Liverpool vs Stoke 17th Aug 12:45 ( BT Sports )

Liverpool Football Club - Games

Postby Benny The Noon » Sun Aug 11, 2013 7:58 am

It's time for the serious stuff - Stoke is one team that will really test us in the first game of the season. It's going to be very physical so we should be prepared for a bruising battle. Line up will be key - my choice would be

Mignolet

Johnson
Toure ( would have preffered Skrtel but hasn't played enough)
Agger
Enrique

Lucas
Gerrard
Henderson

Downing
Sturridge ( it's a risk but think we need to take it )
Coutinho

Believe that team would give us a good chance of getting three points
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Postby ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Sun Aug 11, 2013 10:42 am

i`m not a fan of pushing coutinho out to the wing, he`s by far our most creative player and i`d actually build the team around him as opposed to moving him out wide just to shoehorn an extra midfielder in there. coutinho needs to be playing behind sturridge so he can thread balls through for danny to run on to. if brendan wants an extra pair of legs in there then throw hendo in out wide, like this -

                                                          mingolet

                   johnson                 toure              agger                 enrique

                                                lucas              gerrard

                                                        coutinho

                                     aspas          sturridge       hendo

if lucas and gerrard were more mobile i`d be tempted to throw ibe in for hendo, but we saw a few times yesterday against basically celtics reserves that lucas and gerrard were brushed aside by players who put their head down and ran hard through the center of our midfield, that happened quite a bit last season too.
so i`d put hendo in out wide, he wont be as effective as say ibe, downing or sterling but he will support the attack and get back and help out gerrard and lucas in the middle, imo hendo must be one of the fittest and most athletic players in the division.
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Postby Benny The Noon » Sun Aug 11, 2013 11:09 am

It was clear that Henderson isn't suited to that wide berth when playing in his first season and last season he flourished through the middle.

You say that players brushed through the middle so why would you move Henderson out and leave Lucas and Gerrard exposed ?

Playing Coutinho in the middle does exactly that - I can remember which game it was but with Coutinho in the middle last year behind a front three left us outnumbered in the middle. Coutinho may sort of play the wide role but he roams a lot around the pitch. Coutinho certainly is being pushed out wide to shoehorn because that's where he has played most of his career and where he was most effective. Henderson certainly wasnt anywhere near as effective out wide. The best results and performances we had last year where based on Coutinho out wide and Henderson through the middle. Not sure why you would want to swap them around Yakka ?
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Postby LFC1990 » Sun Aug 11, 2013 11:18 am

I'd Personally go for

                           Mignolet
Johnson        Toure         Agger         Enrique


                Gerrard                      Lucas


                           Coutinho
Aspas                                             Hendo
                           Sturridge
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Postby Benny The Noon » Sun Aug 11, 2013 11:30 am

Why would you shove Henderson out wide ?
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Postby LFC1990 » Sun Aug 11, 2013 11:53 am

I think he played quite well last year in the position. Noteably Arsenal. He doesnt have to stick there a bit of switching with Coutinho.
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Postby Benny The Noon » Sun Aug 11, 2013 11:58 am

LFC1990 » Sun Aug 11, 2013 11:53 am wrote:I think he played quite well last year in the position. Noteably Arsenal. He doesnt have to stick there a bit of switching with Coutinho.


I think if we look at the way they both drop float they certainly don't take up fixed positions but Coutinho certainly seems more effective when he does cut inside from that wide area. Just need to ensure we don't get outnumbered in the middle - that's why I would keep Henderson through the middle - his energy levels enable him to get box to box to help cover.

The problem is I don't think he will start and think it will be Allen instead.
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Postby ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Sun Aug 11, 2013 12:07 pm

Benny The Noon » Sun Aug 11, 2013 10:09 am wrote:It was clear that Henderson isn't suited to that wide berth when playing in his first season and last season he flourished through the middle.

You say that players brushed through the middle so why would you move Henderson out and leave Lucas and Gerrard exposed ?

