Liverpool FC Forum

[neil]

Woodgate is twice the player any of our defenders are in just about Every aspect of the game. King is probably also alot better than any player we have there, as is Bale and also Hutton and Corluka.

I'm afraid you've just lost all credibility there stu, your views are just plain wrong. Daniel Agger is masterful in possession and will be fondly remembered long after he has gone, Skertel is as good as any defensive player in Europe imho, I also believe in Insua we have found a fantastic full back who will serve the club well for a least the next half dozen years. I would not swap any of these for what spurs have on their books.

[GYBS]

you were doing so well at actually having a decent debate there until that last post where you just show your true colours .oh and i actually said kuyt has scored more than torres this season . You are incapable of tolerance towards other peoples opinions and views . How old are you exactly ? What makes you so arrogant and think that you are right in everything you say ? Why are you incapable of understand that maybe just maybe you might well be wrong on certain matters and that you dont know everything and that your not always right .if all these sunday league players are better than kuyt how come they arent in the prem and playing international football then ?

[account deleted by request]

you say only one defender is good enough yet for the last three seasons our defence has been consistently one of the best in the league ?.

I think the fact that we usually play with 2 defensive midfielders could have some bearing on it mate.

[Fo Dne]

And bullard is a centre mid not a right mid is he not ? Put him out right and he will just drift inside and clog up the middle , thats a waste and when did bullard become this great player ? He has looked ok playing for wigan and fulham but nothing outstanding . Plus kuyt has scored double what bullard has this season so far ?

Why are you even attempting to comment on a player who you know nothing about what so ever?

He has played right midfield for years and has also played centrally. He's equally adept at playing both positions. He has stood out at EVERY team he's ever played for like a sore thumb and West Ham were foolish to let him go as a young player.

He is a great footballer with exceptional awareness, passing ability and intelligence and completely bossed the game between us and Fulham at anfield earlier this season (no doubt you didn't see that though, or notice). Mascherano and the brilliant Lucas couldn't even get near him.

And in another post I posted about stupid arguements.

Cisse scored 19 goals for Liverpool in his last season "from the right wing" should we re-sign him then as he's scored more than Kuyt ever will in a season?

Pathetic.

I can't even be bothered replying to you anymore, I'll just do what everyone else does and ignore you.

[Fo Dne]

you say only one defender is good enough yet for the last three seasons our defence has been consistently one of the best in the league ?.

I think the fact that we usually play with 2 defensive midfielders could have some bearing on it mate.

Not to mention tactical play, the players strengths, the movements and the compatibility.

[GYBS]

indeed saint so that means masher is more important than what stu has stated but during those seasons saw plenty of times defending of high quality from players like agger skittles etc . So combination of the two

[redhayesy]

so you two have a lot in common with each other after all!!

[GYBS]

do you mean the tactical play that has been masterminded by our manager ? The strengths of our defenders and compatibility of them ? If thats the case that means they form a strong unit so why change any of them ? Oh and seen bullard plenty of times and yeah he sticks out in poor teams , so have plenty of other players in the past , doesnt make them high class player . If he was that good and had been for years why has he never been at one of the big clubs then ? He is decent and nothing more in my opinion .

[Fo Dne]

indeed saint so that means masher is more important than what stu has stated but during those seasons saw plenty of times defending of high quality from players like agger skittles etc . So combination of the two

What can you say to posts like this?



Am I really the only one that thinks this boy lacks intelligence to extreme levels never before seen on Newkit?



Dear god!

[Bad Bob]

indeed saint so that means masher is more important than what stu has stated but during those seasons saw plenty of times defending of high quality from players like agger skittles etc . So combination of the two

What can you say to posts like this?



Am I really the only one that thinks this boy lacks intelligence to extreme levels never before seen on Newkit?



Dear god!

So ignore him, then.  The whole point of my appeal in the other thread was to cut down on posts like these in order to clear the way for more quality football discussion, such as the lengthy post you put up a little while back.

[taff]

Ramos can't speak a word of English mate. So you can't really compare "managerial abilities" so to speak.

1. Ok Rafa was hardly Stephen Fry in his first year but he learnt the language and Ramos didnt.  In fact I will tell you a story.  My Brothers father in law got some tickets for Alonsos Anfield debut as he works a lot in Valencia and knew someone who knew Rafa etc etc so he took my niece and nephew to the game.  He met up with rafa and Alonso and Garcia and in politeness he spoke Spanish to them and Garcia and Alonso looked horrified and insisted on speaking English as the boss had ordered them to, no matter how bad their English was "we are in Liverpool not in Spain no" as they said.  This is a difference between Ramos and Rafa for example.

