Liverpool FC Forum

by **SupitsJonF** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 4:41 am

Who calls someone herpes :laugh:

by **Octsky** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 5:23 am

Past and future 10 games.

Fiorentina A 0-2
Chelsea A 0-2
Sunderland A 0-1
Lyon H 1-2
Manchester United H EPL
Arsenal A League cup
Fulham A EPL
Lyon A Champs league
Birmingham City H EPL

For those who are pro-Rafa, where do you draw the line where enough is enough??
From what i see we have 2 very tricky games coming up, manyoos and gooners. Then followed by Fulham and Lyon away. It will be very clear by then, possibly the only cup we have left is the FA cup.

I be very surprised if the board hasn't been secretly conjuring up a Plan B.
Win at manyoos and Rafa might just buy himself a few more games. Perhaps we can live without Rafa, its Torres and Stevie our most valuable assets and the team should be build around them. Torres, future captain of LFC.

by **ruskiy playmaker** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 5:24 am

baldricks_cunning_plan wrote:Yeah lets sack Rafa, lets sack the one saving grace we have left in terms of authority at the club.

He's been given a pittance to spend this summer to replace last year's player of the year, as well as the greatest centre half we've had in the Premiership era and one of the most reliable right backs in the country. He sold Alonso for 30 million, since then has spent around 20 on it to try and replace him, wheres the other 10 million gone? That's not including the money he got for selling Arby, Leto, Hobbs, Anderson and Hammill. He's had to sell and even then still isn't given that money to buy back.

He's had a squad that's full of injuries, thanks to our overly kind international schedule. There's not a great deal he can do about that, no matter how much people wanna blame Rafa for it.

His options are limited and he can't just pluck another top quality player out of thin air, quality costs and with those f*****g robbing b******s in charge of the club, Rafa isn't gonna be given the money to buy top quality. He's always gonna be having to settle for second or third best in terms of quality. It's testament to how good a manger he is when you see what he's achieved under such disturbing circumstances.

I'm not talking about the trophies he's won because they were won under the Moores' regime.

I'm talking about taking us to our highest points tally in our history. Yes our f*****g history. The history that has won us 18 League titles, none of those title winning sides won as many points as Rafa Benitez' Liverpool side did last year. I'm talking about constantly fighting the owners for the good of the club, Rafa is the one who wants good for the club and Rafa is good for the club. I'm talking about us t******g United in their own back f*****g yard. In case you missed that game it ended 4-1. Rafa outclassed Ferguson in every department. He outclassed money bags Hughes last year 3-2. He outclassed money bags Scolari. He's outclassed every so called top manager.

And it was this squad (pretty much) and these tactics that set us so well last year. Difference being? That's right dimwits, the players are the ones not performing and without decent f*****g owners giving Rafa the funds he needs, he's not gonna be able to bring in a better class of player. His hands are tied.

But yeah lets sack him and bring in a yes man for those two con artist c***s who claim to be owning the club. You'll only ever own this club by name you pair of t***s, but in spirit the club will always belong to the fans. But they'll bring in a yes man who they can control, Rafa is anything but that and is always fighting our corner for us.

If you want him sacked then you've a f*****g lot to learn about football in general and even more so Liverpool Football Club. Top clubs, and this one especially, don't sack their managers because of a few bad results. Top clubs, and especially this one, are proud to have managers of the caliber of Rafa Benitez and should do everything in their power to keep him as boss.

There's very few top class managers with Rafa's record, dignity, pride, loyalty and class but what the heck, lets just f*****g sack him and bring in Mark McGhee.

Best post of the day.

by **Owzat** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 6:35 am

It may be an unpopular suggestion, these things usually are, but those so against it now may probably end up drawing the same conclusion but at a later date. I spent some of last night trying to find out our worst run of successive defeats, four may not be the worst, but it sure as hell isn't clever

MOST CONSECUTIVE DEFEATS?

