Liverpool FC Forum

by **66-1112520797** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 8:15 am

I just wonder every now and again when Stevie G misses a game due to injury or suspension. How much Xabi steps up and puts his authority on a game when Stevie isnt playing.

I'm not saying this happens week in week out with Alonso, but last year the Juventus game stood out for me in Turin when Stevie was supended/injured and Alonso came back from injury and had an absolute cracking game. He was everywhere that night and he got stuck into the tackles his tracking back was exceptional and he led by example basicly, and of course his passing was superb too.
Again when Stevie got sent off the other week against Everton it seemed as if the pressure had been taken off Alonso's shoulders and he could put his own authority on a game and produce yet another Mom display.
Also against West Brom to he apparently had another really good game, and Xabi has also helped put to bed the mumurs that we are a one man team because so often he becomes the catalyst in Stevie 's absents and proves to be an essential member of the team.

It's probably wrong to say the pressure seems to be off Alonso's shoulders when Stevie isnt playing. But how about the responsibility becomes more of an onus on him to step up in the absents of the captin.

Is it a psychological thing, that when Stevie plays Alonso feels more reluctant or even intimidated to put on such commanding displays ?

I could be reading it all wrong I dont know, I dont get to see many games so maybe a few of you could tell me what you think.

But in a nutshell do you think Xabi Alonso plays better when Stevie's not in the team, and if so why ?

by **Ace Ventura** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 9:05 am

Thats a decent point mate, Alonso does seem to step up and take more of a responsibility on the pitch.
The games you mentioned he was MOM in all of them, so it probably isn't a coincidence.
Its great to see that we have other players that can be leaders when the skipper is not playing.
I'd rather they were playing together, as would everyone probably, but its a testament to Xabi that we dont miss Stevie as much as the press would have everyone believe when he is not playing.

by **Ola Mr Benitez** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 9:18 am

I am as glad as anyone that Stevie pledged his future to Liverpool, but if you look at last seasons stats we actually performed better when he wasn't playing. This is mainly due to the Xabi effect.

Now I'm not saying we are a better team without him, as for me he is the best midfield player in the world right now. I think some of his performances last year where definately effected with the whole Chelsea thing hanging over him. But what I am saying is with a player like Alonso in our midfield, it fills me with confidence that if for any reason Steven Gerrard in unavailable our squad is strong enough to cope.

The next step in our progression could be getting Xabi and Stevie to play better together, with neither player being the dominent force in our midfield, but becoming the dominent pairing in world football...

Why not..

by **anti-hero** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 9:46 am

In response to Bamaga man's question

"in a nutshell do you think Xabi Alonso plays better when Stevie's not in the team, and if so why?"

Yeah.

Cause when we play we often play through Gerrard.

Alonso's usually secondary.

But when we play through Alonso he has more freedom to do what he wants with the ball.

Now I see the point of Momo Sissoko coming to Anfield.

Because a passer of his calibre cant work his magic if there is noone to win the ball.

by **Hotrod** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 9:59 am

Gerrard like any good captain wants to do everything make the final pass,score the goals and put the crosses in. If you were Xabi you would feel a bit intimated by him(or thats wat i think) so maybe he is not iclined to play his natural game the way he wants to and he has benefited from havin Momo aloung side him

by **stoney** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 10:09 am

It's simple really, when Gerrards plays, Xabi has to play the holding role sitting back and allowing Gerrard to go up and attack as we would get caught out a lot if both Gerrard and Xabi had the freedom. When Gerrard doesn't play, Xabi takes on the role of the central midfielder responsbile or supporting and creating for the striker while Sissoko then takes up Xabis old role of sitting and protecting the defence.

by **48-1119859832** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 10:18 am

Stoney,

I agree entirely with what you said and we all saw what happened in Istanbul when Xabi & Steven had the freedom in midfield, it allowed Pirlo and Kaka to freely win the midfield battle and give the ball in the final third to Shevchenko & Crespo. Then we bought Hamann The Great on and it was a different matter entirely.

That's probably why someone like Sissoko was bought into to allow Xabi to be more creative but also protect the back four and close the giant gap that would be left if both Xabi & Gerrard decided to go up top.

