Liverpool FC Forum

by **Benny The Noon** » Tue Sep 14, 2010 9:15 am

It's obvious that it doesnt matter what we say you will stick to your agenda - it's nice and simple for you - we are playin very poor at the moment and the manager sets the players up to play a certain way and that way is not workin so he is being criticised for it and rightly so , as well as the players also getting criticised which is also correct . People want us to be successful and at the moment they can't see it happening . People didn't rate hodgson due to a number of reasons which is their right to say and at the moment watching the games their fears are being realised . NOONE has suggested he be sacked nor has anyone even come close to suggesting that they want him to fail so give the accusations a rest and let people air their opinion without you judging them .

by **matt_liverpool** » Tue Sep 14, 2010 9:22 am

I think ManU game will be the one where we can all see what Roy can do with an almost fully fit and strongest 11 (except Kuyt). There's no doubt Meireles and Cole both will start. Let's see what do we see then.

I think Roy will play something like this:

-------------------------Pepe--------------------------------
--Johnson--------Carra---------Skrtel-------------Konchesky
-------------------------Poulsen-------------------------------
--------Cole------Gerrard---------Meireles------Jova-----------
----------------------------Torres-----------------------------

by **Ciggy** » Tue Sep 14, 2010 9:25 am

bigmick wrote:Some of the people on here are so terrified that a new manager is going to come in and make a success of things (and then by definition make their stance on Benitez look ever more silly) that they can't even dare to give the new man a chance.

This statement is bizzare and one of the most strange things Ive ever seen written, just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they aren't after you.

How can you think anyone is terrified of Roy or who ever else doing well at Liverpool because some people liked Rafa? That is just ridiculas.

My gripe is with us giving the job to a manger who got the sack at Blackburn, who only kept Fulham up because Portsmouth rested their whole first team because they where in the FA Cup final and they stayed up by a two goal difference, he got lucky.

Then he took Fulham to 7th but they finished 12th last season and got them to the Europa Cup final he didnt do both.

Last season when Fulham came to Anfield that was the most boring Anti-football team ever to step foot on our hallowed turf and those in the stands Purslow & Broughton where there to witness it and gave that man the job on what credencials? They made Fat-Sams Bolton seem like Barcalona.

He got the job because he wouldnt give the owners and the board jib like the previous one did and made the fans aware of it.

The British media like him and Sky.

Hes english.

He has never won a trophy in England and at 63 years of age thats a terrible track record.

His Fulham team won just once on the road in 2009-2010 winning a mighty 1-0.

He did not get the job for us to go on to better things and win every trophy under the sun he got the job for them reasons above.

We are a massive club huge and deserve a manager of similar status, one with a winning mentality, one with pedigree, one who is not afraid of going out to win games, one who wants to make teams scared of us.

Roy has none of these qualifications, that bloke in your pub the Fulham fan loved him, but thats because Fulham dont have high expectations all they want and need is premiership survival and he done that job for them, we on the other hand expect and demand the Premier League, Champions League, FA Cup, and exciting attacking pass and move football and this is not in Roys arsenal no matter how much you dress it up.

(Please dont bring the previous manager into it) I am talking about Roy.

I am basing my opinion on his past, I have said before and I will say it again, I hope he proves me wrong, I hope he gets us into the top 4, I hope he wins us a trophy and I will appoligise for ever doubting the man. Thats all everyone wants is for Liverpool to be successfull, that it makes your statement about us being terrified of him winning things ridiculas.

by **bigmick** » Tue Sep 14, 2010 9:35 am

I stand by the statement until someone can give me a logical argument to the contrary. I've asked the questions on this page, and I refer all correspondance on the matter to that.

Anyway back onto more sensible matters, the second thing I'd do after moving Gerrard into central midfield is to replace Skrtel with Agger. I've never been a fan of Skyrtel defensively as he ball watches from time to time. Agger isn't great either as he needs to develop physically and it's never really happened. That said, the Dane is a lovely footballer and can get you a goal, so I'd have him in the team definately.

by **bigmick** » Tue Sep 14, 2010 9:49 am

Ciggy wrote:
bigmick wrote:Some of the people on here are so terrified that a new manager is going to come in and make a success of things (and then by definition make their stance on Benitez look ever more silly) that they can't even dare to give the new man a chance.

This statement is bizzare and one of the most strange things Ive ever seen written, just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they aren't after you.

I just quoted this bit because it was a longish post and it would have looked like a Russian doll.

As I said yersterday, of course everyone is entitled to not believe Roy was the correct appointment. You made your feelings 100% clear on the matter at the time, and many on here applauded you fo it, fair enough. Once you've made that point though, surely from there it makes sense to judge the progress of the team or otherwise objectively.

If we had given the job to Pelligrini, I would have said it was a mistake (as I did while we were considering it) but that doesn't mean I'd have been rounding on him after 8 matches of which we'd lost one. If we look at what we've done, how we've played, sensibly, there is very little difference thus far from last season. So why all the histrionics, why all the silliness, why all the "he HAS TO GET IT RIGHT IN THE NEXT TWO MATCHES"?