13/03/1909 Liverpool 1-2 Bristol
20/03/1909 Preston 2-0 Liverpool
27/03/1909 Liverpool 1-2 Middlesbro
03/04/1909 Man City 4-0 Liverpool
09/04/1909 Everton 5-0 Liverpool
10/04/1909 Liverpool 1-2 Sheff Wed

14/09/1912 Bradford 2-0 Liverpool
21/09/1912 Liverpool 1-2 Man City
28/09/1912 West Brom 3-1 Liverpool
05/10/1912 Liverpool 0-2 Everton
12/10/1912 Sheff Wed 1-0 Liverpool
14/10/1912 Sheff Utd 4-1 Liverpool

17/01/1948 Burnley 3-0 Liverpool
24/01/1948 English FA Cup Man Utd 3-0 Liverpool
31/01/1948 Liverpool 0-3 Portsmouth
07/02/1948 Bolton 3-0 Liverpool
21/02/1948 Liverpool 0-1 Middlesbro
28/02/1948 Chelsea 3-1 Liverpool

Three times we've lost six in a row, we've lost five in a row plenty of times and four is not that uncommon over the 100+ years of LFC.

DISCLAIMER : NOTE the question mark, I do not know for sure if six is the most consecutive defeats, but that is the most I could find in the seasons we suffered our most league defeats which was the obvious starting point. Google did not supply a firm answer, if anyone does know then shout (or can find out)

by **LittleHobo** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 6:43 am

rafas arrogance has got us in this position

replacing alonso (one of our top 3 key men) with a guy who wont be fit for the first 4 months

that decision was horrible

also signing johnson hasnt improved us, we are more suited to a solid right back rather than a cafu type...........a cheaper option then spend other money to fill other squad gaps.......

by **Owzat** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 7:09 am

And as an obvious comparison I looked at Houllier's campaign where we went out of the CL due to draws against Basel. Houllier got one more season, I was surprised he did but some people just need a bit of time to get their heads around something simply not working - and they generally call other people 'stupid' and all sorts!

LIVERPOOL 2002/03

League : 5th (P38 W18 D10 L10 PTS 64)
Champions League : Group Stage (P6 W2 D2 L2)
UEFA Cup : Quarter-Final (lost to Celtic 1-3 on aggregate)
FA Cup : Round 4 (lost the replay 0-2 to C Palace at home)
League Cup : WINNERS
Community Shield : Arsenal 1-0 Liverpool

We went from an unbeaten start to fifth, went out of the three worthwhile cup competitions embarrassingly (not beating Basel, losing to Palace at home and out of the dropout European competition to Celtic) and then wasted another season on Houllier.

PREMIERSHIP 02/03

Games 01-12 : P12 W9 D3 L0 F23 A9 PTS 30 (2.5 pts/game)
Games 13-38 : P26 W9 D7 L10 F37 A32 PTS 34 (1.31 pts/game)

So the real debate should not be whether sacking him is good, but whether or not Rafa can win the league because if he can't then why retain him?!?!? Yet again last night he showed incapable of doing anything about the way the game was going, his substitutions (not forced) were late as usual and frankly you have to question not only the starting XI but decisions like leaving N'Gog on, taking Yossi (the goalscorer) off and not even giving Babel a go. Shambles doesn't begin to describe it, one goal in four games, four straight defeats and now we face the real prospect of our league campaign suffering even further with Rafa trying to keep us in Europe.

Anyone who thinks P13 W7 D0 L6 is acceptable really needs to try thinking a little bit harder. Anyone hiding behind the excuse of Gerrard and Torres' absence needs to think that one through too, they both played in the first four defeats of the season and played the first eight league games in a row

With Gerrard & Torres : P10 W6 D0 L4 (Won 60.00%)
W/O Gerrard & Torres : P1 W0 D0 L1 (Won 0.00%)
With Gerrard & W/O Torres : P2 W1 D0 L1 (Won 50.00%)

The two Gerrard featured in without Torres were 25 minutes last night, about 13 minutes as sub against Leeds. Frankly five of the wins were more or less gimmes, Burnley, Stoke and Hull at home, Debrecen at home and Leeds away (if we can't beat a league one side then we're in trouble, albeit a good side and we maybe could and should have lost) We've scored 28 goals this season, over two goals per game average, BUT half of those came in three games at home vs Burnley, Stoke and Hull. 14 goals in the remaining 10 games is not so clever of which we lost over half and conceded 13 goals.

