Liverpool FC Forum

[Doeboy]

No offence taken Stu, I think we would all love you to be wrong but it is what it is. Totally fine to call it as you see rather than sugar coat over it. We clearly have some problems and maybe last year did paper over cracks (mainly our defensive incapabilities) and losing a player of Suarez's ability would hurt any team but the drop in performance this season compared to last season has really staggered me.

Putting aside the results, the performances are completely unrecognisable from last year. I wouldn't be as bothered if we were playing good football but maybe not getting the results as you know eventually you will turn the corner but as it stands I'm really not seeing any improvement with each passing game which is seriously concerning.

I hate this reliance on one or two players. As a club, we should be able to cope with Sturridge out. Obviously we miss him, but it shouldn't be to a degree where we look toothless without him. Balotelli is quite clearly not suited to playing up top on his own and looking like a panic buy. I am going to say something which people will probably laugh at, but as it was late in the day in the transfer window, I would have taken Shane Long over Balotelli for maybe a season if there really was no other option. Why? He run's all day long and presses from the front, fits into the style of play Rodgers wants us to play

[Stu the Red]

I waffled a bit in the last post, the point was, Saturday league players are good enough to compete with semi professional players in general. Obviously the semi professional standard players are better individually however, they still have the ability to compete and cause upsets,

Where as if you have one against someone like Scholes for example. then they are in absolutely no way able to compete due to the wider range of skill. Its the same in the premier league with good players and great players, Suarez was that good that average premier league players simply couldn't cope more often than not. He only had to be at 75% to rip lesser sides to bits.

Where as lesser players have to be at 100%.

When you have enough players who can play at 70% and win matches thats when you win leagues. You can't expect decent players to play at that level every week. Doesnt happen.

[Stu the Red]

No offence taken Stu, I think we would all love you to be wrong but it is what it is. Totally fine to call it as you see rather than sugar coat over it. We clearly have some problems and maybe last year did paper over cracks (mainly our defensive incapabilities) and losing a player of Suarez's ability would hurt any team but the drop in performance this season compared to last season has really staggered me.

Putting aside the results, the performances are completely unrecognisable from last year. I wouldn't be as bothered if we were playing good football but maybe not getting the results as you know eventually you will turn the corner but as it stands I'm really not seeing any improvement with each passing game which is seriously concerning.

I hate this reliance on one or two players. As a club, we should be able to cope with Sturridge out. Obviously we miss him, but it shouldn't be to a degree where we look toothless without him. Balotelli is quite clearly not suited to playing up top on his own and looking like a panic buy. I am going to say something which people will probably laugh at, but as it was late in the day in the transfer window, I would have taken Shane Long over Balotelli for maybe a season if there really was no other option. Why? He run's all day long and presses from the front, fits into the style of play Rodgers wants us to play

Personally I would rather we concentrated on signing quality and playing to their strengths rather than buying players to fit a style we're nowhere near capable of playing. Suarez lead from the front, he it made it possible, he's gone, everyone else will drop level as a result. Thats what happens when you lose someone that good.

[eds]

Well, well, well.

The chickens have certainly come home to roost now haven't they.

It was inevitable after such a poor summer of signings that we would find ourselves in this predicament.

I have been one of the few on here that began hitting the panic button when I saw the type of players Rodgers was bringing in, only to be ridiculed by the happy clap "give it time" "its too early to call" "in Rodgers we trust" brigade 

The same individuals who BTW haven't made a fkn peep over the last few days on this forum......

Disgusted is the way I feel after that shambolic performance against one of the worst sides in the premier league and now that I have had some sleep (yes I was up till 2am watching that rubbish) I can put things into perspective.

Rodgers days are numbered, I really can't see how we are going to get out of this. Last season we had Suarez and this season even though we have missed Sturridge for a large part there is only so much he can do right now to turn things around.

He has made expensive blunder after blunder which will ultimately as I called it end in tears.

First as many actually pointed out our defence has not been sorted out over the time he has been here. Mignolet is a complete and utter spud, the way he s**ts himself every time the ball is in the air from a cross is un-fu.cking-forgivable. Sell the donkey and bring in Begovic already.

Skrtel and Johnson are STILL playing at our club and should have been shown the door a while ago. Lovren has been scratchy and is certainly not a 20m defender. Sakho coming for 17m brings our massive CB spend on just 2 players to 37m!!! Think about that for a second. How the f**k have we not seen that just in this AREA that Rodgers and whoever his recruitment department are, are just not up to it?!?

Moreno has had way to many brain fades already and I actually don't think the lad is a defender. He would actually provide more playing out on the wings. Manquillo we can give time and Enrique the forgotten man needs to be brought back into the side as quickly as possible.