Playing Coutinho in the middle does exactly that - I can remember which game it was but with Coutinho in the middle last year behind a front three left us outnumbered in the middle. Coutinho may sort of play the wide role but he roams a lot around the pitch. Coutinho certainly is being pushed out wide to shoehorn because that's where he has played most of his career and where he was most effective. Henderson certainly wasnt anywhere near as effective out wide. The best results and performances we had last year where based on Coutinho out wide and Henderson through the middle. Not sure why you would want to swap them around Yakka ?


coutinho is better centrally where he can see the whole picture and use his full range of passing, stuck out wide you are only really influencing half of the pitch, if that.
look at some of his highlights from last season, the pass through to sturridge with the outside of his foot against fulham, the pass against newcastle where sturridge and hendo linked up to score, his goal against QPR.......all executed when he was playing in a central area.
hendo wouldnt be playing as a traditional winger hugging the touchline getting chalk on his boots, he would be dropping back into midfield helping out gerrard and lucas and getting forward to help the attack. at times we during the game we would be lining up like this


                                                                                 lucas           gerrard         hendo

                                                                                                   coutinho

                                                                                       aspas                 sturridge

and at other times when we are on top we would be like this

                                                                                                 lucas

                                                                                  coutinho                gerrard

                                                                     aspas                   sturridge              hendo

it`s very a fluid formation, which is what rodgers wants to play. playing that way you get your most effective attackers (sturridge & coutinho) playing in the area`s where they can do the most damage to the opposition but you also have enough legs in midfield to cover our obvious weakness in there (our lack of athleticism)
infact i wouldnt mind seeing this formation in a cup game or something just to see if we would be better off going for energy rather than ability in the DM area

                                                                                 allen                  hendo

                                                                                           coutinho

                                                                   aspas               sturridge          ibe
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Postby Kenny Kan » Sun Aug 11, 2013 12:09 pm

Mignolet

Johnson        Kolo         Agger      Enrique

               Lucas     Allen       Gerrard

                       Coutinho

               Aspas         Sturridge
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Postby ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Sun Aug 11, 2013 12:24 pm

Kenny Kan » Sun Aug 11, 2013 11:09 am wrote:Mignolet

Johnson        Kolo         Agger      Enrique

               Lucas     Allen       Gerrard

                       Coutinho

               Aspas         Sturridge


good line up ken but i`d change hendo for allen.
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Postby Benny The Noon » Sun Aug 11, 2013 12:29 pm

ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Sun Aug 11, 2013 12:07 pm wrote:
Benny The Noon » Sun Aug 11, 2013 10:09 am wrote:It was clear that Henderson isn't suited to that wide berth when playing in his first season and last season he flourished through the middle.

You say that players brushed through the middle so why would you move Henderson out and leave Lucas and Gerrard exposed ?

Playing Coutinho in the middle does exactly that - I can remember which game it was but with Coutinho in the middle last year behind a front three left us outnumbered in the middle. Coutinho may sort of play the wide role but he roams a lot around the pitch. Coutinho certainly is being pushed out wide to shoehorn because that's where he has played most of his career and where he was most effective. Henderson certainly wasnt anywhere near as effective out wide. The best results and performances we had last year where based on Coutinho out wide and Henderson through the middle. Not sure why you would want to swap them around Yakka ?


coutinho is better centrally where he can see the whole picture and use his full range of passing, stuck out wide you are only really influencing half of the pitch, if that.
look at some of his highlights from last season, the pass through to sturridge with the outside of his foot against fulham, the pass against newcastle where sturridge and hendo linked up to score, his goal against QPR.......all executed when he was playing in a central area.
hendo wouldnt be playing as a traditional winger hugging the touchline getting chalk on his boots, he would be dropping back into midfield helping out gerrard and lucas and getting forward to help the attack. at times we during the game we would be lining up like this


