Liverpool FC Forum

[Alex G.]

What I seen from Darby he seems to me a very normal player, nothing special, I Know he´s scouser and that´s great for the fans but....

[THEBARON]

Well Stevie G has played full back before...................

[maypaxvobiscum]

What I seen from Darby he seems to me a very normal player, nothing special, I Know he´s scouser and that´s great for the fans but....

he is really good. i think him and Warnock would be pretty good on the flanks. the thing is, being scousers, they have a HUGE bit of determination, spirit and pride playing their balls out for Liverpool that Degan and Doss cant say they have.

[Madmax]

future line up

           Carra

torres  kuyt  gerrard  skrl

       el zhar     agger   

macha                   babel

           riena

            kuyt 

Anyways skrkl right back was a complete joke and another odd decision by mr rafa.........

[red_guy]

The answer would be insanity..... well u all watched the game, no need for elaboration.
By the way, where's the youngsters when we need them ..and i don't mean Ngog (useless) ..

[REDTILLDEAD]

Dont be suprised if Benitez plays Reina at right back against sunderland?......nothing ilogical Benitez does surprises me anymore.....the guys well lost the plot!.   

[Ace Ventura]

I am with Scott and Nanny, if Arbeloa isnt fit why not have our reserve team captain come in and play in his natural position, rather than play people out of position all of the time.
Maybe Darby might not cut it - but i personally think he would be solid and dependable, not spectacular, but he is pacey enough and gets up and down, you dont see him get beat 1 v 1 very often either (although its obviously not a great standard he usually plays at)
He could come in and be a more than able back up to Arbeloa imo.
Also what message does this send out to these young lads ?

After winning the youth cup twice recently then comfortably winning the reserves league you would think that some of them would be considered good enough players to cover for injuries/suspensions etc. But with Rafas massive overload of squad players they never get a look in, then when there arent even fit players in the positions these lads play, instead he plays someone out of position.
No wonder the ressies are struggling this season, how demotivated would you be ?

On the subject of the thread, skyrtl at right back was clearly a mistake, and should have been changed after about 15 minutes when we could all see that it wasnt working, simple as that.

[milou]

To me it's selections like this one which are the problems I have with "styling" perfectly illustrated. Obviously Arbeloa is injured, and no doubt Deggan is as well, so we play Carra there right, since he's played there many times for us before?

Er, no actually. We decide to move Skyrtel out there for his debut in the right back slot in a Liverpool shirt. I'm guessing the reason was because Skyrtel has more pace than carra, and would be better suited to playing against Downing? Now I haven't seen the game, but by all accounts it didn't really work. I must confess here as well that as I never said it before the match, I am speaking after the event here. I would though ask people to take it on trust, that had I been here before the match and someone told me that Skyrtel was going to be playing right back, I would have said it was ridiculous.

Too clever by half for me. Needless, silly tinkering. It's not FIFA foorball manager 07/08, it's real life. Benayoun and Riera don't need to rest because they played on Wednesday, and Stuart Downing isn't good enough to warrant completely changing your set up. When will we ever learn, or more to the point, will we ever learn?

I came back after a few days and itching to look for a good thread to spill my thoughts and found yours..

Where do we start?

Choosing between a tried and tested rightback in carra (granted not his most preferred position) and someone who hasn't even played there before in Skytel? Carra for me anytime, anyday. I challenge anyone to disagree with me as I am going ahead to even speculate that had this be a decision to be made by fergie, he would have chosen carra too. well, this is no ordinary man as his fcuking team is now strolling to another title.

Honestly, Skytel's poor performance on the day speaks for itself really. Did we lose the game purely because of this decision? Well, probably not.. But we created ourselves unnecessary problems by dubious decisions all over the place.

And this Skytel's decision is the tip of the iceberg of a Rafa's footballing method that I really can't understand TBH. Throughout his tenure, I have observed that Rafa has a tendency and liking (quite why I am not sure) to buy someone who is good in one position, but rather use him in another role.

You want proof?
- Kuyt was a lethal central striker but now playing as a right mid.
- Benanyoun was a free roaming advance mid but now playing mostly on the right. Due to gerrard's injury, he has been asked to play a more free role behind the lone striker and excelled.
- Cisse was a central striker but played consistently on the right.
- Keane was a second striker who didn't even play enough for what he was bought for and quickly offloaded at a huge loss.
- Lucas was an attacking mid (brazilian footballer of the year for god sake!) and is now asked to play a more defensive role.
- Babel was a forward and is now consistently asked to play on the left till his form suffers.

Who are Rafa's better signings?
- Agger and skytel who were central defenders, before and after they came
- Arbeloa who was a right/left back and played as a fullback.
- Reira who was bought as a left mid and played as a left mid.
- Mash who was a defensive mid and played as one.
- Aureilio who was a left back and played as one.
- Pennant (not everyone will agree I know) who was a right mid who makes crosses, played on the right and made crosses. then allowed to leave FREE.
- Bellamy who was an infamously bad-boy pacy striker, played reasonably well as one and was sold, well apparently bcos Rafa suddenly realized he was a bad boy
- Fowler who was our god and came back as one but despite rescuing us time and again in his first season (second home-coming), couldn't get a game in the following season and asked to leave.
- Crouch who was a target man, played well as one but being "ill-treated" and "encouraged" to leave. Shouldn't he be convinced to stay on if Rafa has a master-plan in mind? Does he even have one?

So who did Rafa's successfully "groomed" into a new position?
- Torres! The ONLY one whom Rafa has actually successfully "altered" and played better in his new role as an all alone striker. He is a different player (a not so good one) when he plays with David Villa for Spain.