That's why I don't think a 4-4-2 with just Gerrard & Alonso in the centre of the park would work too well, to me it would be more a disadvantage than an advantage.

Either way we have 2 of Europe's best midfield players in our team, therefore we can't grumble.

by **GLB1** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 10:20 am

I agree. In the near future we will look back on the signing of Sissoko as being a key point of our development. He does the dirty work allowing Alonso to perform his theatre. Potential Potential Potential

Is it also no coincidence that the best football we played all year was when Gerrard was out on the right thus clearing the midfield for Xabi to have space and time on the ball. Im not saying we should camp gerrard on the right but I would like to see him pushed further up the field providing a target for Xabi. He would also drag players away from Xabi giving him more space and with his range and assortment of passes anything is likely to happen. His pass to Cissy... GOLD !!!!

Xabi and Sissoko really are examples of what the Rafalution is all about.. 16 mill for potentially one of the most effective midfield parings in the World. ANd thats for both... Chelski... how much for Essien the Leg Chopper?? I know what deal I would rather have !!

by **HacksawJimDuggin** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 11:25 am

There is no doubt that Xabi is a far better player when Gerrard doesn't play in the middle beside him. Even when Gerrard plays on the right Xabi doesn't have the same impact as Gerrard wanders all over the park.

I was delighted when Gerrard pledged his future to LFC as he is the talisman for the club. My only concern is that Xabi may not be happy playing 2nd fiddle to Gerrard and may seek a move to a club where HE can be the main man in the midfield. Can't see it happening but it does nag away at me from time to time. Xabi is a world class player and, if we are to continue the progression we are showing, we must keep him.

Excellent comment on Sissoko. He WILL turn out to be a gem of a signing. He is fantastic in the engine room and lets our flair players get on with there jobs secure in the knowledge that he is battling away in the middle of the park.

by **Sabre** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 12:28 pm

I was delighted when Gerrard pledged his future to LFC as he is the talisman for the club. My only concern is that Xabi may not be happy playing 2nd fiddle to Gerrard and may seek a move to a club where HE can be the main man in the midfield. Can't see it happening but it does nag away at me from time to time. Xabi is a world class player and, if we are to continue the progression we are showing, we must keep him.

He already was in one, Real Sociedad. He almost won the liga, yet he preffered to go to Liverpool. That doesn't concern me really. It's good we have both Gerrard and Alonso. It's Rafa's work to gel them together, and if Gerrard (for instance) is insisting too much with long shots in a game, shout a bit, and fix things. Both players are perfectly compatible.

by **harry_smiles** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 1:17 pm

I think one of the main problems is that when gerrard plays the rest of the team look for him and play the ball to him, almost too much IMO, i think xabi takes that role when gerrard is not there, they play the ball to him, and i think he plays much better pass. If they could get people passing more to xabi when gerrard is on the pitch and letting him be the hub i think it would work much better all round.

by **JC_81** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 1:18 pm

First of all, the point someone made about Alonso having to play the holding role when Gerrard plays but plays further forward when Sissoko plays is simply not true. Sissoko is NOT a holding midfielder, he is a ball-winner but he charges all over the pitch doing this, that is very different from a holding midfielder who sits in front of the back 4 (someone like Hamann).

It's amazing the amount of team formations you see typed out in this forum with Sissoko in front of the back 4 and the other midfielders playing in front of him - watch the way Momo plays in his next game and see that he doesn't do this, where did this myth come from? No matter whether it's Gerrard or Sissoko in the centre with Xabi, he is the deepest-lying midfielder.

As for whether Alonso plays better without Gerrard in the team, I don't think that's entirely true. But if you'd said does Alonso play better when Gerrard's not in the middle with him I'd say yes. It's no coincidence our recent bad run against Arsenal, Benfica etc came when Momo was out and Alonso and Gerrard were in the middle together - both looked really out of sorts. They are good enough players to gel, but it showed that they hadn't been used to playing in the middle together all season.

Depending on the progress of Sissoko, it could be that our midfield is better balanced with him and Xabi in the centre and Gerrard starting wider on the right.

by **stmichael** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 1:26 pm

Good thread.

