Liverpool FC Forum

[Stu the Red]

Our collective Achilles heel will always reappear without an established back four ,I am a strong advocate for a defence that are familiar
with each others weaknesses and indeed strengths in order to provide a stability hitherto lacking in our performances of late.

I just think two strong CB's is essential to balance out the weaknesses in each others game ,the call for a tall CB who will command his
area has in my mind  always been top priority ,Take Coates for instance who has had little opportunity to show his game to Rodgers ,and
yet a player we consider to possess  glaring deficiencies in the air is opted for regularly ,and on the back of supposedly weak performances. 

We constantly dither at paying top prices for top defenders who are at that time in peak form ,and coveted by most of the quality teams.
It will never get any better until we sign a real leader who players are scared witless about contesting for the ball,until then we will put
one foot forward ,one foot ..........

Its not about being scared sh*tless of defenders. Its about Skrtel's glarring lack of quality. He is reasonable at winning headers from goal kicks and long ball's, and just straight forward blocks and tackles he's pretty good...  but from crosses and set pieces he is average at best. On the ground he isn't great at passing, and his reading of the game and positional play is quite frankly awful and any game where this is required he is found wanting.

For Chelsea's second goal he was again the main culprit, allowing the space for Eto'o to run into because he yet again failed to close the space off for an opposition player. That two games in a row he's been at least 75% at fault for the second goal and its just not good enough.

What's more, is he's always been the same. You can put Ferdinand, Thuram and Maldini at their best next to him and he'd still struggle due to the attributes he lacks.

Concentration, positioning and reading of the game are probably the most important attributes for any good centre half, Skrtel is lower championship standard in these attributes.

[JC_81]

He's not as bad as some are making out, but I've never been a great fan of him either.

I said when City were being linked with him for 20mil before he signed a new contract that I'd snap their hands off for that.  I stand by that.

Decent Premiership centre half but not top class.

Clumsy in the tackle and positionally suspect.  Gets bullied by physical centre forwards too and by other centre halfs at set pieces (See Kompany's goal recently).  It's the greatest myth in football that Skrtel's a 'big hard centre half'.  To me he's quite soft when you look past his tattoos and skinhead.  Don't judge a book by it's cover.

Sakho was just as bad yesterday though.  Johnson and Agger (granted he played out of position) were arguably worse.  Mignolet's attempt to save the second was pitiful too.

[damjan193]

Can't still understand how he allowed ***** dinosaur Eto to score like that. I agree with Stu, Skrtel has zero awareness. Time he visits his old pal the bench I think.

[Stu the Red]

Yesterday says everything you need to know about him, bang at the shirt pulling again in the most obvious way possible and yet again another shocking header and failing to close the ball down allows Adam to smash one into the net.

The lads a f*cking disgrace. Every week he's the main culprit for at least one goal we concede.

His positioning, heading, reading of the game, teamwork and defensive nouse are lower championship standard at best.

Can't believe he's still in the team.

[maypaxvobiscum]

Who did he bring down in the box? Shawcross? I remember him taking someone down.

[Red Focus]

Brendan must sit down and  have a long talk with this Skrtel lad. He's been pulling defenders' shirts during corners and set pieces inside our penalty area for the last few games. He was lucky to escape the red cards and giving away unnecessary penalties which would have finished us off. Hope he won't repeat these stupid acts anymore.

[SouthCoastShankly]

Brendan must sit down and  have a long talk with this Skrtel lad. He's been pulling defenders' shirts during corners and set pieces inside our penalty area for the last few games. He was lucky to escape the red cards and giving away unnecessary penalties which would have finished us off. Hope he won't repeat these stupid acts anymore.

How many games this season has he done it? For months now.

There's no chance Rodger's will not have seen it and there is also no chance that referees haven't noticed it. Yet both Rodgers and the referees do nothing about it.

Rodgers will not have a word with him on it until he get's at least warned about it, I am yet to see a single referee talk to him about it - let alone punish him for it. Referees clearly see it as a very minor infraction, whereby all players do it - defender and striker alike.

Until there is a clear sense that it will be punished I hope he continues to do whatever he can get away with.

[kazza]

Brendan must sit down and  have a long talk with this Skrtel lad. He's been pulling defenders' shirts during corners and set pieces inside our penalty area for the last few games. He was lucky to escape the red cards and giving away unnecessary penalties which would have finished us off. Hope he won't repeat these stupid acts anymore.

