Liverpool FC Forum

Ghost of Shankly » Sat Nov 24, 2018 11:10 pm wrote:

ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Sat Nov 24, 2018 9:03 pm wrote:

Ghost of Shankly » Sat Nov 24, 2018 7:39 pm wrote:Didn't watch the game as not televised so not sure how well we played / if we controlled the game etc. So looking forward to watching the highlights.

Look, our defence is solid as a rock, just 5 conceded in 13 games as Reg said. Last season we had conceded 17 by now.
We just need to keep pace and stay in touch with Man City which we are doing without playing brilliantly.

We will know where we stand in the title race come start of January. If we are more than 10 point's adrift of Guardiolas men, then we will have no chance. If we are less than five points adrift we will have a good chance of running it to the wire. Imo.

Something pretty disasterous would have to happen to our form for us to be 10 points behind City by the beginning of January though saying that we do have a derby game next week which won't be easy (especially off the back of a trip to Paris). Everton are in decent form as well.

Plus in Dec we have Man Utd at home (who we havent beaten for years) wolves away, Arsenal at Home, all tough games.
I'm just saying if we drop points due to the fixture pile up, and don't play well. Not much room for error.

Yup competing with a power house like City isn't easy especially the way they are playing this season. We can forget about catching their goal difference.

We just have to keep on going and winning for me the key is how far either go in the champions league.

Got to say that Henderson sending off was a joke, no wonder the likes of Ronaldo and Messi have been ripping up the record books if players are getting sent off for brushing against players.

ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Sat Nov 24, 2018 11:19 pm wrote:Got to say that Henderson sending off was a joke, no wonder the likes of Ronaldo and Messi have been ripping up the record books if players are getting sent off for brushing against players.

The 2nd yellow was a result of a number of offences. He was already walking a tightrope so shouldn't have done that really.

We were sluggish in the first half. Improved a bit in the 2nd half and wore them down with all the possession we had.

Teams are taking less and less risks against us and giving us fewer and fewer chances to counter attack. It's been happening since the 2nd half of last season. We really do need a couple of lock pickers in the side. Fekir would have made a big difference.

Delighted we showed quality in the end and ran out 3 nil winners because at times it looked like we were getting a point at best. 1st half was terribly slow and painful to watch all that possession wasted. Second half they pushed a bit more and we exploited the spaces. Mo did well and hunted down everything along with Mane. Trents free kick was sweet and nice to see Bobby get one also as he needs it.

Defensively we are a different side altogether. Alisson made two top saves at 0.0 and Van Dijk is just a monster. Hope to see Joe back for PSG because Lovren is capable of undoing the lot if under enough pressure.

Henderson was poor today and it was summed up in the end with a red. The yellow might have been harsh but he had a few fouls leading up to it. The ref just had a word with him before the red and 20 seconds later he gives him no choice. Personally I don't rate the lad at all but today he was below his usual standard and just looked frustrated throughout.

Can't say I love the way we are playing at times but can certainly say I love looking at that table  .

We are playing a more controlled style of football instead of the gengen pressing style that we have been more familiar with the previous 2 years. What this means is we're conserving energy so we can challenge on all fronts for the rest of the season.

You look at Chelsea who have gone out full throttle to adapt the same style of football we used last season and how shattered all their players were against spurs.. that would have been us again this year, but Klopp has learnt from his past errors and now we look fresher than ever.

It's ugly to watch at times but you look back at the 90s and United were awful to watch at times and stole alot of games in the last minutes of matches.. and they were dominant over the season.

Yesterday we kept possession well, we tired Watford out by them having to chase the ball, and we took our chances. It was a perfect win.

We can't be negative because the new tactics are working and we have City in our sights still and we still have a couple of gears we can go up in to really challenge this year.

Never doubted or tried to question anyone's support, but moaning after having won the most points in the history of our club in the PL after 13 games and conceding the least amount of goals in our PL history sounds a bit plastic to me to say the least. You may all complain all you want but this is THE BEST team we've had in the PL, that's a fact. The only reason we are not top is because of Man City who are probably the best team in the PL, ever. But comparing their spendings and ours, it's a miracle we're just 2 points behind them.

That's just modern football I guess. We used to ridicule fans of the likes of Chlesea but now we seem to be no better than them. I don't blame the fans though, it's just how football is today, all the good values from the past are gone, and have been for a while.

damjan193 » Sun Nov 25, 2018 2:25 pm wrote:Never doubted or tried to question anyone's support, but moaning after having won the most points in the history of our club in the PL after 13 games and conceding the least amount of goals in our PL history sounds a bit plastic to me to say the least. You may all complain all you want but this is THE BEST team we've had in the PL, that's a fact. The only reason we are not top is because of Man City who are probably the best team in the PL, ever. But comparing their spendings and ours, it's a miracle we're just 2 points behind them.

That's just modern football I guess. We used to ridicule fans of the likes of Chlesea but now we seem to be no better than them. I don't blame the fans though, it's just how football is today, all the good values from the past are gone, and have been for a while.