If we change manager now the incoming manager might have no chance of winning the league, but at least he'd have more than half a season to settle in so we can avoid the waste of a settling in season that Rafa had and managers before him. He might even salvage our European campaign and get more out of the players. Are the players going through the motions with Rafa in charge? Fine while we're on a charge at the start or end of the season when winning games and looking like world beaters, but does Rafa have that gift of motivating players when the chips are down? Too many flaws in the manager's repertoire, ok when results go for you but glaringly obvious when they don't. And as I pointed out elsewhere, even last season's unbeaten start was unconvincing, relying on scraped wins and late winners with red cards to help us out.

And back to the Gerrard and Torres influence, when we won just two league games in seven during the first two months of 2009, Gerrard and Torres missed three games between them and not at the same time.

by **Igor Zidane** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 7:52 am

He'll walk before he gets sacked . Can't defend feck all about last night , but i know one thing .If rafa goes and we still have these owners ,we are fecked .We are fecked anyway with the owners we've got ,but i'll make a prediction now If we lose rafa benitez ,things will get much worse .The owners will sell our best players and the new manager whomever the lunatic is will have to work with feck all . Think Leeds utd it's coming our way imo . If Rafa goes and we keep thes owners.

by **LittleHobo** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 8:00 am

Igor Zidane wrote:He'll walk before he gets sacked . Can't defend feck all about last night , but i know one thing .If rafa goes and we still have these owners ,we are fecked .We are fecked anyway with the owners we've got ,but i'll make a prediction now If we lose rafa benitez ,things will get much worse .The owners will sell our best players and the new manager whomever the lunatic is will have to work with feck all . Think Leeds utd it's coming our way imo . If Rafa goes and we keep thes owners.

i agree

no point sacking him, as any new boss wont have the funds to turn things around

however get our first team on the pitch and we are in that top 4 just about

by **tubby** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 8:17 am

Sack Rafa? You lot are mad. He is one of the most sought after managers in the world and he is our manager. We are going through a rut and we have a few key injuries that's all. The problem is not Rafa but the players. They are not showing enough grit and drive to grind out the results like we were last year.

If we sacked Rafa would anyone seriously take the job? No money and the most imcompetant owners in football today. That sure does sound appealing. Get a grip people ffs we al oat won the league last season.

by **Sabre** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 8:32 am

Effes wrote:The club cant afford to sack Rafa, so it's a moot point.

It wouldn't be the first time a Spanish coach forgives the remaining money of his contract, but that kind of movement is when there's another option in the horizon. I think that if Rafa has to be sácked, he'll be sacked and he'll reach an agreement with the club.

Certainly I've read many times in this forum "this is not good enough", but those words should have been saved for this situation. The situation is critical, and I can't blame the people who ask for a sacking, quite simply because it's a normal football fan reaction after 4 loses in a big club.

Despite his mistakes, and his main mistake for me is the confidence he has in squad players that are not good enough, I keep my trust on Rafa, I hope not to wind up anybody by saying this.

by **destro** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 8:38 am

zirgoz wrote:Ok lets all pray that our team lose the next three games, that will help aid rafa's sacking.

Amazing, go away for a while and the lunatics take over the asylum !

by **Dazzer** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 8:48 am

Sabre wrote:
Effes wrote:The club cant afford to sack Rafa, so it's a moot point.

It wouldn't be the first time a Spanish coach forgives the remaining money of his contract, but that kind of movement is when there's another option in the horizon. I think that if Rafa has to be sácked, he'll be sacked and he'll reach an agreement with the club.

Certainly I've read many times in this forum "this is not good enough", but those words should have been saved for this situation. The situation is critical, and I can't blame the people who ask for a sacking, quite simply because it's a normal football fan reaction after 4 loses in a big club.

Despite his mistakes, and his main mistake for me is the confidence he has in squad players that are not good enough, I keep my trust on Rafa, I hope not to wind up anybody by saying this.

Nope you clearly speaking from your heart.You can'y help what you are thinking !

by **lewerty** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 8:49 am

need to get the yanks out too how can we only have a 1million pound striker

by **Boocity** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 8:57 am

We can debate about whether Rafa should be sacked or not but if we lose to the Mancs on Sunday that decision may already have been made. Americans do not have much patience.

by **red_guy** » Wed Oct 21, 2009 9:07 am

Sabre wrote:his main mistake for me is the confidence he has in squad players that are not good enough

Yes, and one thing that will disturb us all is that.. will he manned up, accept his 'errors' and do something about it? judging by previous occasions, he usually has something/someone else to blame rather than blaming himself for the mistakes...

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