Liverpool FC Forum

by **GYBS** » Wed Feb 11, 2009 2:12 pm

yeah but the levels would mean nowhere near they are now thou and would mean clubs wouldnt be able to get the best players anymore , prem clubs started to become the best and biggest in europe once those inital limitations where lifted and the best players came to the prem - take that away and the prem just goes downhill and even the best british players would look to move abroad like the used to as well .

And the limit being removed wasnt a reason for us not winning the prem .

by **lakes10** » Wed Feb 11, 2009 3:20 pm

GYBS wrote:yeah but the levels would mean nowhere near they are now thou and would mean clubs wouldnt be able to get the best players anymore , prem clubs started to become the best and biggest in europe once those inital limitations where lifted and the best players came to the prem - take that away and the prem just goes downhill and even the best british players would look to move abroad like the used to as well .

And the limit being removed wasnt a reason for us not winning the prem .

well a limit will happen one day but on how many it will be is another matter.

British teams done very well before the limit was lifted.
This is what starts to wind me up is that so much focus is put on the CL that winning the prem is left out, in fact i dont care if we dont win theCL for another 10 years aslong as we win the Prem a few times in that 10 years.

Non English managers still not get the FA Cup, in fact one was hread to say that it was unfair that such big teams as Liverpool and Man U had to go and play teams like Kidderminster. to me that shows a total lack of understanding of what Football (English Football) is about.
The idea that a load of English non League could be seen to beat the best players in the world is not right in some non English managers view.

(oops gone off on a rant)

by **GYBS** » Wed Feb 11, 2009 3:30 pm

The prob is mate the CL is the big trophy - its the one everyone wants - yeah the league is outstanding to win but many people just use it to get to the CL as there where the top teams are the the big money is - hence why i think at some point in the future there will be a european league . British teams did nothing really in europe after the ban was lifted up until 1999 - so 9 odd years of nothing . Old traditionalists will always love the FA Cup but these days for the big clubs it is more of an distraction and means more games to play . The game has moved on a lot and wont be allowed to move backwards . The clubs need the big money of the CL and for that they need the best players in the world - vicious and unfair circle i know but thats the reality of the game these days .

by **loopyliverpool** » Wed Feb 11, 2009 3:51 pm

I think a quota system is an excellent idea but has to be agreed by all football associations, which will prove tricky. Back in our 'glory' days we had a team winning who were all British. If the same rules apply to all nations I cant see the problem. I cant see how it wouldn't nurture new English/British talent, contrary to Arsene Wenger's views. This fear about not attracting the best players in the world is frankly misplaced. I also think the money being paid to the top players is obscene which is all part of the same problem. More money needs to be filtered down to the grassroots rather than given to 'overrated' players to buy another Bentley. As much as I would like to see the likes of Kaka playing in the Premiership I think there is something wholly insidious about paying players hundreds of thousands a week when lesser clubs are struggling for exisitance! If we continue on the path we're on we will end up with one large European Super League because that's all the 'viewing' public will want to see. A quota system of some sort would surely help and indeed a draft system, similar to the NFL one, where the best player goes to the weakest team etc. Im in favour of some measures being introduced where good coaching and management are rewarded instead of rewarding those with the deepest pockets!

by **GYBS** » Wed Feb 11, 2009 3:54 pm

It will never happen thou and i for one am glad of that fact .

by **lakes10** » Wed Feb 11, 2009 4:03 pm

GYBS wrote:The prob is mate the CL is the big trophy - its the one everyone wants - yeah the league is outstanding to win but many people just use it to get to the CL as there where the top teams are the the big money is - hence why i think at some point in the future there will be a european league . British teams did nothing really in europe after the ban was lifted up until 1999 - so 9 odd years of nothing . Old traditionalists will always love the FA Cup but these days for the big clubs it is more of an distraction and means more games to play . The game has moved on a lot and wont be allowed to move backwards . The clubs need the big money of the CL and for that they need the best players in the world - vicious and unfair circle i know but thats the reality of the game these days .

The thing is mate the rest of the world if getting fed up with all their top players coming to the Prem, there are where were a few years ago. out FA has some power but not that much, the law will get changed so that it make it harder for English teams to buy non English players, It has not gone down that well that our English teams seem to have a hold of the CL by using non English players.

by **SouthCoastShankly** » Wed Feb 11, 2009 4:07 pm

GYBS wrote:Think this is dodgy dangerous ground for the premier league at the moment .

The reason why there is so much money going around and the premier league us the best and most watched in the world is because the best footballers in the world want to come and play ere for the big teams - it has made us into a force in europe . They start putting on caps then big players may well start to move to spain or italy instead and the league will become less attractive and a vicicous circle will start . and yes prices for english lads will shout though the roof where you will prob find players like carlton cole going for the same price as torres .a change prob does need to be done but they have to be careful .

I disagree.

Firstly the quota system is being initiated by FIFA therefore the other European leagues will have to be considering this themselves as well.

