Liverpool FC Forum

by **metalhead** » Fri Sep 26, 2008 3:30 pm

JamCar05 wrote:
metalhead wrote:
Jimmy the Weasel wrote:All well and good, but one reason for Anderson starting regularly could simply be him being a better player, could it not?

Totally agree, Anderson is better than Lucas, different class.

Perhaps he is different class (though his shooting is absolutely abysmal it has to be said), but that's also clearly reflected in the prizes which we and the mancs paid for the two players respectively. Whilst Lucas cost something like 6 million, didn't they pay around 18 million for Anderson? In that case you would expect him to be somewhat better, wouldn't you?

True, can't disagree with you here.

by **burjennio** » Fri Sep 26, 2008 3:34 pm

Jimmy the Weasel
You must hate yourself.

I have no axe to grind with you, I've been here a matter of days but you issued a needless threat to boot me off this board. Quite how I have no idea given that you don't moderate it, but hey ho.

If you prefer everyone to blindly praise players who do not always warrant it, then feel free to carry on but I'm not prepared to talk that I don't believe just to keep some angry stranger content on a messageboard.

Don't like that then it's tough unfortunately. I'll just keep on posting here til somebody who actually runs the place tells me I've stepped out of line. Til then get over yourself (or at least make me look foolish as you promised you would do!! )

Everyone else seems happy to debate, my points, it's only you with the chip on your shoulder because I disagree with you

I said if you kept throwing insults at people you would be thrown off, i never said I had the power

and low and behold, 4 insults thrown at me in this post alone.

FWIW I dont think any1 should be removed from a msg board unless they get mental and start preeching neo-facism ( what was that guys name again?)

The only point ive ever made is that you do nothing but criticize certain players yet preech inaccurate biased stats and facts to get your views across, even when people have clearly pointed out that your claims have no foundation whatsoever (Dirk Kuyt cant shoot/dribble/pass etc). This is in no way an insult, its a fact soley based on what you have written on here. Yet you have called me an idiot, clown, accused me of hating myself, of apparantly trying to moderate the forum, twisted about 6 different statements I have made to somehow compliment your own views even though you totally ignore logic in doing so, stated that I have been insulting you when I have done no such thing and make belittling, patronising comments to me as if I am a child. Yet its the happy clappers who are the ones giving out all the abuse.

If you or anyone else on this forum disagrees with anything in that statement, please feel free to say in what way, or simply go back and read the posts both here and in the Dirk Kuyt thread.

I used to come on here to talk football and have a laugh. Now I get abused for trying to back up players on my own team. ITS A FECKING JOKE

by **Jimmy the Weasel** » Fri Sep 26, 2008 3:55 pm

burjennio wrote:
Jimmy the Weasel
You must hate yourself.

I have no axe to grind with you, I've been here a matter of days but you issued a needless threat to boot me off this board. Quite how I have no idea given that you don't moderate it, but hey ho.

If you prefer everyone to blindly praise players who do not always warrant it, then feel free to carry on but I'm not prepared to talk that I don't believe just to keep some angry stranger content on a messageboard.

Don't like that then it's tough unfortunately. I'll just keep on posting here til somebody who actually runs the place tells me I've stepped out of line. Til then get over yourself (or at least make me look foolish as you promised you would do!! )

Everyone else seems happy to debate, my points, it's only you with the chip on your shoulder because I disagree with you

I said if you kept throwing insults at people you would be thrown off, i never said I had the power

and low and behold, 4 insults thrown at me in this post alone.

FWIW I dont think any1 should be removed from a msg board unless they get mental and start preeching neo-facism ( what was that guys name again?)

The only point ive ever made is that you do nothing but criticize certain players yet preech inaccurate biased stats and facts to get your views across, even when people have clearly pointed out that your claims have no foundation whatsoever (Dirk Kuyt cant shoot/dribble/pass etc). This is in no way an insult, its a fact soley based on what you have written on here. Yet you have called me an idiot, clown, accused me of hating myself, of apparantly trying to moderate the forum, twisted about 6 different statements I have made to somehow compliment your own views even though you totally ignore logic in doing so, stated that I have been insulting you when I have done no such thing and make belittling, patronising comments to me as if I am a child. Yet its the happy clappers who are the ones giving out all the abuse.

If you or anyone else on this forum disagrees with anything in that statement, please feel free to say in what way, or simply go back and read the posts both here and in the Dirk Kuyt thread.

