Liverpool FC Forum

[maguskwt]

Apparently BR wanted van Dijk when he was at Celtics but was not supported by the club's scouts. Another testimony for FSG's system...

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/fo ... s-12595467

I've just mentioned that same story in the transfer thread, I didn't notice it in last nights Echo though, I actually saw it on Sky Sports. It's just typical of us to turn down the chance of signing someone like Van Dijk who's now regarded as one of the best defenders in the division for £2.6m but at the same time happily fork out £10m on the likes of Borini.

It's really fecked up Yakka. Here we are acting like or trying to be a top 4 club and our scouts and owners are not up for the job. It's a disgrace considering the history of the club. If you have to have it your way, by all means, make it work.

[devaney]

Penguins - I really don't know how many times I have to repeat this: "WE ARE NOT IN THE ELITE PLAYER LEAGUE" Why would a player in that category sign for Liverpool. Their demands are simple: regular CL football, constant title challenging opportunity, peer group representation within their chosen team, premier location and of course a club that is wealthy enough to meet their outrageous wage demands.

Blame the owners all you like. I accept that their transfer policy is questionable but are they totally to blame for some atrocious scouting and pitiful advice. Did they personally select Carroll at £35m, Benteke for crazy money, Moreno, Aspas, Downing, Markovic at £20m, Bogdan, Lambert, Borini and that clown Balotelli to name but a few. Our record in the transfer market is very poor. Just look at the players that Leicester and Southampton have bought for peanuts over the last few years and sold on for substantial profit. OUR SCOUTS SHOULD ALL BE SACKED and yes that does come down to the owners. Little wonder that they have appointed a sporting director responsible for transfers !!!

Eds it appears that you have finally realised that Rogers did a reasonable job under the circumstances. Maybe you have spotted that Celtic have 70 points out of a possible 72. And don't give me the weak league argument. That is an impressive achievement regardless !!

[maguskwt]

i havent been keeping in touch with the scottish... but wow, 70/72 is really impressive by any standard. Is that some kind of record? Always liked BR. He is a promising manager but maybe took the liverpool job too soon. he buckled under pressure and he struggled with FSG's transfer system...

[devaney]

I noticed with a degree of amusement that some fans have been berating FSG for not meeting Draxler's wage demands. I really hope that those same fans watched PSG thrash the mighty Barca last night to appreciate the gulf we are facing when we show an interest in the likes of Draxler. I honestly believe that the wages issue were just one of the many obstacles we had to overcome when going into a transfer battle with the likes of PSG.

[maguskwt]

Bayern 5 - Arsenal 1
And yet Wenger will probably stay on at Arsenal because he always qualifies rhem for CL. a similar theme we woll probably follow in near future..

[ycsatbjywtbiastkamb]

I noticed with a degree of amusement that some fans have been berating FSG for not meeting Draxler's wage demands. I really hope that those same fans watched PSG thrash the mighty Barca last night to appreciate the gulf we are facing when we show an interest in the likes of Draxler. I honestly believe that the wages issue were just one of the many obstacles we had to overcome when going into a transfer battle with the likes of PSG.

The top players aren't soft, they can tell the difference between clubs that are genuinely trying to win something and those that have other priorities (like CL qualification).

[the return of HAS]

If people are going to criticise FSG at least be balanced and actually give a sensible critique.

Moores mismanaged the club and its finances for years which resulted in clubs in weaker positions than us catching up with us financially and in some cases overtook us. He then sold us to two American crooks who proceeded to asset strip the club to the edge of administration and relegation. Some of you act as if buyers were queuing up to buy the club. We were publicly up for sale at a discounted price with the whole process plastered all over the papers and there were no Sheik’s or Russian oligarchs in sight.

F.S.G have made mistakes no doubt, but they have also built a new stand, something that was never going to happen until they bought the club, hired a top class manager, and according to that manager made funds available when requested. Our revenues and sponsorship have gone up and the club is now being run in a sensible manner comparable to the clubs who generate revenues that allow them to be competitive at the higher end of the transfer market.

I don’t mean to insult anyone but frankly some of you seem to spend too much time reading dodgy newspapers and jumping to unsubstantiated conclusions. Given the state the club was in and given the fact that FSG are a business (like it or not) and in the absence of Russian oligarchs, progress has been reasonable and more importantly forward looking. Fans keep telling FSG to “sell up” but to who exactly. If someone comes along with a healthy offer I’m pretty sure FSG will walk away a tidy profit and be happy in the fact they have helped the club along a little. But apart from rumours started by tabloid journalists in an attempt to get more clicks and keep their bosses happy there is no evidence of any interest.

[parchpea]

All I would say is the stand is not a gift FSG loaned us the money and we are paying it back.

They have benefited greatly from our poor situation but havent put one cent of their own cash in, despite sitting on an incredible return on their investment they have no ambition to reinvest any of that money to improve the team.

Its not all bad, they brought in Klopp and do respond when fans want a manager out or in, for sake of argument they did put the stand up and I guess didn't have too, its whether in your heart you believe its enough.

I want Liverpool back on top and FSG havent shown they have enough about them to do that.

[eds]

If people are going to criticise FSG at least be balanced and actually give a sensible critique.

