Lando_Griffin wrote:I think most members on here know my stance regarding Sh*tski (there's another clue!) and Man U( are sh*te)d. I would rather LFC disband than become entwined with dodgy tycoons. Abrahamo-b*tch is just a punk who cares about the people of Russia like I care about Saddam Hussein. The difference is, he extolls money from these poor surfs, thereby contributing to their poverty, and I don't. If ever there was a team that needed a good slap, its CFC. Not only are they owned by a git, managed by a pr*ck and run by an ex-scummer, they are also to blame for the hole in the O-zone layer. B*stards.
The Ace1983 wrote:Old Chinese Proverb:-
"Money, money money, it's so funny, in a rich man's world"
Ok, so it may not be an old chinese proverb, but it is a phrase that offers more than a catchy tune and memory of when a good fashion sense was more of a luxurious rarety than a necessity. There is something profound in this phrase. Primarily, it is telling us that this is indeed a "rich man's world". Today, in football, if you don't have a rich man with plenty of dosh to support you, you can't survive at the top of the league. Of course you need more than that, like top quality players, a good manager and a large international fanbase, not to mention a loyal and fanatical home following. But mon£y is the big "must have". Unless you are very lucky, it is impossible to obtain the creme de la creme of players without $$$ these days. Football has changed in the sense that you can no longer rely on your acadamies to produce 11 or more top quality PFA POTY winning players, when the clubs with the cash can just go and buy 11 World POTY winners and can scoure the globe and buy the best individuals from a host of acadamies. Of course you have to invest in tomorrow and it was not so long ago that I praised Rafa on this site for his commitment to the future by bringing in the likes of Carson, Hobbs, Barragan and so many more. I also believe that Benitez has the managerial ability to shop sensibley, an attribute that very few managers have (Wenger being the only other that I can think of, off the top of my head) which has seen the likes of Alonso, Reina, Sissoko and Zenden turn up for very little when weighed against departure income. So although it is best to bring as much young potential into the club, you cannot rely solely on those youngsters fulfilling their potential, look what happened to Le Tallec. It is in this instance where you NEED money. Free transfers and bargain basements are often risks and so many don't work out for various reasons.
We do seem to forget sometimes the amount of money we have spent at this club. Although Cisse was our top spending at £14m, we bought players like Diouf and Diao for a combined £15m, and already this year we have spent around £20m on Crouch, Reina and Sissoko alone. We are talking about splashing another £12m or so on Owen, and Rafa still wants a centre half and a right winger. Throw in Morientes and Carson as well as all the youngsters and this years spending could excede £50m give or take. But we do have one of the richest chairmen in the league with Mr Moores, his family being worth at least £1.2b which isn't chicken feed if you get my drift. Whether we like it or not, we are one of the richies and clubs like Bolton, Charlton, Middlesborough, Man City, Tottenham and even Everton are incredibly envious of our money because to them, we are big spenders who use our financial muscle to bully them out of deals and optain players that they cannot. Our reputation as one of the best (in my opinion, "THE" best) teams in the world helps but you can't go up to a Brazilian primadonna and say "how would you like to play for us, we can't pay you more than a few quid a week, but we've got all the history you could ever want!". That may be an exageration but in this game, money talks.
I'd prefer a footballing world where money wasn't an issue to anyone. Transfer caps or a drafting system where acadamies became independant, and players were traded instead of bought, much like the systems employed by the NFL and the NBA in the states. But while there is so much money to be made, this will never happen. And until it does, it will always be the case that more money = more medals, except in some rare cases. Which means that now, after Abramovich, it is no longer a case of "buying the league", but more a fact that to compete in said league, you need money. They don't come much better off than Roman or the troll that now owns Man Ure and eventually the Premiership will become a Billionaires playground where Arabian Sheiks, American Business Tycoons, South American Drug Lords and Japanesse Consortioms come to spend their ca$h and have fun. I'd hate to see Liverpool not be able to compete with all of these teams just because of our history, our morality and the fact that we like to be different. All of these things are good qualities, but if it cost this club its' chance of success, I'd drop them fast.
For now though, I don't think we have to worry. If Rafa can work a couple of miracles, we get the rub of the green, some good decisions and some favourable ties, we should do well and we will have closed the gap. But when a couple more of these billionaires turn up and make the task impossible, I don't want to be playing catch up. A good business sense is only worth having if the business is worth having too (in the Premiership at least).
As for Chel$ki, yes, they probably bought the league, but so what. If it makes them happy then bully for them. I'm far more concerned with Liverpool, rather than worrying about out opponents. If we've got cash, great, spend it wisely. If we don't, then get some fast, or it is bye bye title hopes.