I'm happy that Gerrard hasn't been a factor for us in the last two matches. I've been thinking for some time that the team as a whole (and not just a few of them) have been taking their responsibilities much more seriously and are not as reliant on Stevie to inspire them. In the past, games such as Everton and West Brom without Gerrard would fill most fans with dread but now we're winning the majority of games we "should win" with a majority of ease.

People, including myself, have been banging on about the need to get a right sided midfielder, a centre back and a new strike force since last summer. However, the most important thing was to get all of our players to take the finger out of their hoop and play their part in every game, to stand up and be counted, when they were picked. Rafa was right, once again.

As said before, if Xabi is our quarterback then Momo must be considered our enforcer. To me, Alonso is only most effective when you have a defensive midfielder like Sissoko who will win back every ball that we lose it. That frees up Alonso for his creative work. And it may be conincidental, we were playing very well until Sissoko got that injury and all of sudden we slump into draws and defeat. He comes back at Birmingham and we win 7-0.

by **Bad Bob** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 6:32 pm

john craig wrote:First of all, the point someone made about Alonso having to play the holding role when Gerrard plays but plays further forward when Sissoko plays is simply not true. Sissoko is NOT a holding midfielder, he is a ball-winner but he charges all over the pitch doing this, that is very different from a holding midfielder who sits in front of the back 4 (someone like Hamann).

It's amazing the amount of team formations you see typed out in this forum with Sissoko in front of the back 4 and the other midfielders playing in front of him - watch the way Momo plays in his next game and see that he doesn't do this, where did this myth come from? No matter whether it's Gerrard or Sissoko in the centre with Xabi, he is the deepest-lying midfielder.

As for whether Alonso plays better without Gerrard in the team, I don't think that's entirely true. But if you'd said does Alonso play better when Gerrard's not in the middle with him I'd say yes. It's no coincidence our recent bad run against Arsenal, Benfica etc came when Momo was out and Alonso and Gerrard were in the middle together - both looked really out of sorts. They are good enough players to gel, but it showed that they hadn't been used to playing in the middle together all season.

Depending on the progress of Sissoko, it could be that our midfield is better balanced with him and Xabi in the centre and Gerrard starting wider on the right.

I definitely agree.

For me, Xabi and Sissoko have developed a wonderful symbiosis: Sissoko bombs about midfield disrupting the opposition's play and winning the ball; Xabi lurks nearby, ready to start the move once Momo's won the ball back. Watch the next match and see how close Xabi gets to Momo when he's going in for a challenge.

You're right that Xabi is the one to sit deep, though, as he is also the chief outlet for passes out of defense. You always seem him circling back to collect the ball from Sami, Jamie or one of the fullbacks at the start of a move.

As for his play with Stevie, I think it has been a lot more fluid this year than last but I agree that they seem to trip over each other a bit if they're both playing in the centre of the park. Perhaps this has something to do with Stevie's mentality when he wins a ball back--looking to carry it upfield himself rather than playing the quick outlet to Xabi like Momo often does.

For me, Stevie and Xabi are awesome together IF Stevie is out on the right or given a free role "in the hole" just behind the forward(s). Should we manage to sign a first-team right sider this summer, we should look to push Stevie farther forward to get him out of Momo and Xabi's way in the engine room. Can you imagine him getting on the end of some of those Alonso laser's from deep?

One other area of competition between Stevie and Xabi that hasn't been brought up in this thread deserves mention: dead ball situations. As we saw against Everton, Xabi took most of the free kicks/corners after Stevie was off and did a fantastic job. As others have mentioned in past threads, Stevie is probably more of a threat getting on the end of free kicks/corners then he is taking them and Xabi's delivery is top drawer (after he gets his inevitable 'over-hit' kick out of the way!

). Rafa might look to have a word with Stevie about this, since it may be down to his insistence on taking everything on himself.

by **Sabre** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 7:11 pm

Good post Bad Bob, yet, I wouldn't forget the evolution I'm seeing in Xabi's defensive play. Yes he lurks around Sissoko and takes advantage of Sissoko's work, but I also think Xabi's positioning and tackling has improved a lot in this Anfield experience.

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