Problem is if he does not do it he gets beat

[damjan193]

Brendan must sit down and  have a long talk with this Skrtel lad. He's been pulling defenders' shirts during corners and set pieces inside our penalty area for the last few games. He was lucky to escape the red cards and giving away unnecessary penalties which would have finished us off. Hope he won't repeat these stupid acts anymore.

How many games this season has he done it? For months now.

There's no chance Rodger's will not have seen it and there is also no chance that referees haven't noticed it. Yet both Rodgers and the referees do nothing about it.

Rodgers will not have a word with him on it until he get's at least warned about it, I am yet to see a single referee talk to him about it - let alone punish him for it. Referees clearly see it as a very minor infraction, whereby all players do it - defender and striker alike.

Until there is a clear sense that it will be punished I hope he continues to do whatever he can get away with.

I agree. I think what he's doing is pretty much a standard thing for the Premier League. Kompany said so himself when we played against City. It gets a lot of media attention and people start thinking that it's something very wrong.

I have a few problems with Skrtel's performance but the shirt pulling isn't one of them.

[Boocity]

It want jsut the shirt pulling in the Stoke game, he did a judo throw on Shawcross

[Stu the Red]

To be quite honest, I think most people are completely blowing this out of proportion. This is a minor fault in a very average player who costs us a goal pretty much every time he pulls on the shirt.

Shirt pulling I can live with, bad defending, poor decision making and terrible positional play and a lack of arial ability I can't.

The lad is nowhere near good enough and sooner he's out of the side, the quicker we'll improve.

[SouthCoastShankly]

To be quite honest, I think most people are completely blowing this out of proportion. This is a minor fault in a very average player who costs us a goal pretty much every time he pulls on the shirt.

Shirt pulling I can live with, bad defending, poor decision making and terrible positional play and a lack of arial ability I can't.

The lad is nowhere near good enough and sooner he's out of the side, the quicker we'll improve.

Come on, he is a regular in the side this season because he is our best defender.

Skrtel has weaknesses (which player doesn't), primarily a concentration one. But he is comfortable on the ball, strong aerially and wins challenges more often than not. We don't have a better replacement at the club. Toure is nervous under pressure with the ball at his feet. Sakho doesn't have the same passing ability. Agger is superior with the ball but inferior in the air and in terms of strength, and not to mention has a body made of glass.

I don't think he is anywhere near as good as previous defenders like Carragher or Hyypia but to suggest he costs us a goal every time he plays is plainly false. I reiterate, not many would deny he has been our best defender this season.

[Stu the Red]

To be quite honest, I think most people are completely blowing this out of proportion. This is a minor fault in a very average player who costs us a goal pretty much every time he pulls on the shirt.

Shirt pulling I can live with, bad defending, poor decision making and terrible positional play and a lack of arial ability I can't.

The lad is nowhere near good enough and sooner he's out of the side, the quicker we'll improve.

Come on, he is a regular in the side this season because he is our best defender.

Skrtel has weaknesses (which player doesn't), primarily a concentration one. But he is comfortable on the ball, strong aerially and wins challenges more often than not. We don't have a better replacement at the club. Toure is nervous under pressure with the ball at his feet. Sakho doesn't have the same passing ability. Agger is superior with the ball but inferior in the air and in terms of strength, and not to mention has a body made of glass.

I don't think he is anywhere near as good as previous defenders like Carragher or Hyypia but to suggest he costs us a goal every time he plays is plainly false. I reiterate, not many would deny he has been our best defender this season.

In what way is he our best defender because I complete fail to see it. I see a player who is the main culprit in every goal we concede (near enough) and I very rarely if ever see a goal we concede in which he hasn't played a major part through brain dead play.

As for you saying he's comfortable on the ball and strong aerially we must be watching a different player. He's poor on the ball and for you to suggest he's better than Sahko in this department is completely crazy to be quite frank. You also suggest he's strong aerially? Wasn't very strong against City, or Stoke when he he was beaten in the air by Kompany and had a poor attempted header against Charlie Adam!

Against Stoke Mignolet produced a poor kick, which led to Henderson slipping trying to recover possession, Skrtel then fluffed a basic header and then complete failed (again I might add as he's been doing it for years) to close Adam down and allowed a left footer who can shoot, to shoot with his left foot.

Absolutely amateurish play. He also cost us a goal against City and cost us a goal against Cardiff... he also cost us one against Chelsea. In every one of those goals, he's been the player who's made the most basic mistake. Its the same all the time and quite frankly I'm sick to death of the excuses for him, that's not mentioning the own goals, he must up with Rushie for the amount of times he's put the ball in the net.