Best team we've had in the prem? Rafa' s team with Gerrard, Alonso and Mascherano in MF would wipe the floor with this one imo.
Yes we are doing well but imo we haven't looked convincing against the better sides, we did well against PSG at home and Spurs away but it does have to be said Spurs were in a bad run of form when we beat them (Watford had just beaten them  and Inter Milan beat them just after we did).
Against Chelsea I thought we got a bit lucky with Sturridge's late equaliser, I also thought we got a bit lucky against City when Mahrez put that late pen in Stanley Park lake, I didn't think we looked convincing against Arsenal either (although we were a bit unlucky with the disallowed goal) and the Napoli and Red Star debacles speak for themselves.
Generally during Jurgens reign whenever we've faced one of the bigger teams we've always had a right go at them and played on the front foot, this team for whatever reason seems to sit back and tbh it's not a style of play I enjoy watching.
We are doing well because we are beating the lesser lights of the division and scraping draws against the better sides but imo if we want to win the biggest prizes in the game sooner or later we've got to be able to take it to the better sides (like what we did to City last season).
Some fans seem to think that we are just conserving energy and we will put our foot on the accelerator after Christmas but what about those 2 performances against Napoli and Red Star? If we are so good how come we are getting beat by a team who's record signing is £2m?
I just fear that by trying to stiffen us up at the back Jurgen may have taken something from our top end so to speak, we may be harder to beat but we may also find it harder to win as well, particularly against the better sides.
I'd just like to see us take it to a big team like we did last year just to show that we still have that string to our bow, Wednesday night in Paris would be the perfect time to do it as well. I'd feel much more confident about the second half of the season if I knew that we can still slug it out toe to toe if we need to.

ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Sun Nov 25, 2018 5:05 pm wrote:

damjan193 » Sun Nov 25, 2018 2:25 pm wrote:Never doubted or tried to question anyone's support, but moaning after having won the most points in the history of our club in the PL after 13 games and conceding the least amount of goals in our PL history sounds a bit plastic to me to say the least. You may all complain all you want but this is THE BEST team we've had in the PL, that's a fact. The only reason we are not top is because of Man City who are probably the best team in the PL, ever. But comparing their spendings and ours, it's a miracle we're just 2 points behind them.

That's just modern football I guess. We used to ridicule fans of the likes of Chlesea but now we seem to be no better than them. I don't blame the fans though, it's just how football is today, all the good values from the past are gone, and have been for a while.

Best team we've had in the prem? Rafa' steam with Gerrard, Alonso and Mascherano in MF would wipe the floor with this one imo.
Yes we are doing well but imo we haven't looked convincing against the better sides, we did well against PSG at home and Spurs away but it does have to be said Spurs were in a bad run of form when we beat them (Watford had just beaten them  and Inter Milan beat them just after we did).
Against Chelsea I thought we got a bit lucky with Sturridge's late equaliser, I also thought we got a bit lucky against City when Mahrez put that late pen in Stanley Park lake, I didn't think we looked convincing against Arsenal either (although we were a bit unlucky with the disallowed goal) and the Napoli and Red Star debacles speak for themselves.
Generally during Jurgens reign whenever we've faced one of the bigger teams we've always had a right go at them and played on the front foot, this team for whatever reason seems to sit back and tbh it's not a style of play I enjoy watching.
We are doing well because we are beating the lesser lights of the division and scraping draws against the better sides but imo if we want to win the biggest prizes in the game sooner or later we've got to be able to take it to the better sides (like what we did to City last season).
Some fans seem to think that we are just conserving energy and we will put our foot on the accelerator after Christmas but what about those 2 performances against Napoli and Red Star? If we are so good how come we are getting beat by a team who's record signing is £2m?
I just fear that by trying to stiffen us up at the back Jurgen may have taken something from our top end so to speak, we may be harder to beat but we may also find it harder to win as well, particularly against the better sides.
I'd just like to see us take it to a big team like we did last year just to show that we still have that string to our bow, Wednesday night in Paris would be the perfect time to do it as well. I'd feel much more confident about the second half of the season if I knew that we can still slug it out toe to toe if we need to.

That Rafa team won nothing

You are constantly looking for the negatives. Last season we were dropping points constantly because we were too open , Klopp now has adjusted the tactics to make us harder to break down , yet you just call it lucky.

Against the “better sides” we are unbeaten - that’s a City side that is steamrolling everyone , a Spurs side who mullered last season ( we got 1 point from 6 ) , a Chelsea and Arsenal side who were on a roll and a number of the games are away from home. We are two whole points behind a City side who are supposedly going to walk then league - just two. You appear incapable of being positive and it’s laughable in a season where we are winning the games we normally lose or draw and you point to two poor games in Europe away from home.

Teams are playing more and more conservatively against us. Look at PSG and Man City. They adjusted their game against us as they saw what happened to teams when they came on to us last season. Those spaces are just not there for us to play how we played last year on the counter. I do think we can play more cohesivly than we have but I don't think you'll see us play like we did last year.

As we've evolved so have the tactics against us. We'll need to evolve further, and mainly in midfield. Fabinho and Keita will need to full adapt and we'll need to pick up a real good number 10. I'm not overly concerned by the drop in fluidity of our attacking play compared to last season. It's just growing pains.

