchester City's Fernandinho - holding midfielders with an eye for progressing the attack - have completion rates of 87 per cent.


Steven Gerrard was ambitious with his passing from deep at Stoke (red = unsuccessful)
As his interpretation of the role at the Britannia Stadium showed, Gerrard remains an altogether different beast. His pass completion rate against Stoke was just 76 per cent. That desire to look forward with his passing saw him surrender possession on 18 occasions, unusual for a player in that role and three times as many as Lucas, despite the Brazilian receiving the ball in trickier positions higher up the field.

It's not that Gerrard failed to do the conspicuous dirty work of the defensive midfielder. He won possession more than any player on the pitch and nobody on either side made more tackles. But the three goals that Liverpool conceded suggest that this tactical tweak was not an unqualified success, particularly given that a two-goal lead was surrendered. The holding midfielder must be expected to play a part in shutting down the game at that stage, something Liverpool failed to do.

More specifically, Gerrard was at least partially culpable for two of the goals conceded. Looking to dart forward rather than provide fellow midfielder Jordan Henderson with a simple lay-off option, a misunderstanding allowed Charlie Adam the opportunity to find space in a central position 20 yards out to blast home an equaliser. After the interval, the skipper then surrendered possession to allow Stoke to break and score a third through Jonathan Walters.

Gerrard himself seemed to hint at these teething problems in his post-match interview. "We've been working on it in the week," he told Sky Sports. "The manager has told me that going forward I'll play this role a lot more. It's going to take a little bit of time to get used to but I've played it many times for England and a few times for Liverpool in the early days so I'll be comfortable in there once I've got a few games in."

Heart of the issue

In a sense, this cuts to the heart of the issue. Gerrard can learn this role, but is it one he really wants? Is he committed to making a success of it? Or is it the lure of glory and responsibility that comes with being involved in events in the opposition area that still drives the Anfield hero? Perhaps the response to questions regarding the penalty award for a foul on Raheem Sterling was telling: "I was far away from it with this new holding role so I couldn't really tell."


The hero of Istanbul in 2005
Former Liverpool holding midfielder Dietmar Hamann, a player who embodies like no other the significance of the role after his game-changing introduction as a substitute in the 2005 Champions League final in Istanbul, believes Gerrard's mind-set is key. "Naturally, when you get a bit older you get a bit slower and the further backwards you move," said Hamann. "I think he's so good he can play in any position but this is the position in which he can play the longest for. It's up to him. If he wants to put his mind to it he can play there for the next two or three years."

Another former team-mate Jamie Carragher recognises that a change in attitude is vital if his old friend is to embrace this new role. "I think the longer it goes on, the more he'll realise that he's not the Steven Gerrard of Istanbul, charging about the pitch creating goals and scoring goals," Carragher told Sky Sports. If Gerrard can make that change and adapt, he can succeed where Botham failed and extend his career at the top. If not, this could be an experiment that Rodgers is forced to abandon.

[SouthCoastShankly]

I agree in parts. Gerrard's game has to adapt, that much is clear. He isn't getting any younger.

However the Stoke game is a bad example they used. It was his first full game back from injury, match sharpness was lacking and it showed with unusually poor passing. I don't expect him to repeat that sort of performance often.

[The Good Yank]

I agree in parts. Gerrard's game has to adapt, that much is clear. He isn't getting any younger.

However the Stoke game is a bad example they used. It was his first full game back from injury, match sharpness was lacking and it showed with unusually poor passing. I don't expect him to repeat that sort of performance often.

I do agree that Stevie 's role needs to change.  However.  I  think he'd be better suited further up the pitch than further back.  IMO of course.

[ConnO'var]

I have been reading this thread with great interest.

While I am in fundamental disagreement with Yakka, Supersub and RBG, there is some element of truth to their points.

Stevie has slown down... but he is not IMO, the root cause of our midfield woes. As highly as I used to think of Lucas, he is the problem. He has not been the same player since his injury and right now, i believe that the midfield engine as a whole is being hindered by this one faulty cog which throws the whole engine out of tune. If unaddressed, the remaining components of the midfield has to carry the load and as such cannot perform their own individual roles as effectively.