Not rating the manager before he starts is fair enough I suppose, but once he starts people could at least try and be a little objective. We lost two out of our first three league matches last season, we drew 0-0 at Hull and gopt spanked 2-0 at Pompey, but suddenly this is the worst Liverpool team for as long as people can remember.

I don';t think we are playing well either, but a bit of sensible debate on it wouldn't go amiss I don't think.

by **Ciggy** » Tue Sep 14, 2010 9:50 am

bigmick wrote:I stand by the statement until someone can give me a logical argument to the contrary.

Ive given you a logical arguement prove me wrong?

Everything Ive written here is true.

My gripe is with us giving the job to a manger who got the sack at Blackburn, who only kept Fulham up because Portsmouth rested their whole first team because they where in the FA Cup final and they stayed up by a two goal difference, he got lucky.

Then he took Fulham to 7th but they finished 12th last season and got them to the Europa Cup final he didnt do both.

Last season when Fulham came to Anfield that was the most boring Anti-football team ever to step foot on our hallowed turf and those in the stands Purslow & Broughton where there to witness it and gave that man the job on what credencials? They made Fat-Sams Bolton seem like Barcalona.

He got the job because he wouldnt give the owners and the board jib like the previous one did and made the fans aware of it.

The British media like him and Sky.

Hes english.

He has never won a trophy in England and at 63 years of age thats a terrible track record.

His Fulham team won just once on the road in 2009-2010 winning a mighty 1-0.

He did not get the job for us to go on to better things and win every trophy under the sun he got the job for them reasons above.

We even had Kenny come out yesterday with a statement, in defence of Fernando Torres because Jamie Redknapp said he was diabolical.

Torres was poor but thats because he had fuck all service from the two spoilers in midfield Poulson & Lucas who cant pass for toffee, two of the exact same players doing the exact same job.

Ill let Maxi off with how poor he was due to jet lag and flying to a meaningless friendly in Buenos Aires, Jovanovich is a striker has now been thrown onto the left wing but spends most of his time in central midfield.
We had Babel and pacheco on that bench who could have changed the game babel could have even started infact as he hadnt been away on international duty.

These where the reasons that Torres was poor imagine playing for the best team in the world Spain, then coming back to this utter dross with no service what so ever and him trying to turn himself into a target man with all the hoofing to him. Even the best striker in the world will look ordinary in the current set up and it better change and sharpish I never want to see Lucas & Poulson on the pitch at the same time ever again.

by **bigmick** » Tue Sep 14, 2010 9:58 am

Lynds, the bits in bold I think explain why you didn't want Roy in the first place. I don't agree with you, but fair enough you have made your opinions clear in the past.

The bits underneath I pretty much agree with to be honest, with the exception of Maxi Rodriguez who isn't good enough IMHO. I've had it with two holding midfielders, I would have given Babel a run, Torres is half fit and needs service, and Jovanovic whatever he is isn't a left sided midfielder.

Like I've said a few times though, to me it is very similar to last season. Despte that, we've only lost once though and I remain confident Roy will sort it out. It just seems daft to em to villify the new manager for a malaise which has long been evident.

by **Benny The Noon** » Tue Sep 14, 2010 10:04 am

If you vilified the previous manager for what you saw on the pitch why aren't you doing the same for current manager who is setting the players up to do the exact same thing - yes a number of us are guilty of not being more critical of previous manager but are you not in the same situation now - you say what is happening now has been happening for a while so why aren't you being more critical of current manager when it seems he is having the players playing the same way and playing the same two DM ?

by **bigmick** » Tue Sep 14, 2010 10:15 am

Benny The Noon wrote:If you vilified the previous manager for what you saw on the pitch why aren't you doing the same for current manager who is setting the players up to do the exact same thing

BNecause he's been here six weeks not six years

. I would have thought that was absolutely obvious.

Also, something which has seemingly completely escaped you is the fact that until Cole got suspended, we WEREN'T playing with two holding midfielders, Gerrard was playing in there. This is one of the main reasons why I am very confident that Roy is fully aware of the problems with such a system.