Secondly, ask yourself why all the "best players" that money is being spent on are non-British? It is because leagues such as Spain and Italy have such a high percentage of home grown players playing regularly for their local clubs. These leagues consistently produce quality players for club and country whereas British top flight team buy instead of invest in youth.

by **GYBS** » Wed Feb 11, 2009 4:12 pm

they wont be able to change the rules that much due to one thing - the fair trade act which means you can employ whoever you want as long as they have a work permit . Platini can try as much as he likes but it wont be allowed to go through the European Human Rights court . Yeah they can change who you have in your squads during a CL campaign but not to much of a degree due to the European Laws so things wont change dramatically . If the other countries want the best players then thats up to them to make their leagues and club more attractive to players . Even when other clubs where winning the CLs how many of their team had foriegn players ? madrid is full of them same with barce and milan and inter and juve . They all have a sprinkling of their own countries best players but mainly the superstars are foriegn .

by **GYBS** » Wed Feb 11, 2009 4:17 pm

SouthCoastShankly wrote:
GYBS wrote:Think this is dodgy dangerous ground for the premier league at the moment .

The reason why there is so much money going around and the premier league us the best and most watched in the world is because the best footballers in the world want to come and play ere for the big teams - it has made us into a force in europe . They start putting on caps then big players may well start to move to spain or italy instead and the league will become less attractive and a vicicous circle will start . and yes prices for english lads will shout though the roof where you will prob find players like carlton cole going for the same price as torres .a change prob does need to be done but they have to be careful .

I disagree.

Firstly the quota system is being initiated by FIFA therefore the other European leagues will have to be considering this themselves as well.

Secondly, ask yourself why all the "best players" that money is being spent on are non-British? It is because leagues such as Spain and Italy have such a high percentage of home grown players playing regularly for their local clubs. These leagues consistently produce quality players for club and country whereas British top flight team buy instead of invest in youth.

But which teams are currently more successful in europe ? At the moment Liverpool Man Utd and Chelsea plus to a lesser degree arsenal. And each one of those teams has a couple of english players in there team that are off high quality and would be wanted by most of europe - Gerrard,Carra,Shrek,Jar jar ,Fat Frank and Cry boy its only Arsenal that dont have this strong english contingence .

So which teams are doing it the best way ? i would suggest the englsih teams at present.

by **SouthCoastShankly** » Wed Feb 11, 2009 4:18 pm

GYBS wrote:they wont be able to change the rules that much due to one thing - the fair trade act which means you can employ whoever you want as long as they have a work permit . Platini can try as much as he likes but it wont be allowed to go through the European Human Rights court . Yeah they can change who you have in your squads during a CL campaign but not to much of a degree due to the European Laws so things wont change dramatically . If the other countries want the best players then thats up to them to make their leagues and club more attractive to players . Even when other clubs where winning the CLs how many of their team had foriegn players ? madrid is full of them same with barce and milan and inter and juve . They all have a sprinkling of their own countries best players but mainly the superstars are foriegn .

You wrong, of course.

The limitation of the human rights act meant that FIFA could not enforce the quota. It does not mean that clubs cannot voluntarily abide by the quota, hence why they have already had a meeting on the subject.

Premier league clubs see that by enforcing a quota it not only protects the local community by investing in youth players from surrounding areas but also its make financial sense. If all PL clubs adhere to a quota, less money will be spent on foreign players, which effectively means more money being invested into local academies. The benefits are clear, as long as all clubs agree.

by **GYBS** » Wed Feb 11, 2009 4:23 pm

And do you really think that the clubs will enforce a strict quota on what players are bought and played ? do you really think the likes of the big 4 and others that rely on foriegn players will want a drastic change that could easily effect them either challenging for the title or trophies or going for europe or survival in the prem which in turn will effect the amount of money they make ? if there is a change it will be a minor insignificant one that wont effect on who they buy . No club in the prem will take any other risk and i wouldnt want liverpool doing that . While we do have two of the best english players around we also have some of the best foriegn ones around and for me and the club the bottom line is success in any mean possible - if that means the best foriegn players then so be it .And all the top clubs already invest millions into their academies but if the local talent isnt there then they cant magically produce them . The game is now an instant results game - clubs no longer have the time to nuture young players (esp not the big 4 ) as the risks are far too great hence buying players that will give them or help them towards instance success.

by **lakes10** » Wed Feb 11, 2009 4:29 pm

well it Liverpool V England to night so lets see how we do.

see it should not be like that, we should be able to say its Liverpool v Spain with all our best player making up the England team.

by **GYBS** » Wed Feb 11, 2009 4:33 pm

can onyl see a spanish win tonight and nothing else - the spanish footballers far superior to the english team without Rooney and gerrard .

by **loopyliverpool** » Wed Feb 11, 2009 4:43 pm

If clubs are forced to rely on raising there own talent through academies etc. this will only have advantages for the game in this country. There needs to be an even playing field where all clubs can compete. More money needs to be invested into a national academy too. It has been joyful watching Gerrard and Carragher (and Owen before he left) come up through the ranks and perform at the highest level, they were given the opportunity. Opportunities these days seem rather scarce. If clubs were forced to play British players we might one day be able to field a genuine left footed, world class winger/midfielder for England. I think the idea needs to be embraced rather than feared!

by **GYBS** » Wed Feb 11, 2009 4:50 pm

National Academy ? Winger for England ? Who cares about England football team - Its Liverpool Football Club i care about and pretty much the majority of Liverpool Fans .

There is an even field to compete - any team can try and buy any player .

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