Hendo is going to be fine. A midfield triumvirate of Gerrard at the base and 2 more box to box midfielders that can press, provide an attacking impetus and keep things ticking over nicely would work a lot better. Hendo can do the job of one but neither Lucas or Allen is suitable for the other. With Allen being the lesser of two evils.

Long term we will need to replace Gerrard and I feel that he can slot in nicely as centreback as he winds down his career. But the more immediate need is for a big, strong, ball playing enforcer to partner Hendo. We are too often being bullied and outmuscled in midfield. Basically a Souness or McMahon or Keane or Vieira or Toure type of player. In fact, i would even say that a Flamini type player would suffice. Someone who can add a little bit of "nasty" to steel us up. Make no mistake about it.... IMO, the addition of Falmini to the Arsenal midfield this season is even more important than Ozil.

Finding one is the problem as the last time I looked, there are not many that suit the above job description and those that do are already at big clubs and will be hesitant to move.

[LFC1990]

But the more immediate need is for a big, strong, ball playing enforcer to partner Hendo. We are too often being bullied and outmuscled in midfield. Basically a Souness or McMahon or Keane or Vieira or Toure type of player. In fact, i would even say that a Flamini type player would suffice. Someone who can add a little bit of "nasty" to steel us up. Make no mistake about it.... IMO, the addition of Falmini to the Arsenal midfield this season is even more important than Ozil.

Finding one is the problem as the last time I looked, there are not many that suit the above job description and those that do are already at big clubs and will be hesitant to move.

There is one and he plays for West ham united. If we had Diame in our side I know we would have taken points against Chelsea and Citeh

[maypaxvobiscum]

But the more immediate need is for a big, strong, ball playing enforcer to partner Hendo. We are too often being bullied and outmuscled in midfield. Basically a Souness or McMahon or Keane or Vieira or Toure type of player. In fact, i would even say that a Flamini type player would suffice. Someone who can add a little bit of "nasty" to steel us up. Make no mistake about it.... IMO, the addition of Falmini to the Arsenal midfield this season is even more important than Ozil.

Finding one is the problem as the last time I looked, there are not many that suit the above job description and those that do are already at big clubs and will be hesitant to move.

There is one and he plays for West ham united. If we had Diame in our side I know we would have taken points against Chelsea and Citeh

Diame is overrated. He wouldn't make it at a club like Liverpool. He isn't dynamic enough IMHO.
The player I'm most keen on in midfield is Cabaye as he's been involved in big games and tournaments for his country and his club isn't doing too badly either.
Alternatively, Steven Defour is another good option too. Or maybe I'm confusing him with another Belgian, Alex Witself or something.

[Stu the Red]

But the more immediate need is for a big, strong, ball playing enforcer to partner Hendo. We are too often being bullied and outmuscled in midfield. Basically a Souness or McMahon or Keane or Vieira or Toure type of player. In fact, i would even say that a Flamini type player would suffice. Someone who can add a little bit of "nasty" to steel us up. Make no mistake about it.... IMO, the addition of Falmini to the Arsenal midfield this season is even more important than Ozil.

Finding one is the problem as the last time I looked, there are not many that suit the above job description and those that do are already at big clubs and will be hesitant to move.

There is one and he plays for West ham united. If we had Diame in our side I know we would have taken points against Chelsea and Citeh

Diame is overrated. He wouldn't make it at a club like Liverpool. He isn't dynamic enough IMHO.
The player I'm most keen on in midfield is Cabaye as he's been involved in big games and tournaments for his country and his club isn't doing too badly either.
Alternatively, Steven Defour is another good option too. Or maybe I'm confusing him with another Belgian, Alex Witself or something.

I'd take Defour, Cabaye, Schneiderlin or Wanyama...

Diame though? Na, not for me.

[RED BEERGOGGLES]

I have been reading this thread with great interest.