But in the middle is where our s**t is really, really messy. First Gerrard, he has played way too many games and just does not have the ability any more to do this. I think Rodgers is either scared of his presence and can't drop him or worse can't see that most of our problems stem from Gerrard's regression. You can't have a 3 man central midfield of Gerrard, Henderson / Allen or Gerrard, Lucas / Henderson or Gerrard, Henderson / Can. There just isn't enough drive or creativity there as we have seen TIME and TIME again this season. The only way to move forward is to drop Gerrard and play Can as a dedicated DM and see what he has to offer full time. In front I would alternate between Henderson and Allen and play either Coutinho / Lallana in a more forward role. We then need to bring in a quality and I mean WORLD CLASS midfielder to improve our starting XI. We should be looking at the likes of a Arturo Vidal, Paul Pogba, etc as we need to break the bank for someone to solidify our spine. Vidal would be perfect as we could still build a side around him for the next 4-5 years he has left in him.

On the flanks Sterling is really our only shining light while this Markovic character needs to see a psychiatrist as quickly as possible. I don't think he is mentally wanting to play for us because his few appearances so far have not even bordered on being dire but more in the realm of what the f**k are you doing kid? Rodgers needs to sort this out as quickly as possible so we can see whether he has a future with us or not. Still not convinced we have even seen him play yet as he doesn't even look a shadow of the player he was at Benfica.

Upfront we need to get rid of Borini as quickly as possible and bring another world class forward over January. Sturridge is too injury prone to rely on regularly and as many have already called it Balotelli needs someone up front to partner him. Although hopefully if fit and firing we have a decent attack with Sturridge and him in the side.

In order to save any grace this season Rodgers can't make any more mistakes and even as fans we know what he needs to do, he just needs to go out and do it now. If we still see Gerrard / Johnson play in every F**KING game from here till the end of the year. If we see Borini / Lucas get any more game time or we continue to see players like Lallana, Can and Markovic not introduced into the starting XI we will have every right to ask him to leave at the end of this season. But even then if he does all this it might not be enough as we just don't have the personnel at the moment........ 

[eds]

And another thing.

Where the f**k are all the lemmings that didn't think someone like Sanchez was not a "big loss" in acquiring over the summer gone???     

I can go back through the rumours thread and point to every single clueless comment made. Missing out on the lad AND him going to a major rival was absolutely detrimental to our progression.

Just goes to show you that some on here know f**k all when quality and I mean real QUALITY is right front of their f**king faces.........

[Stu the Red]

Some said the same about Fabregas, Barcelona are no mugs and they didn't want him...

I find it ridiculous to be quite honest. People were saying Henderson was as good as him...          

[eds]

Some said the same about Fabregas, Barcelona are no mugs and they didn't want him...

I find it ridiculous to be quite honest. People were saying Henderson was as good as him...          

If we had bought in just Fabregas and Sanchez in for 120m it would have made more financial sense then the astronomical amount we spent on our sub-average players 

And we would still have a better side than what we have now........

Fk me I would have even gone into my piggy bank to get Begovic and Song in on loans and we would have been sorted.

Fking Rodgers has completely sold us up the river, I'm fuming 

[The_Rock]

Yeah , think he's already said he'd like to manage in Spain. I wish him the very best of luck with that, an offer can't come soon enough   :kungfu:

Simply unbelievable right ? Whoring himself to the whole Spanish continent by speaking in Spanish....

Rodgers reminds me a lot of Mark Clattenburg. Seems to be making use of his current job to look out for better offers.

FSG has made a huge mistake in appointing a management/coaching team with so few experiences between them. A club like Liverpool needs experienced managers who  know continental and domestic football and handle playing in numerous competitions.

I really miss rafa. I know he is not doing that well at Napoli but imagine what he will do here with some much resources ....

[Dundreamin is back]

I also think him trading in his wife for a younger model then moving into Gerrard,s old home added with last season's punching above their weight Rodgers must think he's the dogs. Well Mr Rodgers you are NOT. I remember when he was appointed I was not happy about it but thought give him a chance. The Madrid game shown even the most optimistic red that we are light years behind them and if a big one at that we qualify for the knockout rounds of the CL I will not be surprised if we are embarrassed by a absolute tonking over two legs. Also as well of the manager the players want to stop giving press interviews saying were going to do this and that. And do it on the pitch because from where I am watching we are becoming the laughing stock of the prem just like we become under Hicks and Gillet fiasco. Also I am wondering what FSG are making of all this as there silence is deafening

[The_Rock]

To answer Threadstarter's question, if I were Rodgers, I would

1)Remove Gerrard from the DM position

2)Put lucas or Can in that DM position

3)Play the diamond formation. The thing is we don't have wingers who score loads of goals to play the 4-3-2-1 formation that Rodgers currently employs. Coutinho prefers to play in central midfield and Sterling is an revelation as a shadow Striker. They both don't contribute as much on the wings. We can revisit this formation once Markovic comes of age.