Red Red Tom wrote:The Ace1983 wrote:Old Chinese Proverb:-
"Money, money money, it's so funny, in a rich man's world"
Ok, so it may not be an old chinese proverb, but it is a phrase that offers more than a catchy tune and memory of when a good fashion sense was more of a luxurious rarety than a necessity. There is something profound in this phrase. Primarily, it is telling us that this is indeed a "rich man's world". Today, in football, if you don't have a rich man with plenty of dosh to support you, you can't survive at the top of the league. Of course you need more than that, like top quality players, a good manager and a large international fanbase, not to mention a loyal and fanatical home following. But mon£y is the big "must have". Unless you are very lucky, it is impossible to obtain the creme de la creme of players without $$$ these days. Football has changed in the sense that you can no longer rely on your acadamies to produce 11 or more top quality PFA POTY winning players, when the clubs with the cash can just go and buy 11 World POTY winners and can scoure the globe and buy the best individuals from a host of acadamies. Of course you have to invest in tomorrow and it was not so long ago that I praised Rafa on this site for his commitment to the future by bringing in the likes of Carson, Hobbs, Barragan and so many more. I also believe that Benitez has the managerial ability to shop sensibley, an attribute that very few managers have (Wenger being the only other that I can think of, off the top of my head) which has seen the likes of Alonso, Reina, Sissoko and Zenden turn up for very little when weighed against departure income. So although it is best to bring as much young potential into the club, you cannot rely solely on those youngsters fulfilling their potential, look what happened to Le Tallec. It is in this instance where you NEED money. Free transfers and bargain basements are often risks and so many don't work out for various reasons.
We do seem to forget sometimes the amount of money we have spent at this club. Although Cisse was our top spending at £14m, we bought players like Diouf and Diao for a combined £15m, and already this year we have spent around £20m on Crouch, Reina and Sissoko alone. We are talking about splashing another £12m or so on Owen, and Rafa still wants a centre half and a right winger. Throw in Morientes and Carson as well as all the youngsters and this years spending could excede £50m give or take. But we do have one of the richest chairmen in the league with Mr Moores, his family being worth at least £1.2b which isn't chicken feed if you get my drift. Whether we like it or not, we are one of the richies and clubs like Bolton, Charlton, Middlesborough, Man City, Tottenham and even Everton are incredibly envious of our money because to them, we are big spenders who use our financial muscle to bully them out of deals and optain players that they cannot. Our reputation as one of the best (in my opinion, "THE" best) teams in the world helps but you can't go up to a Brazilian primadonna and say "how would you like to play for us, we can't pay you more than a few quid a week, but we've got all the history you could ever want!". That may be an exageration but in this game, money talks.
I'd prefer a footballing world where money wasn't an issue to anyone. Transfer caps or a drafting system where acadamies became independant, and players were traded instead of bought, much like the systems employed by the NFL and the NBA in the states. But while there is so much money to be made, this will never happen. And until it does, it will always be the case that more money = more medals, except in some rare cases. Which means that now, after Abramovich, it is no longer a case of "buying the league", but more a fact that to compete in said league, you need money. They don't come much better off than Roman or the troll that now owns Man Ure and eventually the Premiership will become a Billionaires playground where Arabian Sheiks, American Business Tycoons, South American Drug Lords and Japanesse Consortioms come to spend their ca$h and have fun. I'd hate to see Liverpool not be able to compete with all of these teams just because of our history, our morality and the fact that we like to be different. All of these things are good qualities, but if it cost this club its' chance of success, I'd drop them fast.
For now though, I don't think we have to worry. If Rafa can work a couple of miracles, we get the rub of the green, some good decisions and some favourable ties, we should do well and we will have closed the gap. But when a couple more of these billionaires turn up and make the task impossible, I don't want to be playing catch up. A good business sense is only worth having if the business is worth having too (in the Premiership at least).
As for Chel$ki, yes, they probably bought the league, but so what. If it makes them happy then bully for them. I'm far more concerned with Liverpool, rather than worrying about out opponents. If we've got cash, great, spend it wisely. If we don't, then get some fast, or it is bye bye title hopes.
Good post. I do know that we spend a lot compared to most Premiership clubs, and yes it is an unfair advantage - however it isn't half as exagerated as Chelsea's. Part of the issue with Chelsea is that it all happened so fast. If Mourhinho had bought players over 4-5 years, then fine - he's built the side. The good things for us about him building it so fast is that he's missed the foundations - and the Chelsea empire will come crashing down about Ambramovich's ears.
My other qualm with Chelsea is the source of the money. I don't want to begin ranting again like I did last night, but I am a left-leaning guy (I suppose its kind of a pre-requisite to being 18 these days though), and I can't stand the fact that although everybody knows Abramovich's is just blood money - they gloss over it like it doesn't matter. I'm sure it matters to the people who paid for it.
Rant over once again - Good post, good points, good debate.
NiftyNeil wrote:I don't know how Chelski fans can hold their heads up high after winning the league in those circumstances. They have clearly cornered the market as far as world stars are concerned. They have the cash to buy whoever they want and are buying the in-form players.
I know Roman has more money than he knows what to do with it, but by the time Chelsea have won 18 league titles; 5 European Cups; 3 UEFA cups; 6 FA cups; 7 League cups; 2 Super cups, he will be skint.
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