Liverpool FC Forum

by **116-1065305004** » Fri Nov 21, 2003 4:10 pm

Hi people as Houllier is proving to be more and more of a joke I thought I'd set up a little vote where you guys can vote over who will be the next Liverpool manager, I know there are a couple of eye raisers on that voting poll but they were realistic ones at the present time!
I know a few people who want Keegan at Anfield, dont get me wrong he is a fantastic manager and I think he would keep Liverpool as a top four club but I dont think he would have what it takes to bring the only good position (1ST) to Liverpool and the same goes for O'Leary, Hiddink & Thompson!
Micky Adams of Leicester has a good track record in the Lower Divisions but it is still unclear whether he can prove himself at Premiership Level with a top club even though he has done well at Leicester.
I think Hoddle & Strachan would be complete disasters but I am unsure about Toshack as he has had a topsy turvy time as a manager!
My choice would be Martin O'Neill as he takes no s##t with Vicente Del Bosque a close second.
Please people cast your votes and tell us all why.

by **greenred** » Fri Nov 21, 2003 4:35 pm

oneill fulfills all the criteria,
he is the only man for the job.
we may have to wait till the end of the season to get him though.
houllier till then, God help us

by **Owzat** » Fri Nov 21, 2003 5:06 pm

Toshack for me, plenty of experience and a Liverpool old boy to boot. Thompson should take over now until a new manager is appointed but I wouldn't give it him long term

O'Neill - no experience in a competitive league with a top club. Getting the most out of Leicester does not mean he will fare well at Anfield

Micky Adams - do me a favour, a stint at Fulham and now Leicester. Too inexperienced and, as yet, unproven

Gordon Strachan - reckoning is Leeds and Southampton are negotiating compensation at the moment

Kevin Keegan - Liverpool hero but his management credentials are dodgy to say the least. We may end up where we were with Evans

Glenn Hoddle - did ok at Southampton and Chelsea but showed little intelligence as manager of Spurs. Rebrov at £11m and Richards for £8m are just two examples of why I think he would be no better than Houllier

Gus Hiddink/Vincente Del Bosque - not keen on the idea of another "foreign" manager though these two have a better resume than Kermit did before he came here

by **116-1065305004** » Fri Nov 21, 2003 5:16 pm

Owzat wrote:Toshack for me, plenty of experience and a Liverpool old boy to boot. Thompson should take over now until a new manager is appointed but I wouldn't give it him long term

O'Neill - no experience in a competitive league with a top club. Getting the most out of Leicester does not mean he will fare well at Anfield

Micky Adams - do me a favour, a stint at Fulham and now Leicester. Too inexperienced and, as yet, unproven

Gordon Strachan - reckoning is Leeds and Southampton are negotiating compensation at the moment

Kevin Keegan - Liverpool hero but his management credentials are dodgy to say the least. We may end up where we were with Evans

Glenn Hoddle - did ok at Southampton and Chelsea but showed little intelligence as manager of Spurs. Rebrov at £11m and Richards for £8m are just two examples of why I think he would be no better than Houllier

Gus Hiddink/Vincente Del Bosque - not keen on the idea of another "foreign" manager though these two have a better resume than Kermit did before he came here

I agree with most of your views Owzat apart from the one about O'Neill, I am puzzled why you have picked John Toshack that would be a real gamble, some clubs hes been superb and some he has been a complete disaster.
Micky Adams was a dark horse for the present time but I believe in the future he will be one of Englands top managers in just 6 seasons he has 3 promotions with 3 different clubs and that is some record and it will be interesting to see how he does with a big club in the future I think Leeds should take a chance on him as their is more chance of Osama Bin Laden becoming the next U.S president as there is of Micky Adams taking over the Reds at the present time.
Most of your views are spot on apart from the ones stated above

by **Owzat** » Fri Nov 21, 2003 5:26 pm

Sorry, I just see too much Souness in O'Neill

- Success with an average Premiership club which has had mixed fortunes (Leicester/Blackburn)

- Success in Scotland which is not difficult given there are only two competitive teams

- Most importantly neither has managed a top English club so neither has ever had the financial backing to buy big name players. Getting the best out of average players is not what is needed at Anfield

But I will admit this is a fear/reservation more than an absolute no-no. At the end of the day there are no guarantees with any manager, Toshack has worked with the best in Spain, O'Neill has managed an average team in a top league (England) and a top team in an average league (Scotland) - whose credentials would you take first? O'Neill has a massive reputation, whether it is founded remains to be seen and can only be tested if and when he takes on a big club

by **116-1065305004** » Fri Nov 21, 2003 5:43 pm

Owzat wrote:Sorry, I just see too much Souness in O'Neill

- Success with an average Premiership club which has had mixed fortunes (Leicester/Blackburn)

- Success in Scotland which is not difficult given there are only two competitive teams

- Most importantly neither has managed a top English club so neither has ever had the financial backing to buy big name players. Getting the best out of average players is not what is needed at Anfield

But I will admit this is a fear/reservation more than an absolute no-no. At the end of the day there are no guarantees with any manager, Toshack has worked with the best in Spain, O'Neill has managed an average team in a top league (England) and a top team in an average league (Scotland) - whose credentials would you take first? O'Neill has a massive reputation, whether it is founded remains to be seen and can only be tested if and when he takes on a big club

I must admit with that O'Neill and Souness comparison you have me thinking a bit!
But no one can be worse than Houllier can they?

by **JBG** » Fri Nov 21, 2003 5:48 pm

Sorry, but I cannot see how you can draw a comparison between Souness and Martin O' Neill.

