Liverpool FC Forum

[god_bless_john_houlding]

Money makes a difference in the callibire of player you can go after.

Everyone who thinks my point is "money doesn't matter" might just want to read that quote a little closer.

It's obvious that money makes a difference in who you can bring in or even go after. Can I stress it anymore so it actually sinks into certain people's head?

But, and this is the important bit that people don't seem to understand, money isn't an excuse for us not winning the league. Newcastle probably the best example, spend nearly 50 million year in year out and don't have to sell to fund transfers (which apparently we do, although I don't agree with that either). Yet Newcastle haven't been in the top six since Bobby Robson left and haven't been in the top 3 since 96. Also it's not like they were buying the lowest quality. Owen/Barton/Woodgate/Bramble (at the time was rated future England captain)/Dyer (raved about at Ipswich)/Bowyer (reportedly as good as Gerrard at Leeds  ) Alan Smith. All players who have or were supposed to be regulars for England. That's without the forigen imports as well.

So I'll try and stress it to a point that even Humpty Dumpty (after he fell off the wall and all) can understand. You can have all the money in the world, doesn't guarentee success. Chelsea prime example this year, all that money yet a fair distance behind Arsenal. Lost the Carling Cup, only drew in the European Cup and no have the most difficult of FA Cup ties against the world renound Barnsley.

Money doesn't bring success, it may help in the cause because you can buy the likes of Torres and Mascheranho but there's no guarentee that these players are going to work. So again money isn't a valid excuse for a club failing.

[maguskwt]

Money makes a difference in the callibire of player you can go after.

Everyone who thinks my point is "money doesn't matter" might just want to read that quote a little closer.

It's obvious that money makes a difference in who you can bring in or even go after. Can I stress it anymore so it actually sinks into certain people's head?

But, and this is the important bit that people don't seem to understand, money isn't an excuse for us not winning the league. Newcastle probably the best example, spend nearly 50 million year in year out and don't have to sell to fund transfers (which apparently we do, although I don't agree with that either). Yet Newcastle haven't been in the top six since Bobby Robson left and haven't been in the top 3 since 96. Also it's not like they were buying the lowest quality. Owen/Barton/Woodgate/Bramble (at the time was rated future England captain)/Dyer (raved about at Ipswich)/Bowyer (reportedly as good as Gerrard at Leeds  ) Alan Smith. All players who have or were supposed to be regulars for England. That's without the forigen imports as well.

So I'll try and stress it to a point that even Humpty Dumpty (after he fell off the wall and all) can understand. You can have all the money in the world, doesn't guarentee success. Chelsea prime example this year, all that money yet a fair distance behind Arsenal. Lost the Carling Cup, only drew in the European Cup and no have the most difficult of FA Cup ties against the world renound Barnsley.

Money doesn't bring success, it may help in the cause because you can buy the likes of Torres and Mascheranho but there's no guarentee that these players are going to work. So again money isn't a valid excuse for a club failing.

my my... if titus bramble was rated as future england captain, i really fear for english football... 

[god_bless_john_houlding]

Money makes a difference in the callibire of player you can go after.

Everyone who thinks my point is "money doesn't matter" might just want to read that quote a little closer.

It's obvious that money makes a difference in who you can bring in or even go after. Can I stress it anymore so it actually sinks into certain people's head?

But, and this is the important bit that people don't seem to understand, money isn't an excuse for us not winning the league. Newcastle probably the best example, spend nearly 50 million year in year out and don't have to sell to fund transfers (which apparently we do, although I don't agree with that either). Yet Newcastle haven't been in the top six since Bobby Robson left and haven't been in the top 3 since 96. Also it's not like they were buying the lowest quality. Owen/Barton/Woodgate/Bramble (at the time was rated future England captain)/Dyer (raved about at Ipswich)/Bowyer (reportedly as good as Gerrard at Leeds  ) Alan Smith. All players who have or were supposed to be regulars for England. That's without the forigen imports as well.

So I'll try and stress it to a point that even Humpty Dumpty (after he fell off the wall and all) can understand. You can have all the money in the world, doesn't guarentee success. Chelsea prime example this year, all that money yet a fair distance behind Arsenal. Lost the Carling Cup, only drew in the European Cup and no have the most difficult of FA Cup ties against the world renound Barnsley.

Money doesn't bring success, it may help in the cause because you can buy the likes of Torres and Mascheranho but there's no guarentee that these players are going to work. So again money isn't a valid excuse for a club failing.

my my... if titus bramble was rated as future england captain, i really fear for english football... 

When he was at Ipswich and came through with alot of their "talented" youngsters.