If of course Roy plays two holding midifelders for the WHOLE SEASON, then you can expect me to be throwing my toys out of the pram just like you are.

by **Benny The Noon** » Tue Sep 14, 2010 10:19 am

But surely if it's such a glaring error then someone of Hodgsons experience and know how of the prem could see it wasn't working and didn't work previously so why continue with it ? During the man city match everyone could see we were getting swamped in the centre and everyone was screaming for a change but nothing happened - same with against brum - why was merieles sat on the bench for so long when you can see it wasn't working - you don't need all season long to see what wasn't working during the game but no changes happened to try and change it .

by **markpoe85** » Tue Sep 14, 2010 10:36 am

speaking off.. I think with this idea of Torres should leave Roy who should replace him?!?

http://www.imscouting.com/global-....81

by **matt_liverpool** » Tue Sep 14, 2010 10:42 am

markpoe85 wrote:speaking off.. I think with this idea of Torres should leave Roy who should replace him?!?

http://www.imscouting.com/global-....81

What a fucing shit article. :veryangry

by **Ben Patrick** » Tue Sep 14, 2010 10:49 am

My god pages and pages on this thread in the last day

What i would say is that i was quite happy with Hodgson getting the job.
I dont care that he hasnt won la liga or any of that.
BUT, he needs to learn from mistakes.
He got it wrong against City, that cannot be disputed.
He got it wrong Sunday as well.
We changed the manager, and we needed to. But that team he put put out Sunday and the tactics employed were identical to what Rafa would have done.
Even the poor substitutions.
Rome wasnt built in a day and i wont jump on Roys back but he needs to get things right and he hasnt done that in either of our two away league games.
I said it the other day but what's the point of Gerrard further forward when your midfield is getting dominated ?
He doesnt get a kick.
Rafa made that mistake for the majority of last season and if Roy doesnt learn from it then we will struggle again.
Its not the end of the world though, a point there isnt a bad point. Its the performance that needs to improve, drastically.

by **Benny The Noon** » Tue Sep 14, 2010 12:14 pm

Stolen from another forum

Liverpool's mentality must change before Old Trafford clash

For many supporters Liverpool’s trip to Old Trafford is one of the biggest games of the season, with not just three points at stake but also North West bragging rights.

The media also jump on the bandwagon, after all the two clubs set to clash on Sunday have two of the biggest, if not the biggest, fan bases in English football.

The build-up is normally packed with stats, form and results checking in order to try and predict who is in the best shape going in to the fixture.

This season though, it’s all a bit different.

The honeymoon period is over for Roy Hodgson and after a run of uninspiring performances from the Reds the slight air of optimism surrounding his arrival at Anfield is all but gone.

As a group of supporters we could be accused of being slightly impatient this season. After a poor campaign last year it’s easy to see why supporters find it frustrating to see Liverpool start a season in such an unpromising way and ultimately the manager is going to be the one to take an ample amount of scrutiny.

Hodgson didn’t help himself after the game against Birmingham at St Andrew’s on Sunday. The Liverpool boss stated his pleasure at Liverpool’s performance against tough opposition after the Reds walked out, thanks to Pepe Reina, with one point.

The result was far from poor, Birmingham are an incredibly hard team to beat at home, as evidenced by their record of just under twenty unbeaten games at St Andrew’s, but the performance was another thing altogether.

Birmingham looked close to dominant against a Liverpool side that looked shaky at the back and completely lacked in creativity, with the two central midfielders rarely looking forward and the two wide players offering little other than the occasional run in to the box.

Gerrard tried his hardest but, after a string of solid performances, it was a bad day at the office for the skipper, whilst striker Fernando Torres was left isolated as the lone striker, feeding off scraps from an unimaginative midfield.

The script reads like one of our many poor away performances last season, the difference is after those games the manager never came out and praised the team for putting on an “entertaining” performance.

Look to next Sunday and you can see why a lot of that analysis mentioned earlier simply isn’t needed. A quick look at how both sides are playing could easily tell you that United should walk away with three points easy as that.

Both Cole and Meireles should be available to start on Sunday, whilst both will no doubt give a boost to Liverpool’s efforts going forward, they’re no miracle cure. Liverpool’s conservative mentality has to change if we’re to walk away from the game with even our pride intact.

The message needs to be conveyed that a performance like what was offered at Birmingham simply isn’t good enough. This is Liverpool Football Club and when travelling to teams who are supposedly worse than ourselves we shouldn’t be sitting back, hoping for the best and holding out for an “entertaining” nil-nil draw.

Will this happen? I doubt it. As much as I want to like Roy Hodgson it seems as though he’s set the bar a lot lower than what most Liverpool fans expected at the start of the season.

It’s never good to think you’re better than you are, but praising a poor performance makes the team think it’s acceptable, and if that mentality exists amongst the players the trip to Old Trafford could be a very depressing one.

by **tubby** » Tue Sep 14, 2010 12:29 pm

Benny The Noon wrote:But surely if it's such a glaring error then someone of Hodgsons experience and know how of the prem could see it wasn't working and didn't work previously so why continue with it ? During the man city match everyone could see we were getting swamped in the centre and everyone was screaming for a change but nothing happened - same with against brum - why was merieles sat on the bench for so long when you can see it wasn't working - you don't need all season long to see what wasn't working during the game but no changes happened to try and change it .

Exactly..

Sorry Bigmick but Woy isn't the answer. The fact that it is still being so heatedly debated just goes to show that opinions are so split on him.

I sincerley hope if we get new owners in time for next season we bring in someone else. Someone who players better posession football and has a better track record with a big club in recent times.

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