There is no wonder we don't keep clean sheets with him at the heart of our defence and the sooner he's out the door, the better.

[SouthCoastShankly]

To be quite honest, I think most people are completely blowing this out of proportion. This is a minor fault in a very average player who costs us a goal pretty much every time he pulls on the shirt.

Shirt pulling I can live with, bad defending, poor decision making and terrible positional play and a lack of arial ability I can't.

The lad is nowhere near good enough and sooner he's out of the side, the quicker we'll improve.

Come on, he is a regular in the side this season because he is our best defender.

Skrtel has weaknesses (which player doesn't), primarily a concentration one. But he is comfortable on the ball, strong aerially and wins challenges more often than not. We don't have a better replacement at the club. Toure is nervous under pressure with the ball at his feet. Sakho doesn't have the same passing ability. Agger is superior with the ball but inferior in the air and in terms of strength, and not to mention has a body made of glass.

I don't think he is anywhere near as good as previous defenders like Carragher or Hyypia but to suggest he costs us a goal every time he plays is plainly false. I reiterate, not many would deny he has been our best defender this season.

In what way is he our best defender because I complete fail to see it. I see a player who is the main culprit in every goal we concede (near enough) and I very rarely if ever see a goal we concede in which he hasn't played a major part through brain dead play.

As for you saying he's comfortable on the ball and strong aerially we must be watching a different player. He's poor on the ball and for you to suggest he's better than Sahko in this department is completely crazy to be quite frank. You also suggest he's strong aerially? Wasn't very strong against City, or Stoke when he he was beaten in the air by Kompany and had a poor attempted header against Charlie Adam!

Against Stoke Mignolet produced a poor kick, which led to Henderson slipping trying to recover possession, Skrtel then fluffed a basic header and then complete failed (again I might add as he's been doing it for years) to close Adam down and allowed a left footer who can shoot, to shoot with his left foot.

Absolutely amateurish play. He also cost us a goal against City and cost us a goal against Cardiff... he also cost us one against Chelsea. In every one of those goals, he's been the player who's made the most basic mistake. Its the same all the time and quite frankly I'm sick to death of the excuses for him, that's not mentioning the own goals, he must up with Rushie for the amount of times he's put the ball in the net.

There is no wonder we don't keep clean sheets with him at the heart of our defence and the sooner he's out the door, the better.

I'll fall back on the facts.

By November these were the stats for EPL defenders.



For aerial duels % won for the top 6 sides (ARS, MCY, CHE, LIV, EVE, TOT). The ranks are as follows

1. Vertonghen
2. Cahill
3. Terry
4. Jagielka
5. Ivanovic
6. Skrtel
7. Mertesacker
8. Nastasic
9. Sakho
10. Walker
11. Dawson
12. Sagna
13. Koscielny
14. Toure

Of course the real proof will come at the end of the season, but I am quietly comfortable Skrtel will remain one of the leagues best defenders. Rodgers is a stats man and he will know how effective Skrtel is, hence why he hasn't been dropped since his return to form.

[Stu the Red]

Come on, he is a regular in the side this season because he is our best defender.

Skrtel has weaknesses (which player doesn't), primarily a concentration one. But he is comfortable on the ball, strong aerially and wins challenges more often than not. We don't have a better replacement at the club. Toure is nervous under pressure with the ball at his feet. Sakho doesn't have the same passing ability. Agger is superior with the ball but inferior in the air and in terms of strength, and not to mention has a body made of glass.

I don't think he is anywhere near as good as previous defenders like Carragher or Hyypia but to suggest he costs us a goal every time he plays is plainly false. I reiterate, not many would deny he has been our best defender this season.

In what way is he our best defender because I complete fail to see it. I see a player who is the main culprit in every goal we concede (near enough) and I very rarely if ever see a goal we concede in which he hasn't played a major part through brain dead play.

As for you saying he's comfortable on the ball and strong aerially we must be watching a different player. He's poor on the ball and for you to suggest he's better than Sahko in this department is completely crazy to be quite frank. You also suggest he's strong aerially? Wasn't very strong against City, or Stoke when he he was beaten in the air by Kompany and had a poor attempted header against Charlie Adam!

Against Stoke Mignolet produced a poor kick, which led to Henderson slipping trying to recover possession, Skrtel then fluffed a basic header and then complete failed (again I might add as he's been doing it for years) to close Adam down and allowed a

I'll fall back on the facts.

By November these were the stats for EPL defenders.