[account deleted by request]

Times OnlineFebruary 27, 2008

We're not good enough, says Steven Gerrard

Steven Gerrard has delivered a scathing assessment of Liverpool's faltering title campaign, saying even a fourth-placed finish in the Premier League is "not nearly good enough" for a team of their high standards.

Liverpool are currently fifth in the table, three points behind city rivals Everton.

"You don't get any prizes in football for finishing in second place, never mind fourth," Gerrard said. "I don't think that the fans would accept fourth as an accomplishment and for me it's not nearly good enough. We need to improve dramatically and even if we do finish fourth, it doesn't mean we have had a good season." 

Gerrard said that even winning the Champions League would not make up for their shortcomings in the Premier League.

"I am not going to pretend that even winning that trophy - and we are a long way away from it at the moment - will make up for the disappointment of the league campaign," he said.

"I'm pretty gutted every time I look at the table and see the gap between us and Arsenal at the top, and even the gap between us and second and third. We believed we had the players to challenge for the title, and we wanted that one more than any other trophy available to us. I still believe we have the squad to be a hell of a lot more competitive than we are right now."

Gerrard said he was fed up of his side's continuing failure in the league, with the Merseyside club having last lifted the title in the 1989-90 season.

"I'm getting tired of saying the same thing over and over again," he said. "We can't keep talking about next season all the time. There are only so many times you can say it and believe it. Sooner or later we have to make one season the season we make it happen and do the talking on the pitch.

"We need to make people believe it. I'm 27 now, I don't want to be talking about 'next season' for Liverpool when I'm 32. We've got the stadium, the fans, the manager and the players to compete for the Premier League. But we have no chance of doing that if we are always well out of it by the first week in January. And at the moment we have our work cut out fighting it out with Villa, Everton and Manchester City for fourth.

"Only we can make this season a success now. We'd like to finish fourth and win the European Cup again. But the demands of being a Liverpool player, the expectations that come with the privilege of pulling on that jersey mean we've got to improve.

"You make your own luck, shape your own destiny. And now we soon have massive games at Manchester United and Arsenal, knowing we can't win the league. We are not bothered about whether we have an impact on the title race we're not in. But winning at both those places would send out a message for next season. That would lay down a marker that no-one would ignore."

Gerrard expressed his disappointment that a season of crisis off the pitch has given "those in the media who don't like Liverpool" the chance to criticise.

"We have made it easy for them," he said. "It's not been a good situation (the takeover speculation) for anybody. It's sad so much of the club's business has been conducted in public. The club I have grown up supporting always did its business behind closed doors, and that is what we have to get back to.

"It's been a damaging situation for every single person involved with the club, fans, players, bosses, owners, from top to bottom."

[RedBlood]

not sure if this is relevent but if united lose out to arsenal in the prem this year will alex ferguson be critised for spending nearly 80million on a squad that won the league last year and finnishing second??

[Igor Zidane]

Times OnlineFebruary 27, 2008

We're not good enough, says Steven Gerrard

Steven Gerrard has delivered a scathing assessment of Liverpool's faltering title campaign, saying even a fourth-placed finish in the Premier League is "not nearly good enough" for a team of their high standards.

Liverpool are currently fifth in the table, three points behind city rivals Everton.

"You don't get any prizes in football for finishing in second place, never mind fourth," Gerrard said. "I don't think that the fans would accept fourth as an accomplishment and for me it's not nearly good enough. We need to improve dramatically and even if we do finish fourth, it doesn't mean we have had a good season." 

Gerrard said that even winning the Champions League would not make up for their shortcomings in the Premier League.

"I am not going to pretend that even winning that trophy - and we are a long way away from it at the moment - will make up for the disappointment of the league campaign," he said.

"I'm pretty gutted every time I look at the table and see the gap between us and Arsenal at the top, and even the gap between us and second and third. We believed we had the players to challenge for the title, and we wanted that one more than any other trophy available to us. I still believe we have the squad to be a hell of a lot more competitive than we are right now."

Gerrard said he was fed up of his side's continuing failure in the league, with the Merseyside club having last lifted the title in the 1989-90 season.

"I'm getting tired of saying the same thing over and over again," he said. "We can't keep talking about next season all the time. There are only so many times you can say it and believe it. Sooner or later we have to make one season the season we make it happen and do the talking on the pitch.

"We need to make people believe it. I'm 27 now, I don't want to be talking about 'next season' for Liverpool when I'm 32. We've got the stadium, the fans, the manager and the players to compete for the Premier League. But we have no chance of doing that if we are always well out of it by the first week in January. And at the moment we have our work cut out fighting it out with Villa, Everton and Manchester City for fourth.

"Only we can make this season a success now. We'd like to finish fourth and win the European Cup again. But the demands of being a Liverpool player, the expectations that come with the privilege of pulling on that jersey mean we've got to improve.

