Liverpool FC Forum

by **Sabre** » Mon May 07, 2007 9:33 am

Rafa-Dodd wrote:This threads gone fu.cking diabolical.

I know Stu's a bit of a t.it sometimes but others are contributing to the state of this thread.

Talk about football - not your fu.cking selfs.

If only!!

In this thread there are good posts about football, although well, to be honest we've been discussing too many things, since Riise is solid or not, to what's our differences with Everton.

I think that many discussions come from what we understand about some words, like "world class player", or "weakest player"

For me a weak player is somebody who's easily replaceable and has more chances to lose his place at the end of the season. For instance I think Arbeloa is a weaker player than Riise. Of course if by weaker player you understand "not one of the six best", then we shall never agree.

But it's a pity our opinions are often more close than it looks and we choose to discuss vehemently instead.

by **dawson99** » Mon May 07, 2007 12:08 pm

guys gonna have a fight? i might have to b!tchslap both yo a$$es 2 time innit? Me and ram and secret squirrrel are the new clique.

So... back to football.

the definates we have so far that we agree:

Dudek

Most say:

Gonzales
Fowler (apart from stu)

Quite a few say:
Bellamy
Crouch
Zenden

One or 2 say:
Kuyt
Agger (dunno if stu wants him gone or just stronger cb whilst agger matures)

So, we definately need a striker or 2. need to see what goalie we get back from loan. And a winger, left sided.

that about sum it up?

by **Effes** » Mon May 07, 2007 1:38 pm

dawson99 wrote:So, we definately need a striker or 2. need to see what goalie we get back from loan. And a winger, left sided.

that about sum it up?

Yep, I'd say so.

by **7_Kewell** » Mon May 07, 2007 1:53 pm

dawson99 wrote:the definates we have so far that we agree:

Dudek

Most say:

Gonzales
Fowler (apart from stu)

Quite a few say:
Bellamy
Crouch
Zenden

One or 2 say:
Kuyt
Agger (dunno if stu wants him gone or just stronger cb whilst agger matures)

So, we definately need a striker or 2. need to see what goalie we get back from loan. And a winger, left sided.

that about sum it up?

I'd agree with most of that...although I think Crouch is an excellent squad player and should be kept.

But if the rumours are true and we do have a lot of money to spend, then i would be more inclined to sell Bellamy before Kuyt or Crouch.

by **LFC2007** » Mon May 07, 2007 1:59 pm

From now on, I'm going to ignore Stu and his disciples in the interests of a better forum.

End of the matter.

by **Effes** » Mon May 07, 2007 2:04 pm

LFC2007 wrote:From now on, I'm going to ignore Stu and his disciples in the interests of a better forum.

End of the matter.

Dont be daft, I want you to arrange a "meet" next time you're in Liverpool.

I'll bring me popcorn.

by **Ace Ventura** » Mon May 07, 2007 2:10 pm

Stu.Murph wrote:I come on here to chat footy, with people who know an understand the game, Mick, Bob, Scott, Scottbot, Ace... its just unfortunate that amoung the good posters there are idiots here aswell.

I know and understand the game :cool:

I always said you were a good lad Stu.

He did mean me didnt he and not the other Ace

by **eds** » Mon May 07, 2007 2:19 pm

This is the way I see our team.........

Reina (wouldn't sell him for any money in the world)
Dudek (would sell him for spare change)
Carson (need him as back-up, shows promise)

Finnan (getting old, we will need to find a replacement pretty soon, he has been a great player at LFC)
Arbeloa (not convinced, but I think he has potential, dare I say it......."a squad player")
Hyppia (won't last another season beyond next, has been our best player in the last decade, it will be very sad when he leaves)
Carragher (is surely the soul of team, not the best defender in the world, but is still immense in his efforts, shows what this great club is all about, should be our captain)
Agger (shows promise, but I am not convinced yet, I will be able to judge more clearly next season, either he sinks or swims once Hyppia leaves)
Paletta (I have watched him a few times and could not hide my dismay, awful player, shows no signs at all)
Riise (he can be awesome some days, he can be terrible some other days, after so many seasons he is still an enigma)
Aurelio (I am still not convinced he will make it, hopefully he hits the ground running when he comes back from injury)

Kewell (superstar, injury prone, head-ache, I would sell him once fit)
Zenden (our worst player, sell him)
Gonzalez (our second worst player, wonder if we can make a profit off him)
Gerrard (there is only one Stevie G)
Alonso (like Reina, wouldn't sell him for any money in the world, has had a disappointing season)
Mascherano (a superstar waiting to be unleashed)
Sissoko (one of the best destroyers on the planet, problem is he can't pass a ball to save his life, sell him if we get offered a decent amount of money)
Luis Garcia (the epitamy of the definition of "squad player")
Pennant (frustrating as hell, has talent and has impressed in the latter half of the season, but I am still not convinced)

Bellamy (not good enough, has speed, but not a natural goal scorer, sell him)
Kuyt (tries hard and plays with real desire, trouble is he doesn't seem like a starting XI player, keep him?)
Crouch (he is very tall)
Fowler (legend, age is catching up with him surely this is his last season at Liverpool)

So after all that I wouldn't batter an eyelid if we got rid of:

* Dudek
* Zenden
* Gonzalez
* Paletta

I would have sentimental feelings when the following leave:

* Hyppia
* Fowler

Not all of the following have to leave, but I would start to see that Rafa is serious if any of the following are to leave:

* Kewell
* Sissoko
* Bellamy or Kuyt or Crouch

We definately need another Centre Back. We need a player that can play RB or LB. We need 2 wingers and 2 strikers.
Rafa will have to spend money to buy at least 3 quality players next year. I'm sure once we see the signings we will have a clearer picture of whether we can challenge the big 2 for the title next season, I expect nothing less.

by **Penguins** » Mon May 07, 2007 3:18 pm

I agree with what you're saying eds, but getting all those players we need for next season is neigh impossible

Sure, we need a CB, LB 2 wingers and 2 strikers.
But we're talking top class, 1st team regular players not more squad players(only type we've been able to afford so far.

Top class strikers cost 20 million+, winger 15 million+.
There is no way that much money will be there...

by **redtrader74** » Mon May 07, 2007 3:29 pm

Eds, pretty much agree with all that, except that i would only sell bellamy of the last five you mentioned, that would mean seven squad members going. Kuyt has basically played a withdrawn role all season, we need to judge him when he plays up front with a top forward, crouch is someone that won't rock the boat and we could keep as part of the squad.

Kewell...if not injured very good for us, if injured no one will buy him, i can't think of a Lm to buy that is as good.

Most importantly Carra should be our captain, love stevie to bits, but he is no captain, crappy demeanor on the pitch, nowhere near as cynical and smart as Carra, who imho knows a lot more about the intricacies of the game, but it won't happen unfortunately.

by **dawson99** » Mon May 07, 2007 4:01 pm

Crappy demeanor on the pitch? nowhere near as smart? Carra does his job at the back, leaving gerrard on the rest...

by **LFC2007** » Mon May 07, 2007 4:19 pm

I would agree with most of what redtrader has said, I agree, of the last five mentioned by Eds I would only consider selling Bellamy.

I agree that three top quality signings is about as many as we need, along with a quality versatile defender.

I think central midfield is fairly solid, the options we have in Sissoko, Gerrard, Alonso and now Mascherano are excellent.

Supplemented with a couple of quality wingers and a top quality striker, our squad will start to look complete.

Kewell is a questionable one, if his injuries persist next season, he has to go, his wages are too much of a burden for a player who has never really done it for us ona consistent basis.

In saying that I still think Rafa will give him a fair shot at proving himself next season.

I definitely wouldn't change the captaincy, I think his body language sometimes appears negative e.g. at some away games, but it's just his frustration with wanting to be successful.

by **redtrader74** » Mon May 07, 2007 4:54 pm

dawson99 wrote:Crappy demeanor on the pitch? nowhere near as smart? Carra does his job at the back, leaving gerrard on the rest...

Be objective and compare the two. Steven motivates and inspires with his performances only, whereas Carra is going on the whole time, directing, speaking to ref all without being captain.

Without doubt SG is the far better player, but JC takes charge of situations, even after the Chelsea game he made sure all the players were together to celebrate, he included everyone. It won't ever happen, but i believe he would be a better capt.
BTW it is common knowledge that JC is a football geek, reading about it, speaking about it, all the time, hell he might be here somewhere...!

by **dawson99** » Mon May 07, 2007 4:59 pm

jc takes charge of the defence. he has absolutely nothing to do with the other players. Everyone listesns to jc and knows that he doesnt need an armband to command respect. SG is captain as he motivates midfield and attack.

they are both captains, but there can be only one armband, and that belongs to SG

by **JoeTerp** » Mon May 07, 2007 5:04 pm

Stu.Murph wrote:
dawson99 wrote:
Stu.Murph wrote:The difference in Liverpool and Everton in terms of ability is probably Reina, Carragher and Gerrard.

Thats hardly a positive now is it.

what do you mean the difference?
you cant seriously say that: agger, finann, alonso, momo,masher,garcia wouldnt walk into the team?

i think you've been watching too much general hospital and getting a little bit over the top dude

Replace Gerrard with Sissoko, replace Carragher with someone like Stubbs and replace Reina with Carson. Are you telling me we'd be third place then?

I think you're talking out of your .

If anyone actually looks at Everton's team theres alot of players in there that are as good as the ones in our first team. Yobo, Arteta, Cahill, Johnson to name a few.

People seem to think the gaps immense, when the fact is you could put Gerrard, Carragher and Reina into their team and they'd be easily as good as us. In the wide area's I'd even say they're better than us, which is embarressing.

that argument doesn't make any sense. Take Rooney, Ronaldo, and Ferdinand off of Man U and see if they win the league? I think not. Of Course a team isn't going to be as good if you take the three top players off it, especially when it includes all of the leadership. But you weren't fair in your replacements either CM would be Alonso and Mascherano without Gerrard. This season would have been Hyypia and Agger at CB if Carra wasn't available, and Carson isn't THAT bad granted he isn't the same level of Reina and might have cost us a few more games. But Everton BEAT us and then drew at Anfield with those three players so to make the argument that its shocking that they would be better than us if you took away our top three is unavailing.

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