For aerial duels % won for the top 6 sides (ARS, MCY, CHE, LIV, EVE, TOT). The ranks are as follows

1. Vertonghen
2. Cahill
3. Terry
4. Jagielka
5. Ivanovic
6. Skrtel
7. Mertesacker
8. Nastasic
9. Sakho
10. Walker
11. Dawson
12. Sagna
13. Koscielny
14. Toure

Of course the real proof will come at the end of the season, but I am quietly comfortable Skrtel will remain one of the leagues best defenders. Rodgers is a stats man and he will know how effective Skrtel is, hence why he hasn't been dropped since his return to form.

[/quote]

Absolutely ridiculous p*ss weak arguement from someone who shows in just about every post a lack of knowledge.

I'm only going to list a couple of recent goals we conceded due to Skrtel's complete and utter lack of basic defensive ability... because I can't really be bothered wasting my time trying to explain the basics to someone who just thinks made up stats are the answer.

For the fun of it though, i'll list a few and if you decide you want to learn then you can look the goals up on youtube yourself... if not you can simply keep burying your head in the clouds and believe in things that are wrong. To call Skrtel one of the best in the league though... next you'll be telling me Lucas, Johnson and Allen are world class and Suarez is awful!

Firstly Adam's goal against Stoke. Mignolet kicks it short and down the middle when the team isn't set up. This caused a massive problem, it was a poor kick. Skrtel then has a chance to win a header properly, he makes a bit of a meal of it, but gets away with it due to Henderson being able to pick the ball up, not in an ideal position and Henderson makes a minor error, however, due to Gerrard's loss of footing Adam is then allowed to pick the ball up. So straight away, Skrtel is involved ina passage of poor play... but I could have forgiven that had he simply closed down Adam. He didn't, he never closes anyone down ever unless they're in the box... sometimes then he even backs off... so he let a left footer who has a good shot, shoot, from 25 yards unpressurised... That, is absolutely amateurish. Most Sunday league players would have the brain to not allow that to happen, so why does a player who's paid £70,000 a week find it hard to grasp time and time again? Had Skrtel closed Adam down he may never have got the shot away, had he closed him down and Adam still gets the shot away then he's not to blame totally for the goal. But he done nothing, and we conceded.

Then there was Eto'o's goal vs Chelsea. There was a complete balls up at left back by Agger, Sahko then goes across. Sahko makes an error by going to ground quickly, and Skrtel completely fails to shut off the space. Again, its basic basic play that amateurs can grasp, yet he can't. He left a 15 yard gap for Eto'o to run into. Had he closed off the space and gone to the near post when Sahko goes across he's then freeing himself of any blame. He would have again done his job, but he didn't and it cost us a goal. The thing with this is its not a one off, its easy basic team work, one goes, so does the other. He gets it wrong so many times a match its no wonder we're conceding more than a goal a game.

Against City, the first one was a basic header, granted, he was beaten by Kompany so I can sort of forgive that, its not like an Aaron Lennon type done him, he was done by a quality player... so I won't hold him completely responsible for that, although had he tried to win the ball instead of wrestle the outcomemay have been different.

For the second goal he was quite simply a f**king disgrace and had I been on the pitch on his team he'd have gotten a punch for making such a pathetic, stupid error that again an amateur player wouldn't make.

Skrtel runs across the pitch (horizontally) for that goal allowing Navas to take himself and Sahko out of the game with one pass. Had Skrtel ran back in a straight line towards his own goal, Navas wouldn't have been able to play that ball to Negredo as he'd have been forced wide and probably had to take Sahko on... Instead, Skrtel decides he wants to take himself and Sahko out of the game (Sahko had a great position until Skrtel moves) then all of a sudden he's left exposed. Negredo gets the ball and then Mignolet ***** up. The goal though was mostly Skrtel's fault because of his disgraceful decision to run across the pitch and f*ck his team mate up. Had he done an absolute basic in the game, Negredo doesn't have the chance to shoot. Simple as that.

The goal against Cardiff at Anfield, he lost his man off a set piece AGAIN...

I could go on, but I can't really be bothered pulling apart 20 odd goals, I'm sure when I said he costs us every goal there is one or two where blame on him is minimal, but the majority he is the main culprit. Besides, I really don't have all night. Look the goals up on youtube and you'll see my point exactly.

Your stats don't show things like the above... but then I wouldn't expect them too as they come from someone with absolutely zero understanding of the game and thinks every player Liverpool have is world class. Put Suarez in Any other top five side in the league and they would be top. Take him out of ours, we'd be lucky to be top ten. Simple as that.