While I am in fundamental disagreement with Yakka, Supersub and RBG, there is some element of truth to their points.

Stevie has slown down... but he is not IMO, the root cause of our midfield woes. As highly as I used to think of Lucas, he is the problem. He has not been the same player since his injury and right now, i believe that the midfield engine as a whole is being hindered by this one faulty cog which throws the whole engine out of tune. If unaddressed, the remaining components of the midfield has to carry the load and as such cannot perform their own individual roles as effectively.

Hendo is going to be fine. A midfield triumvirate of Gerrard at the base and 2 more box to box midfielders that can press, provide an attacking impetus and keep things ticking over nicely would work a lot better. Hendo can do the job of one but neither Lucas or Allen is suitable for the other. With Allen being the lesser of two evils.

Long term we will need to replace Gerrard and I feel that he can slot in nicely as centreback as he winds down his career. But the more immediate need is for a big, strong, ball playing enforcer to partner Hendo. We are too often being bullied and outmuscled in midfield. Basically a Souness or McMahon or Keane or Vieira or Toure type of player. In fact, i would even say that a Flamini type player would suffice. Someone who can add a little bit of "nasty" to steel us up. Make no mistake about it.... IMO, the addition of Falmini to the Arsenal midfield this season is even more important than Ozil.

Finding one is the problem as the last time I looked, there are not many that suit the above job description and those that do are already at big clubs and will be hesitant to move.

Firstly ,Its good to read your posts again fella.

Although I cant agree with your appraisal mate ,as I think Gerrard's inclusion in the team leaves us bereft of energy, and robs us of our usual pressing
game ,returning Rodgers philosophy  firmly to the drawing board .

Gerrard  neither has the pace to close players down quickly or apparently the humility to adapt his game to suit the short precise passing game Rodgers
insists on playing.... I mean for all the talk of Lucas being less combative in the middle he still managed 3 50/50 challenges with Charlie Adam a player
who is renowned for leaving his foot in.....Gerrard's the problem mate ,and if Lucas is dropped when Allen returns to the team (as expected) this will be
apparent when we play the Bitterz,because Barry and McCarthy will have a veritable field day.

Incidentally I thought Gerrard gave possession up far too readily with little attempt to regain the ball ,he did however attempt far less 40 yard punts
up field and made one sliding tackle (cue rapturous applause from the Kop) which I suppose is a start ,but he simply cant be expected to play this
short passing game if he gifts away possession so frivolously. I thought he would return invigorated and eager to impress after having far too many
games prior to his injury without even attempting a  tackle of any description .....Something that years ago would of been considered highly unacceptable
for one who has earned his reverence by proffering no less than 100% and displaying no little passion whilst in our colours and playing in front of fans who
have shown unconditional love for countless years.....

I will concur that Lucas hasn't been as combative prior to his injury and we need strengthening  in that department ,but at present he is the only player
who can do the ugly stuff like stifling and breaking up the opponents play.....No other player offers us this to the same extent Lucas does,but our priority
after adding new blood to our back line should be a player to replicate what Gerrard used to afford this team going forward.

[parchpea]

Gerrard needs to impress further back in this new role and in my opinion looked off the pace against Stoke and even Charlie Adam
looked lively against him. I know he's been injured but still.

Far be it from me to dismiss a man like Gerrard but every dog has its day and Stevie has a lot of miles on the clock, and I am not
convinced there is whole lot left in the tank and I suspect he knows that.

On a personal level he will see the team has done very well without him and I just hope the manager and himself know when its time
to move aside, and whilst I would love the lad to prove me wrong I anticipate that may not be too far away now.

Not that arsed over England to be honest but he's either going to look horrible and shot to pieces at the World Cup or give his last drop
before he packs in but return in bits for us 

[eds]

What do we do with Stevie?

The man has given every ounce of his energy to save this club slipping into mediocrity over the last 15 years. He truly has been the heart and soul of this club for over the last decade and it seems he is on his last legs, starting to become more and more like a square peg where our midfield seems to have a problem only a round peg will solve.

