Liverpool FC Forum

[Emerald Red]

So
Alonso was loyal because he wanted to go for some time, but ended up giving us five years and least he gave Benitez the time to negotiate a good price. But in your opinion he tarnished that by abruptly handing in his transfer on such a short notice.
Fair enough
Still rather have him than Barry

I'd rather have both to be fair, but it never panned out that way. Still, I'd have taken Barry THEN if it meant that we'd now be in a more settled situation.

[Sir Roger]

I'm shocked that some people believe Alonso handing in his transfer was a bit of a surprirse and probably something that Rafa wasn't even expecting.
After failing to get Barry the season before by using Alonso as the bait I would say the writing was on the wall...

[Emerald Red]

Sorry, yeah - Russian doll ahoy there! Do I get banned yet?

[muzza798]

Sell mascherano for £40 mil and then buy David Villa and put Gerrard back in the holding role. Selling Gerrard would be an own goal of most epic  preportions.

[Emerald Red]

I'm shocked that some people believe Alonso handing in his transfer was a bit of a surprirse and probably something that Rafa wasn't even expecting.
After failing to get Barry the season before by using Alonso as the bait I would say the writing was on the wall...

Let's be honest - Arsenal and a few others were sniffing about for a while, but as soon as Madrid came in, he swiftly changed his tune. Yeah, I'd call that a surprise considering were were seemingly on the brink of having a settled enough side with a chance at winning major trophies.

[Emerald Red]

Sell mascherano for £40 mil and then buy David Villa and put Gerrard back in the holding role. Selling Gerrard would be an own goal of most epic  preportions.

LOL

NO! Just NO!

[teamleader1]

[ I'm not debating the fact Bentez f*cked up by buying an injured player to replace him with, but at the time Xabi's handing in his transfere was a bit of a suprirse and probably something that Rafa wasn't even expecting. I recall him trying to get him to stay, but when he couldn't what was he to do? Who were the alternatives? He had to act quick, and in his defense it would have been a serious reshuffling of his overall plans for the team this season. It was a gamble, but it's still not excusing the fact that we should have at least been OK, or at least functioning as a team without Alonso. I still believe the state of the side isn't just down to his exit. It's part of it no doubt. I just find it irritating that people are now using this as an excuse to excuse the poor form of the team this season. When Xabi was out for long spells, we coped well enough. Anyway, back to the topic at hand about our captain.

I think Rafa was just trying to be the good guy in front of the fans
He wanted shut of Alonso since the baby incident.

Why did he come out with an attack on Barry for choosing ManC over us? Alonso hadnte put in a written transfer at the time

Because he still wanted him in and Alonso out

[Sir Roger]

I'm shocked that some people believe Alonso handing in his transfer was a bit of a surprirse and probably something that Rafa wasn't even expecting.
After failing to get Barry the season before by using Alonso as the bait I would say the writing was on the wall...

Let's be honest - Arsenal and a few others were sniffing about for a while, but as soon as Madrid came in, he swiftly changed his tune. Yeah, I'd call that a surprise considering were were seemingly on the brink of having a settled enough side with a chance at winning major trophies.

Hmmm
I was more disappointed than surprised. I dont think it was a secret that Alonso felt let down and annoyed about what had happened the season before. I thought it was just a matter of time before he left. And as you say we benefited from the move financially although I still would rather have him playing for us. Especially with what has happened since

[muzza798]

Sell mascherano for £40 mil and then buy David Villa and put Gerrard back in the holding role. Selling Gerrard would be an own goal of most epic  preportions.

LOL

NO! Just NO!

Ok then what about getting Toni on the free

[account deleted by request]

utYour missing the point though Emerald.

Rafa wanted to sell Alonso .....not for 3 times his price, but for between £14 and £16million when he was after Barry.

Rafa then replaced Alonso with an injured player that has played 45mins since he joined us.

Alonso had 2 good years out of 5 with us (I personally don't think he was that good in his first season either)

We EVENTUALLY got a good price for him, but before his last excellent season for us we couldn't get £15million for him.

My opinion of Alonso hasn't changed, I thought he was a good player who had two poor seasons on the trot before Rafa first tried to sell him.

I find it strange that people are trying to defend Rafa by talking about Barry rather than the injured player that Rafa paid almost double the price we could have got Barry for.

