Liverpool FC Forum

by **bigmick** » Tue Oct 19, 2004 9:09 am

There you go then, Murph has spoken. All opinions are irrelavent. Give the lad a chance:D

by **Redtribe** » Tue Oct 19, 2004 9:54 am

bigmick wrote:On the question of Reyes, this is one that always comes up. If its not Reyes who took a year to settle in, its Pires or Henry. The two Frenchmen were established internationals when signed so proof of ability wasn't needed, merely them getting used to the Premiership. Reyes, I think showed ability from day one. Wenger gave him the kid glove treatment and introduced him gently as you can do with a good team but he showed plenty of talent all the same. To be fair to Cisse, if he was playing for the A rse he would probably look a much better player. Thing is though, he isn't is he?

Mick, Henry was very much not an established international when he played first signed for Arsenal.
He was probably in fairness in a similar position to Cisse!
Remember before he played for Arsenal he was still playing as a wideman most of the time!!

by **Redrider** » Tue Oct 19, 2004 10:02 am

Bigmick, sorry for expressing an opinion and I do hope I am wrong !

In my dreams Cisse, will be the player who races in from the half way line cutting through the opposition midfield with a combination of pace, poise and superb control, brushing off the attentions of defenders with strength and power, unleashing a left foot shot from the edge of the box, leaving the goalie motionless and awestruck as the 'onion bag' is stretched and sent hurtling back into the faces of the Fan's in the Stretford End/Gladys St etc. !!

We have been living on Hopes and Dreams for the last 10 years, watching a succession of big purchases come and go while we sit back and 'give them a chance' !!

I reckon, I have enough experience now to spot another dud in the pipeline, Sorry Murph' if you don't like the predictions, go and join your namesake on the Charlton Website, they might be less realistic there.
But take it from me Cisse will be peddled for £5m come the arrival of a serious striker like Morientes.

by **ICE-MAN** » Tue Oct 19, 2004 10:42 am

i think cisse is still young and finding his feet, he is trying to base himself on henry (no jokes bout cheyrou being next zidane we haerd them all before!) but i think it is good that hes drifting out wide to get the ball henry always does it and defenders never know whether to follow him or not, plus when cisse gets more of the ball and has a couple of runs at defenders and lays off some passes that gives players such as himself confidence rather than being isolated up front on his own with shyte service from both wingers, at least hes trying as well unlike owen, owen was content to sit up front moaning and not trying to get into the game.

in the next few weeks if rafa can get kewell to get the finger out of his ****** and if nunez is a decent winger this will create more opportunities for cisse, i know it was only one shot but its a good example, cisses shot against chelsea which curled just round the post he created it out of nothing something heskey would never have done heskey would have fallen over!

so give him a chance and dont ever curse him with the french heskey tag thats cruel :cool:

henry was shyte in his first season at arsenal, larrson was shyte in his first season at celtic they needed a bit of time but not the four or five years heskey had, one season and thats it if he doesnt do it after that good riddance :cool:

by **bigmick** » Tue Oct 19, 2004 11:42 am

Red don't be sorry mate. Opinions? I'm all for 'em. As it goes I broadly agree with you. I just find it a bit frustrating with this forum that when you stand up and put your opinion out there, you are constantly told "give him a chance", "it's far too early to make a judgement etc etc". I guess we all now agree that Diouf was a total waste of 10 million quid? Right, at what point was it Ok to say it. I would back your experience and judgement Red, I think we've drastically overspent on Cisse.
I've said this a number of times before but i'm going to say it again. I've nothing against him as a player. I even think he's quite promising and enigmatic in a sort of Stan Collymorish sort of way. I just don't think that he is worth anything like 14 million quid right now. I'd say Red' that at about 4 or 5 million you have it about right.

by **Redtribe** » Tue Oct 19, 2004 12:45 pm

My opinion is the lad needs time!
To be totally honest i think the problem with our strikers have alot to do with a poor midfield at the moment or to be precise our wingplay!
£14mill is alot of money and at present the return we are getting isnt what we all hoped for but we may have payed a fair price if he starts banging in goals when he has settled and the team has settled also!

by **Redrider** » Tue Oct 19, 2004 1:48 pm

Sorry redtribe, neither Cisse or Baros have a style of play that relies on crosses from wingers.
Just get used to the idea, that Cisse is a dud.
All this wait and see, give the lad a chance etc. is a complete load of nonsense. How long did you sit there and watch Heskey labouring, before you decided it was safe to criticise him ?
I am telling you, I have seen too many of these expensive purchases arrive and go now. If they havn't shown their worth after a doz' or so games, take it from me they are not going to develop into somthing they are not.
Cisse is no more than a £4m/£5m support playerfor a club of Liverpool's stature.

by **Redrider** » Tue Oct 19, 2004 2:18 pm

bigmick wrote:"it's far too early to make a judgement etc etc". I guess we all now agree that Diouf was a total waste of 10 million quid? Right, at what point was it Ok to say it. I would back your experience and judgement Red, I think we've drastically overspent on Cisse.