With regards to Spurs there are problems there with some of the players they have, in terms of compatibility and fitness. Bale, Woodgate, King and Hutton are a good back four. As individual's I'd say all are far better than anything we have, with centre halfs being absoloute stratospheres apart really without there even being a comparrison (in terms of pure ability).

2. Compatibility, fitness surely the job of the manager to improve this and lets see if we can think of a team who are very fit and have a great defensive record.

King and Woodgate are probably better than all of our centre halfs at everything if I'm honest. But due to tactical play, the midfield (or lack of infront of them) fitness issues with them both amoungst other smaller details then they can't really show it consistently. They also (in my opinion) don't quite seem to compliment each other properly as I don't think either of them are complete "sweepers".

3. Tactical play, midfield in front, fitness and small details.  Again a bachanded compliment to Rafa from yourself as he is rather obsessive about these things

A good centre half pairing usually has a dominant player (Hyypia, Ferdinand, Terry, Adams, Pallister) and a sweeper (Henchoz, Vidic, Carvalho, Keown, Bruce). Do me King and Woodgate are much the same player as are our centre halfs and Arsenal's centre halfs. For me the best sweeper in the league is Gallas, the best dominant player is Ferdinand.

4. Agree although I think Carra and Agger are a good example as well but I concede that we will never agree on this

In terms of a better affordable striker than Kuyt I can think of one straight away. Owen. 50 times the player.

5. Agree but with the best striker in the world in our system then Owen would need to do a lot of donkey work on the right hand side and be super fit.  If only we had a player who was super fit and prepared to do all the donkey work for none of the glory,  although that was a bit sarcy and I support Owen returning

You mention Agger and Skyrtel. Both are decent but aren't great defenders. Neither of them are as good an individual as Sami Hyypia at his best and thats what we need to be looking at. They are crackers as back up, they are even good enough to be second centre halfs (for me we have Carra for that)  but they aren't good enough for us to have Carragher next to them or even those two next to each other regularly.

We need someone better as a "first choice". The other thing with Woodgate is I feel his injuries would allow Agger and Skertyl (I spell it differently everytime ) enough playing time to keep them happy and make them feel important parts of the squad.

6. What concerned me at the start of the season was for the first five games or so I had Reina as man of the match and I worry when our goalie is Mom although some might say that making sure he bought a true world class keeper as a priority was an example of that tactical thing you mentioned earlier but I do think that Reina is very important to the defence but it goes back to that compatibilty thing that gives us the defence we have. 

I concede that Rafa made sure he got the defence and midfield sorted first but now needs to turn that small detailed tactical know how to the attack and 5 goals in the last game is a good start I think and without the best striker in the world as well.  Now he has made mistakes of course but all in all without the huge sums for a quick fix I am happy over all.  Now I know we might never agree on this but if you look at your reasons for why Spurs' back 4 hasnt worked then why is it that ours with inferior players has worked.

I hope I used the quote thing right

[GYBS]

whats the point when someone constantly resorts to insulting peoples intelligence just cause they have a different opinion . Thats what the forum should be , people giving their opinion and not having to be insulted by someone just cause they disagree with that persons opinion . Seen people insult mick myself and others today just because that person didnt share the same opinion .

[Fo Dne]

Ramos can't speak a word of English mate. So you can't really compare "managerial abilities" so to speak.

1. Ok Rafa was hardly Stephen Fry in his first year but he learnt the language and Ramos didnt.  In fact I will tell you a story.  My Brothers father in law got some tickets for Alonsos Anfield debut as he works a lot in Valencia and knew someone who knew Rafa etc etc so he took my niece and nephew to the game.  He met up with rafa and Alonso and Garcia and in politeness he spoke Spanish to them and Garcia and Alonso looked horrified and insisted on speaking English as the boss had ordered them to, no matter how bad their English was "we are in Liverpool not in Spain no" as they said.  This is a difference between Ramos and Rafa for example.

With regards to Spurs there are problems there with some of the players they have, in terms of compatibility and fitness. Bale, Woodgate, King and Hutton are a good back four. As individual's I'd say all are far better than anything we have, with centre halfs being absoloute stratospheres apart really without there even being a comparrison (in terms of pure ability).

