Liverpool FC Forum

by **GYBS** » Mon Jan 05, 2009 8:40 pm

keane still got plenty of time to contribute this season and think he will . He was never worth 20 mil but that was what was required to get him . Wish we had of spent ten mil on podolski instead but nothing we can do about it now apart from support and back keane . He will play his part in what i hope is a successful season .

by **bigmick** » Mon Jan 05, 2009 9:41 pm

On a slight tangent with Keane, I wonder how people in the cold light of day view his signing? It's been said before that rafa has the fantastic quality of being a lucky manager (something which I wholeheartedly agree with) and when you look at his signings in the Summer last year, it would be hard to argue.

That we spent 28 million quid combined on Dossena and Keane is a matter of fact (and no I haven't seen the contracts, I wasn't present when they were signed etc but we can take it as a "presumed" fact anyway). Now most people have a view on Dossena (I personally think he is by a distance the managers worst signing) but few would agree that today he is either worth 7.5 million, or indeed was a good buy. Given the fact that Insua is obviously a fairly decent prospect and quite possibly better than that, unless he has developed out of all recognition over the last couple of months it's hard to see really why we needed the Italian. Particularly when you consider that Insua is already a better full-back than the "fishmonger", it looks all the more baffling.

In the case of Keane, we can conclude from the way that Rafa has handled him that he doesn't see him as a lone front man. You might also come to the conclusion that he doesn't see him as one of two either based on the last couple of weeks, but whatever, once again it's hard to argue he has either done fantastically well or was value at 20.5 million pounds. Some of us firmly believe that even though the Irishman was way overpriced, had we handled him better we would have got more return in terms of performance but that's kind of by the by really. Now Torres is back, and given the fact that Gerrard is quite simply undroppable (and in all probability playing in Keane's position while he's at it) it's hard to see Robbie getting too many games. This is particularly the case if we are going to leave him out when he scored two in three, so the question begs to be asked, why did we sign him then?

Now in the case of Insua, you could argue that he's suddenly got it as young players do sometimes. As such, you could argue that how was Rafa to know? We needed a left back to cover for the inevitable injuries to Aurelio and he simply bought the best one he could find. In the case of Gerrard being quite good though as an advanced midfielder/support striker, even those who believe he is "wasted" there and a better player in a different position would hardly deny that our captain was going to be anything but pretty good if he played there this season. This is particularly the case when you think we played him there during the "seeing of the light" period last season and formed a "match made in heaven" with Torres.

So now we arrive at a situation where we are top of the league and in with a great shout of winning it, despite spending 28 million quid on a fullback who is absolute garbage, and a striker who we won't play when he's scoring, and who can't get into the team if everyones fit. Were we not top of the league etc, there might be one or two questions by now about the transfers. Maybe's we should wait till we've won the league before we flog them off. That way, if we get 3 mill off some mugs for Dossena and 10 mill for Keane, nobody will give a feck about the 15 mill we've just spunked.

Lucky Manager

You decide :;):

by **Madmax** » Mon Jan 05, 2009 9:54 pm

interesting post mick. I really doesnt make sense at all considering why we have bought keane. Last season when we played really well with stevie and torres combining and winning so easily showed what is our best formation. But the arrival of keane made some think where the heck was rafa going to play him. Clearly shows us he cant play as a lone striker. Playing with torres we cant realyl judge that because they have not played enough games together. Also i cant see rafa setting up that sort of formation. I agree with what you said about dossena.
maybe if we do win the title and sell them off no one will realise that yes we did waste alot of dollaz on them.

by **tubby** » Mon Jan 05, 2009 9:59 pm

dawson99 wrote:Mancs and Chelsea are an ageing team. Look at chelsea's team, the core is 30+, same with Manure, esp since Nani isn't doing it yet, Hargreaves was not a good buy and Anderson, though class is lacking at times. Berbatov has scored the same as our Robbie... so yeah, I do not think the cheatski's and Manures of the world are as strong as last season.

I think that maybe going a bit too far. Utd have plenty of youth. Anderson is only 21 or so isnt he? Plus Tevez is still mid 20s to to mention Rooney. Rafael is just a kid too. And didnt they just sign 2 highly rated youngsters for something like 16Mil for the pair?

Utd and Chelsea have more strength in depth but that cannot be measured now you have to wait till the end of the season, or at least another month or so.

by **Fo Dne** » Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:01 pm

DanAn wrote:
Fo Dne wrote:
Judge wrote:NO - you substantiate the claim of a weak league please

i'd love to see how you justify that statement in your previous post!!

(also did you go to the match at the weekend - i did)

Wow, been to a match have we? First time for everything.

Man Utd, Chelsea and Arsenal aren't as good as in previous seasons, we're slightly better and the gap is closed for the time being. United and Chelsea still have far better squads and teams and the end of the season will reflect this.

United have played all of last years top ten away from home. We haven't, we drop stupid home points, the only games United have lost is away against top 4/5 sides.

Judging by the results and performances you see that despite the standard of the league increasing slightly, the best sides, with the exception of Liverpool have all took at least one step backwards therefore resulting in a weaker league... in its own way. Liverpool will not win the league this season because of one man, Benitez. Simple as that.

Curious as to how you can say Chelsea and Manchester United are weaker considering they both spent a load of cash.