If we remove Lucas from the side and bring in a quality DM that can tackle, pass and distribute then Stevie's "Pirlo" type role shouldn't even be required. Henderson has come of age this season and playing the box-to-box role now, while Allen is a poor man's Alonso (and the jury is still out on). So what does Rodger's do? Tough one because the man deserves more than sitting on the bench, seeing his career play out in bursts of 20-30 minutes replacing our tiring starting midfielders.

I really hope we can sort out our midfield out this year because as a club for everything Stevie has given, he deserves a premier league winner's medal around his neck. I'm convinced that if we can replace Lucas and Allen with better quality players we will have a team that can win it next season. We are so close and I think he knows it as well, whether he has the engine and legs to give it one more last crack next season, is up for debate. But wouldn't it be wonderful and the stuff of Hollywood move endings if we won it in his last season.   

[ConnO'var]

RBG.... Cheers mate....
Been tied up with work and the family has since relocated to Singapore as we are winding down the project here in Qatar so been a bit swamped. II'll be joining them soon for the next assignment... but till then, I'm a temporary single.

On the Gerrard issue, I guess we have to agree to disagree. Yes he is not the player he once was and playing as a box to box midfielder is no longer a viable option nor is it feasible to expect the same kind of output playing behind the strikers.

But he still has tonnes to offer and i for one think that he still has more than enough in his locker to make the new role BR envisages for him a reality.
I don't quite agree with all the stats showing lucas loses possession less readily than Gerrard. Gerrard loses possesion trying to acheive something going forward instead of lateral or bacwards passing in  attempt to retain possession. In other words he is trying to make things happen.

Its complicated and I'm struggling how to put this into words.  (This new editor non scrolling thing is a pain... I'm trying to type blind!)

I am just saying that the standards that Gerrard has set over his career may have been his own worse enemy. Now that he is not at the peak of his prowess, there is a perception thathe is no longer any good, where the truth of the matter is that he is still an outstanding midfielder... just no longer a world class one.

you know what I mean?

[supersub]

[quote="[url=http://www.liverpoolfc-newkit.co.uk/viewtopic.php?p=1227277#p1227277]RED BEERGOGGLES » Thu Jan 16, 2014 11:57 pm[/url
Firstly ,Its good to read your posts again fella.

Although I cant agree with your appraisal mate ,as I think Gerrard's inclusion in the team leaves us bereft of energy, and robs us of our usual pressing
game ,returning Rodgers philosophy  firmly to the drawing board .

Gerrard  neither has the pace to close players down quickly or apparently the humility to adapt his game to suit the short precise passing game Rodgers
insists on playing.... I mean for all the talk of Lucas being less combative in the middle he still managed 3 50/50 challenges with Charlie Adam a player
who is renowned for leaving his foot in.....Gerrard's the problem mate ,and if Lucas is dropped when Allen returns to the team (as expected) this will be
apparent when we play the Bitterz,because Barry and McCarthy will have a veritable field day.

Incidentally I thought Gerrard gave possession up far too readily with little attempt to regain the ball ,he did however attempt far less 40 yard punts
up field and made one sliding tackle (cue rapturous applause from the Kop) which I suppose is a start ,but he simply cant be expected to play this
short passing game if he gifts away possession so frivolously. I thought he would return invigorated and eager to impress after having far too many
games prior to his injury without even attempting a  tackle of any description .....Something that years ago would of been considered highly unacceptable
for one who has earned his reverence by proffering no less than 100% and displaying no little passion whilst in our colours and playing in front of fans who
have shown unconditional love for countless years.....

I will concur that Lucas hasn't been as combative prior to his injury and we need strengthening  in that department ,but at present he is the only player
who can do the ugly stuff like stifling and breaking up the opponents play.....No other player offers us this to the same extent Lucas does,but our priority
after adding new blood to our back line should be a player to replicate what Gerrard used to afford this team going forward.[/quote]


Completely agree......