We are a better side than last year and I'm confident we'll get more points and finish higher in the table than last year.

That team of Rafa's may have won nothing but it would still wipe the floor with this one. A prime mid 20's Gerrard up against a 32 year old Milner and Henderson? lol.
We'll learn a lot about us on Wednesday, if not a must win game we certainly don't want to lose it, our CL participation is on the line so we will have to bring our A game. We'll see what our 'top end' is like on Wednesday. Napoli showed that a decent team can get a result there so we are not looking for miracles.

ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Sun Nov 25, 2018 5:27 pm wrote:That team of Rafa's may have won nothing but it would still wipe the floor with this one. A prime mid 20's Gerrard up against a 32 year old Milner and Henderson? lol.
We'll learn a lot about us on Wednesday, if not a must win game we certainly don't want to lose it, our CL participation is on the line so we will have to bring our A game. We'll see what our 'top end' is like on Wednesday. Napoli showed that a decent team can get a result there so we are not looking for miracles.

Rafas team struggled at times to break down a lot of teams - couldn’t break down Stoke , Villa , Fulham , West Ham , Spurs , Hull , Arsenal , Everton , Wigan , Middlesbrough- and you think they would “wipe” the floor with the current team based on a couple of guys in midfield who were more defensive. That team relied on the goals of Torres - stop him and the team couldn’t break down plenty of packed strong back lines. They also couldn’t handle pace- you are stuck dreaming of teams that won nothing and fell short due to glaring issues

We're certainly lacking the cutting edge of last season, being able to slice teams open.
I think it's the Midfield, we don't have a settled line up and Jurgen is chopping and Changing too much. One game it's Shaqiri, next Fabinho, Milner, Keita, Wjnaldum, Hendo etc.

A good highlight on match of the day was when they showed Hendo picking up the ball and had the chance to play forward and put Mane in on goal. instead, he did a crapp sideways pass that got us nowhere. He just does not have the vision to create much.

Lallana in Pyjamas » Sun Nov 25, 2018 4:37 pm wrote:

ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Sun Nov 25, 2018 5:27 pm wrote:That team of Rafa's may have won nothing but it would still wipe the floor with this one. A prime mid 20's Gerrard up against a 32 year old Milner and Henderson? lol.
We'll learn a lot about us on Wednesday, if not a must win game we certainly don't want to lose it, our CL participation is on the line so we will have to bring our A game. We'll see what our 'top end' is like on Wednesday. Napoli showed that a decent team can get a result there so we are not looking for miracles.

Rafas team struggled at times to break down a lot of teams - couldn’t break down Stoke , Villa , Fulham , West Ham , Spurs , Hull , Arsenal , Everton , Wigan , Middlesbrough- and you think they would “wipe” the floor with the current team based on a couple of guys in midfield who were more defensive. That team relied on the goals of Torres - stop him and the team couldn’t break down plenty of packed strong back lines. They also couldn’t handle pace- you are stuck dreaming of teams that won nothing and fell short due to glaring issues

In 6 years Rafa took us to 2 CL finals and another semi final, he beat the likes of Barcelona, Real Madrid, AC Milan, Inter Milan, Juventus, Chelsea twice (when they were the Man City of the time), Arsenal, Leverkusen, Marseilles, PSV and a host of other European clubs.
He got pipped to the title as well by a United side containing a front line of Ronaldo, Rooney and Tevez managed by one of the greatest managers of all time. He actually beat that United side home and away (including a 4-1 win at Old Trafford) and he also beat Chelsea home and away that year too, what sunk us was dropped points against those teams you mentioned but what you didn't mention was that Gerrard and Torres only played in half the games that season as a pairing because of injury. What sunk Rafa was squad depth but he took over a club that was skint, as soon as he walked through the door Moores announced that he had to sell the club, any money Rafa spent he generated himself through our CL runs.
How many of this team would get into Rafa's? Van Dyke, Salah and maybe Mane, that's about it.

So you only look at the positives for Rafa where as Klopp it’s just about pointing out the negatives

Torres played 24 games in the league , Gerrard 31 - they still won nothing , Torres won nothing at the club , so did Masher - that season the team dropped countless points against supposed weaker cheaper opposition ( the same thing you are being critical towards the current team when pointing out the game against Red star )
Rafa also had the club at 8th in the league after spendinf a good deal of money

Klopp is just starting his third full season, taken the team to three finals including one in the CL and has the club going forward - Rafa started on a high and then went backwards

You are a hypocrite who can’t apply the same criteria - Klopps team now has the best start to a Prem points wise than any of Rafas team did

I would take from the current team - Alisson , VVD , Robertson , Mane , Salah , Firmino - would even prob have AA and once settled Kieta but it’s impossible to really judge

Right now the City team is reported the best Prem team ever and we are just behind them.

Rafa threw the title away that year - we weren’t pipped , they were one dimensional and were unable to break down teams - just go and look at the teams we dropped points against.

This is the best Prem team we have had - it’s just right now we have to go against arguably the best Prem team ever