4)Since playing the diamond formation makes us vunerable with attacks from the flanks I will make sure that the fullbacks don't bomb forward too much. This was the reason why we conceded so many goals last season when playing this formation. The Fullbacks bomb forward so far ahead and when they lose the ball (especially when one trick pony Johnson cuts on his left and shots at the defender), we are prone to opposition players running unopposed at our defence. The midfield I am picking is good enough to create chances on their own. So the fullbacks to be a little more conservative.

5)Ensure I am in pally terms with Sakho. He is potentially the best defender we have. I can forsee Lovern and him having a great partnership. So instead of brown-nosing Skrtel..... I would rather look to the future. We spent close to 40M on these players. Why don't we just play them together. Sakho looks really brilliant for france.

6)Get better coaches in the team. You look at the set-up. Pascoe and Marsh just look utterly average. They look like someone Hodgson picks on his coaching team (And Hodgson seems to have better coaches in the England set-up). Rene Muelensteen is jobless now. But he is a good coach with European pedigree. He is known for training the strikers when f@ck-faced-fergie was the manager of manure. Get him on board. He could do wonders with balotelli. Get a defensive coach (from Europe) too. Fergie saw fit to bring in good assistants whenever he had the chance. His Assistants were the main reason why he was so successful. Now compare that with "Domestic-coach" Rodgers.

The team I will pick

                                                 GK
             (Manquillo/Flanagan)    Lovern   Sakho   (Moreno/Enrique)
                                                (Lucas/Can)
                                           Henderson     Lallana
                                                    Coutinho
                                       ( Balotelli/Sterling)  Sturridge

Isn't this team better than the utter cr@p that Rodgers is picking now ? We play 2 up top and make the fullbacks more conservative and it brings balance all over the team. Henderson Lallana and Countinho and good enough to create chances for our front 2.

I was not particularly happy with our summer signings. But I am still convinced any competent manager could have achieved more with this team than what Rodgers is doing. I am not saying Rodgers is in-competent...but he has to stop building the team around gerrard. It is screwing up the dynamics of the team.

He still has time to turn it around. Just swallow his pride and stop building the team around gerrard. Play Ballotelli up front with lambert or Borini.

After I have done the above...tender resignation. I don't think Rodgers has it in himself to coach a big team with ambitions. He has a cr@p squad management. He does not rotate the players well. He rather fall out with players then to manage them (Lucas, Sakho, Agger....etc). He almost sounds like a youth team coach when he speaks. Its either black or white for him. In actual management (and in life in general), there is lots of grey.

So whom do we go for ?
For me....Diego Simeone,  Jurgen Kloop. We need managers with continental experience if we are going to challenge on all fronts. FSG still can go with their moneyball transfer policy. But they need experience when it comes to the management of the team. Even Southampton has a manger who has experience all over Europe and it is paying them dividends now.

[Stu the Red]

Tactically Diamonds are a joke. They work once in a blue moon and quite simply lack width and options for the full backs. Not to mention allowing midfields to completely overrun your own by pulling midfielders wide then going back centrally...

To say Sahko is "potentially the best defender we have" is based on what? Him being big? He lacks in far to many key areas.

Maybe with a decent shape to the defensive unit he could do a job but at the minute he looks a fish out of water and seems to lack game intelligence.

As for the likes of playing Can and Markovic etc... thats a sure fire way at the minute for us to go backwards.

[Dundreamin is back]

Question is who would want to manage us because since Houllier came in the managerial position seems always to end in tears. It's a poisoned chalice

[Boocity]

If from what has been said on other threads that the senior players (SG & carra) have too much sway then its time to leave. Carra has gone and maybe its time for BR to tell SG its his last season. Okay we had a thin squad but we don't need any more squad fillers we need a couple of quality players in Jan. BR also needs to stop believing his own hype, I am honestly starting to believe he thinks he is untouchable after last season and can get away with whatever. Unfortunately he may be able to keep FSG onside but if he continues down this route and loses the fans then FSG would be forced to act.

[RedAnt]

BR is still relatively young and inexperienced. He wasn't a great manager at Swansea. He did well and we offered him a promotion. That didn't mean he'd automatically be a success. It simply have him a chance to prove himself at a higher level. He's found out now. He's doing and saying everything wrong, and where most young managers would still be learning on the job, Rodgers mentality, coupled with a good (but other than CL qualification, unsuccessful) season he's started to believe in himself too much. If you stop learning, you stop growing.

His arrogance will be his downfall. Even with the world falling down around him he's too stubborn to do the obvious.

[RedAnt]

By the way.. I don't think getting rid of SG is the answer. Would rather remove BR and employ someone who will use his players correctly.