I used to come on here to talk football and have a laugh. Now I get abused for trying to back up players on my own team. ITS A FECKING JOKE

Nah mate, you get abused for being a touch oversensitive and laying into people who disagree with you like a sulky child.

I disagreed with you, so from the off you come out with the following beauties:

"WUM"

"go back to supporting whoever it was you follwed pre May 2005"

"self opinionated 5hitstirrer"

"Keep it civil or :censored:

off" - the definition of hypocrisy in 6 words, well done.

Then you rattled of your supporter's CV, which essentially means the square root of nothing when you then go on to claim that Kuyt dribbles past players all the time. That's why you struggle, because my reasoning is backed up by what I see, not tinted red by the fact he's a Liverpool player, and because I don't think that "because he'd a Liverpool player" is a reason that he's suddenly bulletproof.

If I choose to criticise, I explain exactly why. A lot of people on here seem to agree quite strongly with my views. There are also some who don't and will debate it.

You don't seem to be able to do either, you just whinge and moan. I'll go with the majority of people who have responded to my posts who seem to think I make reasonable points and just carry on, thanks all the same.

You just can't hack somebody disagreeing with you. Diddums.

by **burjennio** » Fri Sep 26, 2008 6:32 pm

Jimmy the Weasel
Nah mate, you get abused for being a touch oversensitive and laying into people who disagree with you like a sulky child.

I disagreed with you, so from the off you come out with the following beauties:

"WUM"

"go back to supporting whoever it was you follwed pre May 2005"

"self opinionated 5hitstirrer"

"Keep it civil or off" - the definition of hypocrisy in 6 words, well done.

Then you rattled of your supporter's CV, which essentially means the square root of nothing when you then go on to claim that Kuyt dribbles past players all the time. That's why you struggle, because my reasoning is backed up by what I see, not tinted red by the fact he's a Liverpool player, and because I don't think that "because he'd a Liverpool player" is a reason that he's suddenly bulletproof.

If I choose to criticise, I explain exactly why. A lot of people on here seem to agree quite strongly with my views. There are also some who don't and will debate it.

You don't seem to be able to do either, you just whinge and moan. I'll go with the majority of people who have responded to my posts who seem to think I make reasonable points and just carry on, thanks all the same.

You just can't hack somebody disagreeing with you. Diddums.

be civil or f##k off is a play on "play nice or f##k off"
the majority of people do not agree with you and I have tried to keep our dialogue about football - you are the one that keeps throwing the insults out! Also you have not come close to explaining any of your criticism, just regurgatated the same washed out OPINIONS which other kuyt haters are quick to bandwagon with you on. statistic after statistic has been wheeled out to prove Kuyts worth to the team but you choose to either ignore them completely or twist them around and compare them with certain other players that have no bearing on the argument in point or are completely unfair. Then if that doesnt work you simply change what the statistics actually mean (ie. an "assist" is a pass that leads directly to a goal, not a tackle on the goalline)
You will then try to invalidate the people putting these facts to you such as GYBS and myself by claiming we are wearing "red tinted glasses" when anyone can simply look at a league or champions league table and see we are 1 point off the pace and undefeated, and we havn't even kicked into top gear yet, and Kuyt has been a major contributor on both fronts, Lucus has only had 2 games and is coming in for dogs abuse from you too. You then say that I do not back up my arguments, when I continually point out in great detail Kuyts benefits to the side and his strengths as a footballer and have names more examples than I can count, the matches where he has made a difference and rose to the occasion even when some of our more established stars have failed to do so.

Dirk Kuyt is a good, hardworking footballer, who scores some important goals for LFC. Thats all I and others have been trying to say. His 1st touch can let him down, he sometimes gives the ball away and misses chances that he probably should score.

But what player doesnt?

Jimmy the Weasel you have as much right to your opinion as anyone on here, but I will defend to the death the players that I pay my money to Watch, and who give me so much joy in return. I apologize for the Istanbul fan remark, as it is a cheap shot, and TBPH this back and forth is taking up far to much of my day

so i offer you the olive branch

and leave you with this link, as its still awesome Link

by **Fo Dne** » Fri Sep 26, 2008 11:16 pm

Jimmy the Weasel wrote:As for getting more games, Lucas has 19, Anderson 25 apparently.

Do those 6 games really make all the difference?

Yes, a massive difference. In those six games Anderson gained a massive advantage because he learned to pass, control a ball, tackle, run and do other things that footballers can do.