So is it not obvious and logical (it is to me) that when your scout studies a player, he can only mostly judge based on how well he plays at the position he is playing in? Then why does Rafa still frequently persist on buying someone as a square peg but playing him as a round hole?

A lot of people argued that manu has a better squad or better players.. i seriously can't agree. I just think fergie buy and play players as they are.. sometimes (but rarely) with minor adjustments to their new roles.. and even that should be exception rather than rule. Only when you study well, buy well and use well.. then you can slowly improve on the team backbone.. instead of allowing useful players (like bellamy, pennant, fowler, crouch) to leave and replacing with players of similar or worse quality.. then proceed to play them out of position!

I hold Rafa fully responsible for the list of flops (and we apparently have much more than other top clubs) because he is the boss.

I still can't believe how we "gifted" the title to Man Utd without a proper fight..

[andy_g]

i read that benitez' reasoning was that carra had complained of having 'heavy legs' so would be unable to run enough to play right back. so then why the hell didn't he sit the lad on the bench for a well deserved rest, stick sami and skrtel in the middle and darby on the right? to think that a cb who had never played at right back before and a genuinely tired cb would be a part the best team available is laughable.

darby is a promising young player and would have given 100%. surely the threat of downing wasn't so great as to mean he wouldn't have been up to it.

[Reinas No.1 Fan]

Its as big of a mistake as houllier made when he started playing henchoz at right back, what were people opinions on that.

Tis a silly thing to do, especially as how Carra could of, and should of played there.

[Emerald Red]

Jamie Carragher at right back? Surely that's taking the p*ss. It's insane!

[bigmick]

Jamie Carragher at right back? Surely that's taking the p*ss. It's insane!

It probably is a little mate I agree. What's insane about it is after five years of the Rafalution, we haven't got a viable alternative to Alvarro Arbeloa. He's a member of the TINA (there is no alternative) club, along with Riera, Reina and Torres. Those four players not only feature in our best team, they feature in every team unless we are prepared to play somebody out of position or somebody who is patently obviously substandard to replace them.

After five years and 200 million quid spent, you're quite right mate it's insane. Just out of interest, what did you think of playing Skyrtel there?

[Emerald Red]

Didn't Carra play as a right-back for a season or two? Surely if we go three at the back, the likes of Carra and Skrtel can play in those positions as you're effectively playing with three center backs that don't have to advance much. Really, I don't see what the big deal is at all. Maybe if we'd better backing we'd have players like Alves playing there instead.

[bigmick]

Didn't Carra play as a right-back for a season or two?

He did, and he's played there a few times this season with varying degrees of success. That was why I posted the original question in the thread starter. Why play Martin Skyrtel there, when Carragher CAN play there, albeit that's it's not his best position?

Once again, what did you think fo the the decision to play Skyrtel there as opposed to Carragher, inspiration or insanity?

As for the "better backing", well we have spent 200 million quid in five seasons. I suppose if we'd spent 600 million then we might reasonably expect to have even better players than we've got I'll concede that. It is quite a lot of money though is 200 million, and for that, I'd expect to have not just a decent right back (which we've got to be honest) but also one or two players who are in behind him.

Same as Riera, I'd expect to have a sensible alternative left midfielder. I know we can puish our best left full back forward to play there if needs be, or we can play a failed centre forward there if we're really desperate, or a little bloke who nobody knows his best spot (although we do know it ain't left midfield) there, as long as he hasn't scored a goal in the previous game obviously, but what about a reserve left midfielder?

Strikers, as we are now discovering to our cost, get injured sometimes. It helps if you've got more than one. We did have, but we sold him without bringing in a replacement 

As you say, "taking the p!ss", "insane" is absolutely on the money. After five years and 200 million quid spent, we've only got one viable option as a striker.

You've said many times over the years "I don't fecking believe this place sometimes" and listening to how some people go on, I couldn't agree more.

[Emerald Red]

Didn't Carra play as a right-back for a season or two?

He did, and he's played there a few times this season with varying degrees of success. That was why I posted the original question in the thread starter. Why play Martin Skyrtel there, when Carragher CAN play there, albeit that's it's not his best position?

Once again, what did you think fo the the decision to play Skyrtel there as opposed to Carragher, inspiration or insanity?

As for the "better backing", well we have spent 200 million quid in five seasons. I suppose if we'd spent 600 million then we might reasonably expect to have even better players than we've got I'll concede that. It is quite a lot of money though is 200 million, and for that, I'd expect to have not just a decent right back (which we've got to be honest) but also one or two players who are in behind him.

Same as Riera, I'd expect to have a sensible alternative left midfielder. I know we can puish our best left full back forward to play there if needs be, or we can play a failed centre forward there if we're really desperate, or a little bloke who nobody knows his best spot (although we do know it ain't left midfield) there, as long as he hasn't scored a goal in the previous game obviously, but what about a reserve left midfielder?

Strikers, as we are now discovering to our cost, get injured sometimes. It helps if you've got more than one. We did have, but we sold him without bringing in a replacement 

As you say, "taking the p!ss", "insane" is absolutely on the money. After five years and 200 million quid spent, we've only got one viable option as a striker.

You've said many times over the years "I don't fecking believe this place sometimes" and listening to how some people go on, I couldn't agree more.

No, mick. Better backing as in going in for the kill and getting the main target. If Chelsea or any other club are sniffing about, we get in first, slap down a big f*ck off sum, and get our man. When's the last time Liverpool FC made a statement like that? I can't remember...like ever.