2. Compatibility, fitness surely the job of the manager to improve this and lets see if we can think of a team who are very fit and have a great defensive record.

King and Woodgate are probably better than all of our centre halfs at everything if I'm honest. But due to tactical play, the midfield (or lack of infront of them) fitness issues with them both amoungst other smaller details then they can't really show it consistently. They also (in my opinion) don't quite seem to compliment each other properly as I don't think either of them are complete "sweepers".

3. Tactical play, midfield in front, fitness and small details.  Again a bachanded compliment to Rafa from yourself as he is rather obsessive about these things

A good centre half pairing usually has a dominant player (Hyypia, Ferdinand, Terry, Adams, Pallister) and a sweeper (Henchoz, Vidic, Carvalho, Keown, Bruce). Do me King and Woodgate are much the same player as are our centre halfs and Arsenal's centre halfs. For me the best sweeper in the league is Gallas, the best dominant player is Ferdinand.

4. Agree although I think Carra and Agger are a good example as well but I concede that we will never agree on this

In terms of a better affordable striker than Kuyt I can think of one straight away. Owen. 50 times the player.

5. Agree but with the best striker in the world in our system then Owen would need to do a lot of donkey work on the right hand side and be super fit.  If only we had a player who was super fit and prepared to do all the donkey work for none of the glory,  although that was a bit sarcy and I support Owen returning

You mention Agger and Skyrtel. Both are decent but aren't great defenders. Neither of them are as good an individual as Sami Hyypia at his best and thats what we need to be looking at. They are crackers as back up, they are even good enough to be second centre halfs (for me we have Carra for that)  but they aren't good enough for us to have Carragher next to them or even those two next to each other regularly.

We need someone better as a "first choice". The other thing with Woodgate is I feel his injuries would allow Agger and Skertyl (I spell it differently everytime ) enough playing time to keep them happy and make them feel important parts of the squad.

6. What concerned me at the start of the season was for the first five games or so I had Reina as man of the match and I worry when our goalie is Mom although some might say that making sure he bought a true world class keeper as a priority was an example of that tactical thing you mentioned earlier but I do think that Reina is very important to the defence but it goes back to that compatibilty thing that gives us the defence we have. 

I concede that Rafa made sure he got the defence and midfield sorted first but now needs to turn that small detailed tactical know how to the attack and 5 goals in the last game is a good start I think and without the best striker in the world as well.  Now he has made mistakes of course but all in all without the huge sums for a quick fix I am happy over all.  Now I know we might never agree on this but if you look at your reasons for why Spurs' back 4 hasnt worked then why is it that ours with inferior players has worked.

I hope I used the quote thing right

Ya didn't, you're are officially the newkit mong

[taff]

I agree with you there. 

Liked the backhanded Rafa compliments by the way are you changing your opinion

[Fo Dne]

whats the point when someone constantly resorts to insulting peoples intelligence just cause they have a different opinion . Thats what the forum should be , people giving their opinion and not having to be insulted by someone just cause they disagree with that persons opinion . Seen people insult mick myself and others today just because that person didnt share the same opinion .

Its got absoloutely nothing to do with the fact you have a different opinion.

Its the mindless idiotic way you portray it, the pathetic arguements you use to back it up, the complete failiure to argue any point with any ounce of knowledge of that point, the lack of ability to even acknowledge what someone has said in a point and challenge it, the fact you answer questions with questions and the constant going round in circles.

You also have this stupid notion that its impossible for anyone to know anything about the game if they aren't employed in a professional mannor at the highest level.

The arguement, such as if such an such is so good at something why aren't they doing it is a joke of an arguement.

There could be any number of personal and none personal reasons for it, whats even more funny is, on the internet you could be arguing with anyone, and I mean ANYONE. I've got a mate who plays for a lower league club and often uses their forum to talk to fans of the team he plays for and he's had some heated debates with these fans, some of them slag him off for being (he is like ) they don't know its him posting.

I've disagreed with Mick, ConnO'var and Sabre many times. Mick I think talks out of his alot, but also talks alot of sense aswell. You however, just seem to spout mindless which is designed to do nothing, other than wind people who know what they are talkin about up!

PS for example, I'm in the middle of disagreeing with Taff, am I insulting him?

There ya go!