"You make your own luck, shape your own destiny. And now we soon have massive games at Manchester United and Arsenal, knowing we can't win the league. We are not bothered about whether we have an impact on the title race we're not in. But winning at both those places would send out a message for next season. That would lay down a marker that no-one would ignore."

Gerrard expressed his disappointment that a season of crisis off the pitch has given "those in the media who don't like Liverpool" the chance to criticise.

"We have made it easy for them," he said. "It's not been a good situation (the takeover speculation) for anybody. It's sad so much of the club's business has been conducted in public. The club I have grown up supporting always did its business behind closed doors, and that is what we have to get back to.

"It's been a damaging situation for every single person involved with the club, fans, players, bosses, owners, from top to bottom."

I'm not saying gerrard is wrong in what he is saying ,but that artical sounds awful familiar to me .

That sounds exactly like the noises he was making before he nearly went to chelsea, sounds ominous to me.

[NANNY RED]

Took the words out of me mouth then Igor just thinking the same thing

[god_bless_john_houlding]

Gerrard is speaking as a fan. That's what he is, a fan of Liverpool Football Club, like you and like me. I think he's right in what he's saying.

[bigmick]

Gerrard's interview is a candid assessment of the way things are. He says "I still believe we have the squad to be a hell of a lot more competitive than we are right now" and of course some of us totally agree with him. At the start of the season, it wasn't just some of us, it was all of us including the manager. Now I know that some people will jump on the bit where he says "we've got the stadium, the fans, the players and the manager" as proof that he is fully supportive of Rafa. I'm not so sure though. I agree with those who say it sounds like a pre-emptive "lets have a little look around at options" interview, if not an all out "come and get me".

The things in place which he talks about are all very well. The stadium, the fans and the players cannot be changed in a short space of time. Only the manager out of the list is changeable. You could say the methodology of the manager maybe adjusted, but that looks to be a no go area. There has been much talk of "If Rafa leaves then all the best polayers will go with him" from some of his most ardent supporters on here. I was just wondering, is there any mileage in fears that if Rafa STAYS we may lose one or two decent players as well.

[god_bless_john_houlding]

I was just wondering, is there any mileage in fears that if Rafa STAYS we may lose one or two decent players as well.

If it's a toss up between Benitez or Gerrard staying, then the skipper wins hands down for me.

But I can't see Benitez staying causing any of our top players to leave. I think all the players know that any move they make will be downwards. After all you can't go to a bigger club than Liverpool.

[NANNY RED]

I love Stevie to death but now is not the right time in my opinion to be coming out and givin interviews regarding this how many more players are we gonna hear from in the papers sayin were not good enough weve been hearing this the past few weeks.

Stevie is the captain and ok air his views but air them to the other players, the papers tomorrow will make a big meal out of all of this and twist it round. Im a bit sick and tired of some of our players sayin weve got a great team and we shouldnt be fighting for fouth or even third. well show us on the pitch then.

More than once this season ive watched players strollin around the pitch like they couldnt give a toss and Stevie has had his  days of doing it aswell, But by coming out and saying it publicly hes adding more pressure on them. Watch the papers and the news tomorrow it will be Gerrard unrest at Anfield

[god_bless_john_houlding]

I love Stevie to death but now is not the right time in my opinion to be coming out and givin interviews regarding this how many more players are we gonna hear from in the papers sayin were not good enough weve been hearing this the past few weeks.

Stevie is the captain and ok air his views but air them to the other players, the papers tomorrow will make a big meal out of all of this and twist it round. Im a bit sick and tired of some of our players sayin weve got a great team and we shouldnt be fighting for fouth or even third. well show us on the pitch then.

More than once this season ive watched players strollin around the pitch like they couldnt give a toss and Stevie has had his  days of doing it aswell, But by coming out and saying it publicly hes adding more pressure on them. Watch the papers and the news tomorrow it will be Gerrard unrest at Anfield

Nanny, the reason "players are strolling around" is because they're out of the title chase. Look against Inter, everyone pulled their weight (except Aurellio  ) but because it's a realistic target, they go for it. Also because it brings more attention from the media and is considered the biggest club trophy in the world, everyone wants to win it.

That's why, but doesn't mean I agree with them lacklusterly (if that's a word) performing in the league. They're wearing our colours and therefore should be a team we can be proud of. Players (not Gerrard IMO) were strolling as you put it, well before the end of October when we still had a chance of mounting a challenge. It's an embarassment to watch certain players just coast through games without putting the effort or graft in yet still pick up a fair share of bread at the end of the week. Money mad this world.

[account deleted by request]

I can't see anything wrong with what he said and agree with almost all of it. I think he may have picked the wrong time to say it though. The papers seem to be like sharks around us at the moment, waiting for any one of a 100 different senarios to be played out, and this will just add to the "feeding frenzie".