Lucas is only 45? Give him another ninety years and he might one day be able to control a bag of cement and pass a ball.

by **aCe'** » Sat Sep 27, 2008 1:02 am

OH COME ONNNNN !

that was funny and cant say anyone didnt see it coming... i mean seriously... with a post like that ud expect an insult or two...

congrats on ur card FO DNE... couldnt have put it better myself

by **Bad Bob** » Sat Sep 27, 2008 3:29 am

aCe' wrote:with a post like that ud expect an insult or two...

Here's the problem with this place at the moment in a nutshell...far too many self-appointed know-it-alls deciding that it's alright to dish out insults when they see something they disagree with. Of course, when someone else does it to them, it's deemed to be unwarranted abuse and they turn all self-righteous about it. The hypocrisy of it all would be laughable if it wasn't so pathetic.

So, once again let me spell this out for everyone who's not yet managed to take the message on board: insults should not to be "expected" around here nor should they be applauded. If you disagree with a point, say why without making it personal. If you can't do that then maybe you shouldn't be posting because you're offering the square root of feck all to the conversation and helping to drag this place further and further away from decent footy chat. Sort it out or get your coat. :veryangry

by **maypaxvobiscum** » Sat Sep 27, 2008 3:56 am

BadBob you could do without the smiley. it makes me go ''so cute'' :laugh:

*just pulling your leg

by **Jimmy the Weasel** » Sat Sep 27, 2008 9:18 am

burjennio wrote:be civil or f##k off is a play on "play nice or f##k off"
the majority of people do not agree with you and I have tried to keep our dialogue about football - you are the one that keeps throwing the insults out! Also you have not come close to explaining any of your criticism, just regurgatated the same washed out OPINIONS which other kuyt haters are quick to bandwagon with you on. statistic after statistic has been wheeled out to prove Kuyts worth to the team but you choose to either ignore them completely or twist them around and compare them with certain other players that have no bearing on the argument in point or are completely unfair. Then if that doesnt work you simply change what the statistics actually mean (ie. an "assist" is a pass that leads directly to a goal, not a tackle on the goalline)
You will then try to invalidate the people putting these facts to you such as GYBS and myself by claiming we are wearing "red tinted glasses" when anyone can simply look at a league or champions league table and see we are 1 point off the pace and undefeated, and we havn't even kicked into top gear yet, and Kuyt has been a major contributor on both fronts, Lucus has only had 2 games and is coming in for dogs abuse from you too. You then say that I do not back up my arguments, when I continually point out in great detail Kuyts benefits to the side and his strengths as a footballer and have names more examples than I can count, the matches where he has made a difference and rose to the occasion even when some of our more established stars have failed to do so.

Dirk Kuyt is a good, hardworking footballer, who scores some important goals for LFC. Thats all I and others have been trying to say. His 1st touch can let him down, he sometimes gives the ball away and misses chances that he probably should score.

But what player doesnt?

Jimmy the Weasel you have as much right to your opinion as anyone on here, but I will defend to the death the players that I pay my money to Watch, and who give me so much joy in return. I apologize for the Istanbul fan remark, as it is a cheap shot, and TBPH this back and forth is taking up far to much of my day so i offer you the olive branch

and leave you with this link, as its still awesome Link

This is ridiculous - if you actually read what I posted rather than your own version of it, coloured by the fact I'm disagreeing with you, you'd see that I don't actually say any of those things.

I never claimed the majority of people agree - I said "A lot of people on here seem to agree quite strongly with my views. There are also some who don't and will debate it". See?

And similarly you just dismiss me and them as bandwagon jumpers. Convenient.

I make judgements based on my opinions, we all do - what's your point? Your "facts" such as "Kuyt dribbles past players all the time" are actually fiction - anyone who watches the game can see that he lacks the guile and craft to dribble round players.

Lucas played last season as well, so no, not just 2 games, but again you stick to your "facts" eh? I gave my reasons for that opinion, you cannot claim I haven't unless you're just ignoring what I actually say again, the only reason I can think of.

An assist is technically the last pass before the goal is scored. All I said that doesn't always constitute "creating" the chance, and it clearly doesn't. I also never brought the word 'assist' in to that discussion, you seized on it. I was talking about what "creating the chance" actually meant, which is different sometimes - it's the incision on the opposition defence that creates the chance - so Mascherano created the winner against Man Utd by taking on their back line and getting the ball round the back - Kuyt got the assist. But again, you just ignore my point because it's not overstating the credit Kuyt gets.