I would hardly call O' Neill's success at Leicester "mixed". It was nothing short of excellent given the resources available to him. He got them promoted, kept them up, won two league cups. The season after he left they were relegated. There was nothing "mixed" about his success at all. He got the absolute maximum from a small to medium sized club with journeyman players.

Celtic are a big club in that they have huge support and expectation levels run high. They were abysmal when O'Neill took over, and he turned them into Champions (and cup winners) within a year.

Objectively, if you look at Celtic's players they are at best of mid table Premiership standard, yet O' Neill managed to get through the qualifying stages in the Champions League. Fair enough, they haven't been brilliant in the Champions League, but they have been fairly competitive, and are extremely good at Parkhead.

Also, look what he did in the UEFA Cup last year!

I think he has shown at Celtic that he has the credentials to manage a big club, certainly the credentials at Liverpool. He has a proven track record of getting the best out of under performers (Hartson, Sutton, Petrov and Thompson) and also arguably prolonged Larson's career in Scotland.

As for Toshak working with the best in Spain, you need to check your facts.

Toshak was laughed out of it at Real Madrid, where neither the fans nor players took him seriously. He achieved modest success at Sociedad. He was merely an interim manager at Real when they were going through a lean period. My Spanish friends have likened him to the Christian Gross of the Premier Liga.

by **Owzat** » Fri Nov 21, 2003 5:56 pm

I said Leicester and Blackburn have had mixed fortunes not O'Neill at Leicester.

While Toshack may not have had the best of times in one of the toughest leagues in Europe, O'Neill hasn't managed a top club in one.

Celtic are a decent outfit but as I pointed out, Souness managed Rangers to great success in Scotland and look at what happened during his time at Anfield.

What I'm trying to say is, you can't draw conclusions that O'Neill will do well at a top club just because he did well with Leicester and Celtic. The comparisons between Souness and O'Neill are valid. Maybe my preference for Toshack is just a hope back to the old former players being managers days.........

by **Owzat** » Fri Nov 21, 2003 6:01 pm

.....and top Spanish clubs wouldn't give you much time to settle in or deliver. Kermit wouldn't have lasted this long in Spain with results he has produced recently.

by **116-1065305004** » Fri Nov 21, 2003 6:08 pm

Owzat wrote:I said Leicester and Blackburn have had mixed fortunes not O'Neill at Leicester.

While Toshack may not have had the best of times in one of the toughest leagues in Europe, O'Neill hasn't managed a top club in one.

Celtic are a decent outfit but as I pointed out, Souness managed Rangers to great success in Scotland and look at what happened during his time at Anfield.

What I'm trying to say is, you can't draw conclusions that O'Neill will do well at a top club just because he did well with Leicester and Celtic. The comparisons between Souness and O'Neill are valid. Maybe my preference for Toshack is just a hope back to the old former players being managers days.........

I have to admit John Barnes Granny, Owzat has made a good point about the scottish based managers coming to england thing(e.g Graeme Souness,Walter Smith) it is a completely different ballgame.
But I still think Martin O'Neill is the right man for Liverpool, unlike Houllier he wont accept anything less than 1st place and he has ambition and he wants to win something Houllier clearly lacks!
Although most of the candidates on my poll I dont think most of them has what it takes to win titles apart from O'Neill and Del Bosque.

by **Owzat** » Fri Nov 21, 2003 6:13 pm

We won't know unless he comes. To be honest I don't know who I'd want but the one thing I do know is it isn't Houllier. Some Liverpool fans say "who would replace him?" but I think sticking with him is getting us nowhere so get rid of him now, put Thompson in temporary charge and get on with the task of finding the right man. I see no mention of ALex McLeish though I would have the same reservations about any manager from the Scottish leagues with no experience at a top club. Still Ferguson has done ok.......

by **greenred** » Fri Nov 21, 2003 6:49 pm

what nobody mentions is the aura that surrounds oneill.
the guy has charisma and incredible enthusiasm.
this spreads to the fans and most importantly the players.
they love the guy and want to win for him.
he reminds me of a manager we used to have.
bill shankly.

by **116-1065305004** » Fri Nov 21, 2003 6:53 pm

greenred wrote:what nobody mentions is the aura that surrounds oneill.
the guy has charisma and incredible enthusiasm.
this spreads to the fans and most importantly the players.
they love the guy and want to win for him.
he reminds me of a manager we used to have.
bill shankly.

quite right Liverpool are seriously lacking passion now and O'Neill lives and breathes football and he has the balls to get rid of the dead wood and he has a knack of getting the very best out of even the most average players

by **Owzat** » Fri Nov 21, 2003 6:58 pm

What I fear most about the arrival of a new manager is what he will view as "dead wood". I would like to think O'Neill wouldn't be dealing with "average players", perhaps that is the best way of conveying my feelings on him overall

by **martiness** » Wed Nov 26, 2003 10:23 pm

Why we can not choose Alex Ferguson for a coach?

Seriously I think, Toshack would be good !

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