Which of Chealsea's summer signings weakend the team....Was it Bosingwa, Deco or perhaps it was the coach Scolari? Let not forget Anelka Either I know he was signed in January but he still deserves some of the blame.

As for ManU......evidently they spent somewhere in the vicinity of 30m in summer onM Berbatov only weakened the team....Wow and I thought Dossena was a stuff up.

Chelsea's choice of manager has weakened the side considerabley. They hadn't lost at home for four years, they've lost twice there this season. They aren't the same side as the last few years, if they were I am telling you now they would have took their chances to go top instead of fluffing them. They are clearly alot less efficient than in past seasons.

As for United, you're correct, they've signed Berbatov. They've also seen Ronaldo's form drop immensely, they've had inconsistency at right back and van der Sar who was already past his best is yet another year older and showing more signs of decline. The Berbatov signing has kept Tevez out of the side aswell who is a far, far better alround player than the lazy Bulgarian will ever be.

by **metalhead** » Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:04 pm

maguskwt wrote:
metalhead wrote:Spot on Stu.

The way Keane is treated by the manager is harsh.

awwww... poor keane...

poor me, he should played me instead

by **neil** » Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:08 pm

but chelsea were wonderfully untouchable superflyguys for 50 years on the run till we beat them, now they're pi55 poor, man u won 2 trophies last year then added £30 million worth of goal poachin "magic" till we beat beat em, now they're the worst man u outfit since remi moses signed. Happy clapper alert!! We're a fantastic footy team still top of the league (after xmas) and havent we played all the top 10 away apart from manu? yes us, and now............enter Fernando Torres, some of you dont deserve it.

by **bigmick** » Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:16 pm

neil wrote:
but chelsea were wonderfully untouchable superflyguys for 50 years on the run till we beat them, now they're pi55 poor, man u won 2 trophies last year then added £30 million worth of goal poachin "magic" till we beat beat em, now they're the worst man u outfit since remi moses signed. Happy clapper alert!! We're a fantastic footy team still top of the league (after xmas) and havent we played all the top 10 away apart from manu? yes us, and now............enter Fernando Torres, some of you dont deserve it.

What a strange post that is Neil. Chelsea p!ss poor? Man Utd the worst Man U outfit since Remi Moses signed? All that other stuff because some people venture an opinion that the league is possibly not as strong as it has been in the past

Some of us don't deserve it? Deserve what exactly?

Don't know about a "happy clapper" alert. Gross over-reaction alert might be closer. Very very odd this place sometimes it really is. People come on here to talk about football, then seemingly don't like like it when someone talks about football. It really is very strange.

by **neil** » Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:34 pm

well if your gonna attempt ridicule try this on

bigmicks team

by **Dundalk** » Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:37 pm

Ouch

by **bigmick** » Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:48 pm

Ah good one that. I knew about the Robert Earnshaw one, but amazed that I mentioned Morientes :laugh:

I can only think that must have been in response to the fact we were almost on the point of signing him. Ledley King I've always rated (shame about his fitness these days, he'll end up a cripple) while Scott Parker, SWP, Pennant and the like can be seen four years later to be average/reasonable picks. Morientes is the surprising one to me out of the bunch. It's probably worth noting as well that that was in the midst of a period where we reportedly had no money.

Anyways schmenyways, good find. I did say in though in a thread a couple of days ago that I'd avocated selling Gerrard at the time, and was unequivical that I was totally wrong. This may be the tthread where Leon did his hahahahahahahahahahah for the whole page, but I haven't read it yet. I did also say in another thread that I thought Pelligrino was an "excellent signing" who would "come good", have a look for that one too it's out there. There are numerous others, and some aren't four years old either.

That doesn't though change the fact that your post was a very odd one, and infact I'm not really sure I understand the point of you posting this one of mine up now. Are we using the fact the fact that some of the things I advocate four seasons ago have been proven to be less than fantastic to justify your post of ten minutes ago? Ok fair enough, still think it's a bit strange, but fair enough.

If at any point you fancy debating the points that were raised visa-vis the league and it's relative strength this season, I'll be interested in your opinions. Equally, if you fancy having a debate about my post of four seasons ago (still can't believe the Morientes one, now that is shocking) that'll be cool too. As it is though, it looks like we are going to have to agree to differ on your earlier post. No bother though, football forums are all football opinions.

by **bigmick** » Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:51 pm

And Leons hahahahahahahah post is on there, about four below mine. No disrespect to him at all, but as I said the other day he's never posted a truer word on here. Looks like it might be an interesting thread to browse through actually, at least I hope I got my ridiculousness out of the way on the first page. I'll give it a read through :laugh:

by **bigmick** » Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:56 pm

Well feck me it looks like I wasn't advocating selling Gerrard after all, could've sworn I did. Maybe that was later.

by **bigmick** » Mon Jan 05, 2009 11:01 pm

Well I definately advocated selling Gerrard somewhere (or maybe I just considered it but didn't actually post it up) but it's not in that thread. As I said the other day, I was totally wrong as he is currently IMHO the best player in the World. Good thread that one though, and probably contains the first discalimer the forum had ever seen when I said at the start of the first post "I'm not saying we should sell Gerrard". One of the good things about the thread is that people talk sensibly about football, brought the memories flooding back. There were some good posters around then.

Still can't believe Moreintes for 10 million though, fecking unreal that

by **Cool Hand Luke** » Mon Jan 05, 2009 11:06 pm

There’s some classic Leon in that thread, quality.

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