Feel free to defend players in the face of any criticism, but don't expect any credibility when you do it in the face of what is plain for to see for anyone who spends any time watching the game - Kuyt is hard-working, committed, loves the club and seems like a thoroughly decent fella. He's a very limited footballer, that's bottom line, and if you argue othewise then I'm sorry but it's your opinion as well, and I disagree vehemently with it.

GYBS seems quite happy to debate with me, so as I've said, it's only you chipping away all the time. Don't feel any obligation to reply by the way, I wouldn't feel I'm missing out, you're obviously an incredibly busy man.

Olive branch accepted, good link.

by **burjennio** » Sat Sep 27, 2008 10:11 am

This is ridiculous - if you actually read what I posted rather than your own version of it, coloured by the fact I'm disagreeing with you, you'd see that I don't actually say any of those things.

I never claimed the majority of people agree - I said "A lot of people on here seem to agree quite strongly with my views. There are also some who don't and will debate it". See?

And similarly you just dismiss me and them as bandwagon jumpers. Convenient.

I make judgements based on my opinions, we all do - what's your point? Your "facts" such as "Kuyt dribbles past players all the time" are actually fiction - anyone who watches the game can see that he lacks the guile and craft to dribble round players.

Lucas played last season as well, so no, not just 2 games, but again you stick to your "facts" eh? I gave my reasons for that opinion, you cannot claim I haven't unless you're just ignoring what I actually say again, the only reason I can think of.

An assist is technically the last pass before the goal is scored. All I said that doesn't always constitute "creating" the chance, and it clearly doesn't. I also never brought the word 'assist' in to that discussion, you seized on it. I was talking about what "creating the chance" actually meant, which is different sometimes - it's the incision on the opposition defence that creates the chance - so Mascherano created the winner against Man Utd by taking on their back line and getting the ball round the back - Kuyt got the assist. But again, you just ignore my point because it's not overstating the credit Kuyt gets.

Feel free to defend players in the face of any criticism, but don't expect any credibility when you do it in the face of what is plain for to see for anyone who spends any time watching the game - Kuyt is hard-working, committed, loves the club and seems like a thoroughly decent fella. He's a very limited footballer, that's bottom line, and if you argue othewise then I'm sorry but it's your opinion as well, and I disagree vehemently with it.

GYBS seems quite happy to debate with me, so as I've said, it's only you chipping away all the time. Don't feel any obligation to reply by the way, I wouldn't feel I'm missing out, you're obviously an incredibly busy man.

Olive branch accepted, good link.

At least you didnt call me a f###ing w#nker

by **stmichael** » Thu Oct 30, 2008 12:26 pm

Did a solid job once again last night without being spectacular.

I'd compare him (Lucas) to Fletcher at present. Not his playing style etc etc but that while he won't dominate/stand out in game like Xabi, Mascherano and Gerrard will do, he'll go quietly about his business and do a decent job for the team. Considering his past accolades I'd hope in time he will improve and grow in stature, at present though he remains a very capable 4th choice central midfielder. I'd expect him to drop out at the weekend and then return for the Carling Cup game at Spurs.

by **Leonmc0708** » Thu Oct 30, 2008 12:48 pm

Best game in a red shirt yet yesterday.

tidy, simple, hard working.

Long may it continue.

by **Bam** » Thu Oct 30, 2008 12:51 pm

Leonmc0708 wrote:Best game in a red shirt yet yesterday.

tidy, simple, hard working.

Long may it continue.

by **tubby** » Thu Oct 30, 2008 12:57 pm

Leonmc0708 wrote:
Ace Ventura wrote:
burjennio wrote:does anyone ever think that maybe the guy needs a run of games? Would I be right in sayin that some of you lot think every is 5hite except for Torres, Gerrard and Carragher?

Think some might think we also have one of the best keepers about, and might have a bit of a soft spot towards Mascherano.

Becuase players who are clearly proving every game they are not upto it, doesnt mean that everyone thinks all players other than the obvious top ones are sh!te.

Certain players (or there continued selection in the team) are holding this team back.
Imagine Lucas getting into United or Chelseas starting line up.......no you cant, it wouldnt happen.
Same with Kuyt, he wouldnt be near it.
Its hampering the team.

I give you:

Fletcher
Kalou
Malouda
Silvestre
PArk
O'Shea

ALL average PRemier LEague players, all League title winners.

We are not Real MAdrid.

Also all international 1st teamers. Is Lukas a 1st team starter for Brazil?

by **GYBS** » Thu Oct 30, 2008 1:16 pm

Lucas is in the brazilian squad these days and has started a few games

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