Sorry Mick, I didn't read your post before I had a go at Redtribe, who incidently is one of these give the lad a chance, let's keep dreaming marchants along with Iceman, who came out with a classic- 'Let's wait until Nunez get's going he will provide the service for Cisse'
Where are these guy's coming from ? Just arrived on the last boat me thinks !!
You are correct about Diouf, another £10m of unfulfilled potential, can't say I jumped on his back until the spitting incident at Celtic, which would have been the perfect excuse to off-load. But he never really indicated that he could do anything above the ordinary within his first dozen games in a Redshirt.

by **ICE-MAN** » Tue Oct 19, 2004 2:26 pm

well hold on redrider, lets go out and buy duff totti raul ronaldo and ronaldinho in january, your living in cuckoo land mate if u think we can just go out and get players like that, yeah we all agreed heskey was shyte but after a season or two, we gave diouf a season and then agreed he was shyte, and how do u know cisse and baros are not players who like playing with wingers? we never had wingers in the first place so theres no way of you being that good of a talent spotter

theres only been a few games so far this season, what about henry at arsenal he was considered shyte after his first whole season and then got used to the way things are done in england and look at him now, im not saying cisse is the same as henry but give the lad a chance, after a few games your saying hes muck, hes scored three good goals against spurs norwhich and monaco so the potentails there mate, it just annoys me that so called fans like you jeer and boo players like cisse just when he arrived and really do their confidence in its only october, if he still has three goals come next may then il agree with u! :cool:

by **ICE-MAN** » Tue Oct 19, 2004 2:27 pm

BTW how do u know nunez wont be a great addition for our wings? bet u didnt think garcia would be that good when he plays at anfield! :cool:

by **Redtribe** » Tue Oct 19, 2004 2:55 pm

Henry doesnt rely on crosses but needs wide men to create space and act as an outlet for the midfield!

by **Redrider** » Tue Oct 19, 2004 2:55 pm

Iceman, Sorry sport, keep on dreaming if you wish, but Cisse is not going to prove to be an inspired purchase and no amount of new players, wingers, midfielders etc will bring any more out of him than we have seen to-date.
He is too lightweight for the role he aspire's to.
I am not booing or jeering, just telling you that bitter experience says he will not cut-it.
I have lived with all this complacent, give people a chance attitude now for more time than I like to remember and watched LFC sadly decline from being the 'Power in Europe' to a point where in all honesty we were lucky to sneek into Europe last season.
As a result of a string of very bad purchases we have wasted a lot of money and lost an excellent opportunity to build an outstanding team around some of the best home-grown talent in Owen and Gerrard that we have had in living memory.
If Cisse was as good as his fee, we would not currently be looking at Morientes. There is not just me who can see his shortcomings.
Iceman, take off your red-tinted specks and come alive.

by **ICE-MAN** » Tue Oct 19, 2004 3:17 pm

yeah ok he hasnt lived up to expectations but i still think its too early to judge him, considering new club new culture new league new language and he still scored three decent enough goals i think he will improve and be better than both heskey and diouf but he wont be as good as henry im just using henrys terrible first season as an example!
and we are looking at morientes because owen left, if cisse and baros got injured we would have pongolle and mellor thats a terrible lack of strength in depth, rafa didnt just say right 8 games cisse is shyte we need someone else!

by **Redrider** » Tue Oct 19, 2004 3:49 pm

Iceman, your are correct, Cisse will become a super-sub when Morientes or whoever arrives, he will become exactly what you suggest we need, that is cover for the main man.
He is also better than Diouf, but as yet no better than Heskey I am afraid.
Don't be surprised if he heads off for pastures new, come the end of the season

by **stmichael** » Tue Oct 19, 2004 3:52 pm

jim_morrison_supported_liverpool wrote:all this main man business i dont understand.

agree to an extent. arsenal have already proved that you don't need one. they have four or 5 players who's movement means that they don't really have a position. henry doesn't play as a striker, neither does bergkamp or reyes.

however i do agree that it would be a massive bonus if we could get a stiker in who iss good in the air. there's no point having wingers unless you have a shearer type player who can finish off the crosses.

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