Liverpool FC Forum

We haven't come near to winning the league since 1990, except maybe on 2 occasions..I would like to hear what posters think of this. My opinion is the day Kenny resigned, although I can understand why he did

For me a combo of things ended the true Red Empire;

The toll of horrendous horrors of both Heysel and Hillsborough on club

Heysel ban keeping us out of Europe

Owners not adapting to changing game of 90s premier league with all marketing and money which came with it unlike ManU

Dalglish resignation which yes while understandable certainly created a hole which we didn't recover from

ManU with a canny manager back by rich owners gained ascendancy

Combination

Kenny leaving

Souness arriving and ripping the team apart and buying poor players over an 18 month period

Not having owners who were able to cash in on the new found wealth and to build up the stadium as we went along

In the mid 90's we had a forward line that should have won the title but poor tactics and poor defensive signings cost us.

On the pitch, I think it would have been massive if Kenny had stayed at us when the Premier League started. That's when the real money started to come in and also the appeal of the english league was taking off. If Kenny had stayed, pretty sure he would have slowly changed things in terms of rebuilding the squad. Instead, Souness tried to change things to quick and it never worked.

From a commercial point of view, we stagnated under David Moores. We have been late on the scene with regards to making the most of our worldwide appeal and i find it amazing we are still playing in a 45k capacity stadium. We were in a perfect position to push ahead in the late 80's early 90s but we sat on our laurels and watched manure steamroll ahead. We never really built on our success off the pitch as much as we should have.

Bad leadership from the top down, we haven't had a Chief exec anywhere near Peter Robinson and not capitalising on the world appeal of the EPL like ManU did. When the owners realised we needed major investement and decided to sell up they looked after their own pockets and self interests and nearly destroyed us. Where would we be now if DIC had bought us?

laza » Sun Sep 22, 2013 3:05 am wrote:For me a combo of things ended the true Red Empire;

The toll of horrendous horrors of both Heysel and Hillsborough on club

Heysel ban keeping us out of Europe

Owners not adapting to changing game of 90s premier league with all marketing and money which came with it unlike ManU

Dalglish resignation which yes while understandable certainly created a hole which we didn't recover from

ManU with a canny manager back by rich owners gained ascendancy

heysel and hillsborough shook us to the core and after the latter kenny`s decision making (understandably) started going to sh.1t.
he started making odd decisions like leaving beardsley out and brought in players like david speedie and jimmy carter.
the basic answer though is that as a club we have made too many poor decisions over the last 23 years, wether that involves bringing in players, managers or our off the field dealings like the stadium issue or choosing owners we just havent made enough good decisions.

And even with all that we have twice changed the ownership of the football club and handed it to people without
the finance available to take the risk with money we need to get back amongst it quickly, or compete for the very
best players with our rivals.

I appreciate the second sale was out of need rather than choice in many respects but either way those where two
great opportunities missed by the club to push us on massively.

Hillsborough took its toll on many of us, and Kenny is no exception. At the crucial time when fergie pounced we were wasting away under Souness and by the time we'd recovered we faced not an uphill struggle but an upmountain one. Roy came in and pretty soon there were not only mancs at the top of the pile but Arsenal, and by the time Rafa arrived it was an even bigger mountain to climb.

Timing is everything, fergie got his right and got lucky in the signing of Keane and Cantona, two transfers (rival) clubs these days would not contemplate for less than a small fortune. By then day's prices £3.75m and £1.5m were absolute snips, add to that Schmeichel and some shrewd purchases, then the arrival of their kids and challenging for the title in itself became an achievement let alone winning the league.

Money played a part, but back then there was relative parity on the money front.

Owzat » Sun Sep 22, 2013 3:27 pm wrote:Hillsborough took its toll on many of us, and Kenny is no exception. At the crucial time when fergie pounced we were wasting away under Souness and by the time we'd recovered we faced not an uphill struggle but an upmountain one. Roy came in and pretty soon there were not only mancs at the top of the pile but Arsenal, and by the time Rafa arrived it was an even bigger mountain to climb.

Timing is everything, fergie got his right and got lucky in the signing of Keane and Cantona, two transfers (rival) clubs these days would not contemplate for less than a small fortune. By then day's prices £3.75m and £1.5m were absolute snips, add to that Schmeichel and some shrewd purchases, then the arrival of their kids and challenging for the title in itself became an achievement let alone winning the league.

Money played a part, but back then there was relative parity on the money front.

ferguson was also lucky that he took over united in 86 and not 2006, no way would any united manager get six years these days to turn them around. people often forget he finished 11th and 13th in successive seasons. moyes hasnt been there 6 league games never mind 6 years and there are already rumblings of discontent.

I do believe we need a shrewd operator as CEO/MD to take the club back to where we used to be. Not sure Ian Ayre is that man, or to be fair to him not his real area of expertise. David Dein was massive for Arsenal. He was the one who brought in Wenger and a lot of their successful signings when they winning the league. No surprise as soon as he left, they are not as successful. I don't think he is actually working with a club at the moment and I think bringing him in would be a huge plus.  Similarly Levy at spurs has done a great job there. I mean they were an absolute nothing club 10-15 years ago and look where he has got them.  Remember reading an article where Commoli said those two were some of the cleverest/shrewdest guys he had come across in football

ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Sun Sep 22, 2013 6:32 pm wrote:

Owzat » Sun Sep 22, 2013 3:27 pm wrote:Hillsborough took its toll on many of us, and Kenny is no exception. At the crucial time when fergie pounced we were wasting away under Souness and by the time we'd recovered we faced not an uphill struggle but an upmountain one. Roy came in and pretty soon there were not only mancs at the top of the pile but Arsenal, and by the time Rafa arrived it was an even bigger mountain to climb.

Timing is everything, fergie got his right and got lucky in the signing of Keane and Cantona, two transfers (rival) clubs these days would not contemplate for less than a small fortune. By then day's prices £3.75m and £1.5m were absolute snips, add to that Schmeichel and some shrewd purchases, then the arrival of their kids and challenging for the title in itself became an achievement let alone winning the league.

Money played a part, but back then there was relative parity on the money front.

R
ferguson was also lucky that he took over united in 86 and not 2006, no way would any united manager get six years these days to turn them around. people often forget he finished 11th and 13th in successive seasons. moyes hasnt been there 6 league games never mind 6 years and there are already rumblings of discontent.

This^.

No manager will ever again be afforded the time bacon face got at the mancs. Those days are well and truly gone.

Poor decisions, tragedies and not moving with the times.

It all started with Heysel, Hillsborough, Kenny leaving and Souness changing too much too soon.
This knocked us off our perch.

Then our off field issues such as a considerably smaller stadium and less funds made it difficult to get back. 
We knew back in 2003 that we needed far wealthier owners and the search begun.
It took 4 odd years before we shockingly sold to Hicks and Gillette.
We then spent 3 years trying to get rid of them.

As a final dig at us, they sacked our world class manager and left us with.... wait for it... Roy Hodgson!
Hodgson screwed up as much as he possibly could in 6 months.

Then we wasted huge money on Andy Carroll, Downing, Adam etc. 
Its only now since January that we're finally starting to look half decent again.

It will still take a few years of consistently making all the right decisions before we'll be able to challenge again on a regular basis.