Circumstances change from summer-to-summer regarding budget, though. The summer we sold Xabi, he'd to sell to buy, plus the Yanks probably had the pressure on to get a sufficient recoup on the player to balance the books. Who knows. I'm not debating the fact Bentez f*cked up by buying an injured player to replace him with, but at the time Xabi's handing in his transfere was a bit of a suprirse and probably something that Rafa wasn't even expecting. I recall him trying to get him to stay, but when he couldn't what was he to do? Who were the alternatives? He had to act quick, and in his defense it would have been a serious reshuffling of his overall plans for the team this season. It was a gamble, but it's still not excusing the fact that we should have at least been OK, or at least functioning as a team without Alonso. I still believe the state of the side isn't just down to his exit. It's part of it no doubt. I just find it irritating that people are now using this as an excuse to excuse the poor form of the team this season. When Xabi was out for long spells, we coped well enough. Anyway, back to the topic at hand about our captain.[/quote]
It was hardly a SURPRISE when Alonso handed in a transfer request, Alonso had been saying since the end of the season that he wanted to go.

But I agree that losing Alonso is not the main reason for our current problems. Rafa must take the majority of the blame for that.

He brought in a load of new backroom staff, gave the players a very poor pre-season campaign, and then stuck with a system that WOULDN'T WORK with the players now at his disposal for far too long.

Selling Gerrard would be the final folly if Rafa was foolish enough to do it, which I don't think he is.

We are talking about a player that has scored in League cup finals, a UEFA cup final, an FA cup final and a CL final.

A player that also brought us back from the dead in two of those finals and on other occasions too numerous to count.

This season he has sacrificed his form and fitness for the good of the team by playing on when he is injured, and people would consider selling him because one or two of the lesser lights MIGHT POSSIBLY be overawed by his talent, or maybe its a last desperate ploy to defect some of the blame from where it should lie.......with the manager.

[Emerald Red]

I'm shocked that some people believe Alonso handing in his transfer was a bit of a surprirse and probably something that Rafa wasn't even expecting.
After failing to get Barry the season before by using Alonso as the bait I would say the writing was on the wall...

Let's be honest - Arsenal and a few others were sniffing about for a while, but as soon as Madrid came in, he swiftly changed his tune. Yeah, I'd call that a surprise considering were were seemingly on the brink of having a settled enough side with a chance at winning major trophies.

Hmmm
I was more disappointed than surprised. I dont think it was a secret that Alonso felt let down and annoyed about what had happened the season before. I thought it was just a matter of time before he left. And as you say we benefited from the move financially although I still would rather have him playing for us. Especially with what has happened since

I wish we'd buy him back, but pigs might fly first.  I think it's folly to assume that Benitez wanted rid of Xabi without any kind of pre-emptive motive for it. As Gerrard said, Xabi wanted to go home for a long time. How do we know he wasn't convinced to stay like Sami was for an extra season? Players have their own motives too. It's not all the manager. It's not like, say, a Japp Stam incident, or a Beckham football boot scenario, is it?

[Emerald Red]

Sell mascherano for £40 mil and then buy David Villa and put Gerrard back in the holding role. Selling Gerrard would be an own goal of most epic  preportions.

LOL

NO! Just NO!

Ok then what about getting Toni on the free

I'd take anyone with better quality than Voronin on a free. So, yes!

[Sir Roger]

Agreed
Rafa is not THAT stupid
But I think Emerald may have a point in that he was surprised by Alonsos request and didnt know that Alonso would have been upset at his treatment
He might not have seen it coming because he doesnt understand emotions in football
Only facts...?

[muzza798]

Sell mascherano for £40 mil and then buy David Villa and put Gerrard back in the holding role. Selling Gerrard would be an own goal of most epic  preportions.

LOL

NO! Just NO!

Ok then what about getting Toni on the free

I'd take anyone with better quality than Voronin on a free. So, yes!

We need to get Toni on the free and trade Babel for a quality right winger. Then Kuyt and Toni could be back up for Torres and we'd have 3 or 4 quality wingers.

Also i think its time Carra moved on. We really should try and get Upson but tbh we wont be getting anyone good if we dont qualify for CL football next season.

[Emerald Red]

Agreed
Rafa is not THAT stupid
But I think Emerald may have a point in that he was surprised by Alonsos request and didnt know that Alonso would have been upset at his treatment
He might not have seen it coming because he doesnt understand emotions in football
Only facts...?

Either way, Rafa shot himself in the foot with that one. I just think it was poor timeing on Alonso's behalf to do what he did, when he did. It was just an unfortunate situation that should have been prevented.