Time for action not words, but you can't blame him for being frustrated at everything that has happened this season. Now we have Madrid supposedly sniffing around, are we going to have Gerrard episode 3 shortly if we don't reach the final? I can't really see him wanting to play abroad myself, so I would be more worried if it was Chelsea or maybe the Mancs(unthinkable) after him.

Wrong time, wrong place, right message, is my summation.

[god_bless_john_houlding]

Wrong time? Is there a right time then for telling players ultimately you're ? End of the season, they all off to their holidays to Barbados and Spain and couldn't give a toss about the club. So if you tell them then, they're not really going to take it in and if they do it might knock their confidence for the following season. Tell them at the beginning of the season that it's imperative we mount a title charge, might and more than likely put to much pressure of the shoulders of these players. Tell them half way through the season is the best time, but it's not neccessarily the right time. Half way through, you can do something about it or crumble and end up in disaster situation.

I don't think there really is an appropriate time for something like this, but it has to be said. I hope that Gerrard isn't excluding himself from this though, and against Bolton I'd like to see him run his bollox off, rather than come out after the game and say "there's no point trying because fourth is no achievement" He along with the rest of the lads have to try and finish as highly as possible. I don't class fourth as any achievement but I'd like to see a bit of passion and pride showing to ensure we get that fourth spot.

[maguskwt]

Times OnlineFebruary 27, 2008

We're not good enough, says Steven Gerrard

Steven Gerrard has delivered a scathing assessment of Liverpool's faltering title campaign, saying even a fourth-placed finish in the Premier League is "not nearly good enough" for a team of their high standards.

Liverpool are currently fifth in the table, three points behind city rivals Everton.

"You don't get any prizes in football for finishing in second place, never mind fourth," Gerrard said. "I don't think that the fans would accept fourth as an accomplishment and for me it's not nearly good enough. We need to improve dramatically and even if we do finish fourth, it doesn't mean we have had a good season." 

Gerrard said that even winning the Champions League would not make up for their shortcomings in the Premier League.

"I am not going to pretend that even winning that trophy - and we are a long way away from it at the moment - will make up for the disappointment of the league campaign," he said.

"I'm pretty gutted every time I look at the table and see the gap between us and Arsenal at the top, and even the gap between us and second and third. We believed we had the players to challenge for the title, and we wanted that one more than any other trophy available to us. I still believe we have the squad to be a hell of a lot more competitive than we are right now."

Gerrard said he was fed up of his side's continuing failure in the league, with the Merseyside club having last lifted the title in the 1989-90 season.

"I'm getting tired of saying the same thing over and over again," he said. "We can't keep talking about next season all the time. There are only so many times you can say it and believe it. Sooner or later we have to make one season the season we make it happen and do the talking on the pitch.

"We need to make people believe it. I'm 27 now, I don't want to be talking about 'next season' for Liverpool when I'm 32. We've got the stadium, the fans, the manager and the players to compete for the Premier League. But we have no chance of doing that if we are always well out of it by the first week in January. And at the moment we have our work cut out fighting it out with Villa, Everton and Manchester City for fourth.

"Only we can make this season a success now. We'd like to finish fourth and win the European Cup again. But the demands of being a Liverpool player, the expectations that come with the privilege of pulling on that jersey mean we've got to improve.

"You make your own luck, shape your own destiny. And now we soon have massive games at Manchester United and Arsenal, knowing we can't win the league. We are not bothered about whether we have an impact on the title race we're not in. But winning at both those places would send out a message for next season. That would lay down a marker that no-one would ignore."

Gerrard expressed his disappointment that a season of crisis off the pitch has given "those in the media who don't like Liverpool" the chance to criticise.

"We have made it easy for them," he said. "It's not been a good situation (the takeover speculation) for anybody. It's sad so much of the club's business has been conducted in public. The club I have grown up supporting always did its business behind closed doors, and that is what we have to get back to.

"It's been a damaging situation for every single person involved with the club, fans, players, bosses, owners, from top to bottom."

I'm not saying gerrard is wrong in what he is saying ,but that artical sounds awful familiar to me .

That sounds exactly like the noises he was making before he nearly went to chelsea, sounds ominous to me.

I sense it too... and that's the thing i dont' like about this interview... he has every right to criticize and give some wake up call to the players...but at the end of the day he's the captain and he was also guilty of underperforming for stretches of games this season... where is the comment of taking the captain's responsibility and criticizing himself as well? saying something like "we all have underpeformed... including me"... right now the words like "i'm fed up...", "I'm tired of", "even if we finish fourth" or " even if we win THAT trophy"... sounds just too negative for me... and it shows in his body language on the field as well...