                                                                                 lucas           gerrard         hendo

                                                                                                   coutinho

                                                                                       aspas                 sturridge

and at other times when we are on top we would be like this

                                                                                                 lucas

                                                                                  coutinho                gerrard

                                                                     aspas                   sturridge              hendo

it`s very a fluid formation, which is what rodgers wants to play. playing that way you get your most effective attackers (sturridge & coutinho) playing in the area`s where they can do the most damage to the opposition but you also have enough legs in midfield to cover our obvious weakness in there (our lack of athleticism)
infact i wouldnt mind seeing this formation in a cup game or something just to see if we would be better off going for energy rather than ability in the DM area

                                                                                 allen                  hendo

                                                                                           coutinho

                                                                   aspas               sturridge          ibe


I hope we don't ever play that last formation mate - no way should Henderson and Allen play together - that would certainly be a very big recipe for disaster - so much is lacking between the two.

Can certainly see the picture with the first two formations but we would need to be careful to ensure the numbers are in the middle to try and not get overrun by the oppo's ( who all regularly play 3 in the middle ) .

And Aspas yesterday showed the worries I have about him - against a strong back 4 he just got brushed aside and against Stoke he won't see many stronger - certainly would like to see him improve that part before starting.
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Postby Kenny Kan » Sun Aug 11, 2013 12:34 pm

I like what I've seen from Allen Yakka, okay it hasn't been top drawer stuff but I think at this moment in time there is more to Allen than Henderson personally. Henderson (IMO) is a steady Eddie engine, Allen I believe is more livelier and willing amongst the build up in final third than Henderson (although Henderson is a better finisher)

There isn't much between them imo but I'd just give Allen the nod - on style. I'm looking for a spark from midfield and out of our 4 mids, (Gerrard, Hendo, Lucas & Allen) I think Allen's that little bit different from the rest.
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Postby ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Sun Aug 11, 2013 12:38 pm

i dont think aspas can lead the line in the prem but i can see him playing as a wide-ish forward linking up with the likes of sturridge (and hopefully at some point suarez). i think he`d do a decent job popping up here and there and getting the odd goal. if he played all season i could see him getting into double figures comfortably because he gets himself in the 6 yard box and goalscoring positions a lot.
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Postby Benny The Noon » Sun Aug 11, 2013 12:45 pm

ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Sun Aug 11, 2013 12:38 pm wrote:i dont think aspas can lead the line in the prem but i can see him playing as a wide-ish forward linking up with the likes of sturridge (and hopefully at some point suarez). i think he`d do a decent job popping up here and there and getting the odd goal. if he played all season i could see him getting into double figures comfortably because he gets himself in the 6 yard box and goalscoring positions a lot.


The problem i see though is getting that time and space in the prem when a player is getting bullied and hustled about. Borini was the same last season - in pre season he looked like he was going to score goals because of the movement and space he could find but when it was against the stronger defences - he just struggled to create that space for himself - see the same yesterday with Aspas - if the space is there he will fill it but he could find it yesterday because the defence was far stronger. He could possibly provide more than Borini but I wouldn't start him against Stoke or in the prem for a while until he gets used to that lack of space.
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Postby ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Sun Aug 11, 2013 12:45 pm

Kenny Kan » Sun Aug 11, 2013 11:34 am wrote:I like what I've seen from Allen Yakka, okay it hasn't been top drawer stuff but I think at this moment in time there is more to Allen than Henderson personally. Henderson (IMO) is a steady Eddie engine, Allen I believe is more livelier and willing amongst the build up in final third than Henderson (although Henderson is a better finisher)

There isn't much between them imo but I'd just give Allen the nod - on style. I'm looking for a spark from midfield and out of our 4 mids, (Gerrard, Hendo, Lucas & Allen) I think Allen's that little bit different from the rest.


i think hendo`s a better player mate, i think he`s more athletic than joe and more likely to get a goal. i havent been that impressed with lucas, gerrard and allen as a 3 in pre season tbh. not enough creativity. i think joe`s best footy was when he was in the side instead of lucas, maybe it`s worth trying that in a cup game or something.
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