Moores mismanaged the club and its finances for years which resulted in clubs in weaker positions than us catching up with us financially and in some cases overtook us. He then sold us to two American crooks who proceeded to asset strip the club to the edge of administration and relegation. Some of you act as if buyers were queuing up to buy the club. We were publicly up for sale at a discounted price with the whole process plastered all over the papers and there were no Sheik’s or Russian oligarchs in sight.

F.S.G have made mistakes no doubt, but they have also built a new stand, something that was never going to happen until they bought the club, hired a top class manager, and according to that manager made funds available when requested. Our revenues and sponsorship have gone up and the club is now being run in a sensible manner comparable to the clubs who generate revenues that allow them to be competitive at the higher end of the transfer market.

I don’t mean to insult anyone but frankly some of you seem to spend too much time reading dodgy newspapers and jumping to unsubstantiated conclusions. Given the state the club was in and given the fact that FSG are a business (like it or not) and in the absence of Russian oligarchs, progress has been reasonable and more importantly forward looking. Fans keep telling FSG to “sell up” but to who exactly. If someone comes along with a healthy offer I’m pretty sure FSG will walk away a tidy profit and be happy in the fact they have helped the club along a little. But apart from rumours started by tabloid journalists in an attempt to get more clicks and keep their bosses happy there is no evidence of any interest.

Absurd argument.

Why does it have to be one extreme or the other?

On one extreme you have the City and Chelsea's of this world that are bankrolled by nefarious characters but have had continued success over the last 6-12 years respectively.

On the other extreme you have us who are supposedly "stable" and "sustainable" but have not looked competitive since the day FSG took over and don't look like we will ever be under them.

To call our progress as "reasonable" is laughable and I don't mean to insult you but extremely miopic and deluded.

A lot of us are calling for them to meet us somewhere in the middle, drop the restrictive transfer policies we have and start taking more risk in players that we know won't make you a profit BUT will start to make us more competitive as time goes by and lead to a more balanced squad.

The problem is that people on the fringes like you seem to interpret that as us calling for Messi and Ronaldo to be signed, by tomorrow 

By having a more balanced squad Klopp will have a much better chance of winning trophies this way, rather than becoming disillusioned and leaving (or being sacked) as we continue our current trajectory under FSG of profit first, results later approach.

[maguskwt]

We're in 7th year of FSG's ownership and we only have a singular league cup to show for. I would say that that's not good enough. First of all, the manager need to be kept for a longer period of time. If FSG feels that the success of Liverpool is a long term goal, then the manager need to be kept long term as well. It doesn't help that with each manager coming in, the squad is being chopped and changed.2nd FSG needs to show more guts when procuring players. If you have a competent scout team and a manager who has an eye for talent (and I believe JK has this) then there is no need to lowball players. Pay them what they ask for, secure their signature. We can't afford to buy established players, so don't skimp on wages when trying to secure obviously talented players like Dele Alli and Van Dyke. Under Rafa, we were successful in building a strong squad. We had the best midfield in the premier league. So why can't we now? Rafa builds from the spine of the team, the past two managers, BR and JK, builds from the wings. I buy more AM's, wide forwards and full backs than we buy CM's, DM's and CB's. Not to mention GK and out and out striker! Maybe we should show some patience because it is only JK's 1st full season. But time and time again FSG has disappointed us in the transfer market. It has been the same during BR's reign and now it looks the same under JK. I don't think it is unreasonable that fans start pointing their fingers at FSG.

[Reg]

Maybe its the message that's wrong.

FSG are well intentioned and want success, as does the manager. Maybe its a lack of meaningful communication between club and fans that leads us to jump to the wrong conclusions or simply not understand the strategy. It LOOKS like chop and change however it might be part of a wider strategy we can't see.

Better communications would sure help.

[Thommo's perm]

"Hi Reginald, its John Henry here. Just want to run something by you...?"
     

[Reg]

Clearly you don't get the calls then Thommo....       

[Thommo's perm]

   

[RED BEERGOGGLES]

I think I would keep the banners hidden for 'if and when' SOS become involved, if they're quiet then there is no cause for consternation just yet ! In truth they seem to be preoccupied with petitioning for a safe standing section at Anfield after Celtic incorporated one into their stadium .

You guys need to know that without the action and hard work of the Spirit of Shankly, Tom (Werner) and I would not have bought the Club".
John Henry.

I'm not saying our owners are perfect far from it,  but we're not £536 million in debt like those along the East Lancs whose latest figures show a 25% increase in debt in the last 12 months, the highest debt in European football and nearly £200 million more than Benfica who are second on that list.

United's revenue is approx 521 million a year but this year it was £513 million due to the value of the falling pound, ok its significantly less high risk than some clubs, but its more than a touch disconcerting for those die hard United fans who see the Glazers slowly bleeding the club dry in the same manner we watched Hicks and Gillette. 

Anfield has been expanded and is due for further renovation rather than throwing the fans into a soulless stadium such as West Ham fans found themselves in and FSG have secured one of the best managers and certainly the most passionate in Europe to a long contract, the players that the manager wants will arrive 'eventually ' and yet we still hanker after a sheik or an Oligarch even if it means those owners will bring in the players 'they want' 

I mean for me personally placating the fans by putting £100 million pound players on the pitch and in the squad whilst driving up an astronomical debt is not how I want to see my club being run, nor do I want to be run by a billionaire who chops and changes managers on a whim.