Liverpool FC Forum

by **red till i die!!** » Mon May 07, 2012 8:57 pm

ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Mon May 07, 2012 8:41 pm wrote:
red till i die!! » Mon May 07, 2012 7:25 pm wrote:being honest we could do with shipping out over half the squad.the ones i would keep are,
reina,johnson,skyrtel,agger,enrique,gerrard,carroll,suarez,kelly,coates and lucas.
this lot needs to be sent packing kuyt,maxi,aurelio,carragher and spearing.
id not turn down a reasonable offer for henderson,downing,bellamy or adam.
big earners like cole and aqua need to be sorted to free up wages for replacements.
we have young players also in shelvey,wilson and pacheco and if they dont fit into the setup then their futures should also be looked at.

the big question is who will be brought in to replace them and that depends on how much fenway are willing to pump in and what kind of wages they are willing to offer.
if they are willing to go out on a limb then quality signings will be made but if they dont then we can expect to be raiding lower teams for their talent and id be surprised if we dont end up with the likes of bent,defoe and dempsey coming in combined with maybe a bosman like hoilett.im not knocking them as they would be much better than what we are losing but they arent title winning players and doubts would remain as to whether they could even push for a top 4 considering arsenal,spurs and the chavs will strenghten with real quality.
major changes are needed in the summer if we are going to stand any chance of a better campaign next season.
the bulk of our business needs to be done sharply before the euros and definately before the team resumes for preseason.last season we fooked up in going through a preseason where we played nothing like the team we started the league with and were always on the back foot.
savage mistakes were made last summer and for the sake of the club they cannot be repeated

we need a good pre season where we actually start running cricket scores up against some of the lesser sides. we seem to have carried our lethargy from pre season into our last couple of league campaigns resulting in poor starts and putting us on the back foot and under pressure almost from the off.
as you say lets get our new signings in early and lets start next season with a purpose.
i dont think that will happen though, i think we`ll spend half the summer looking for a replacement for comoli.

there is so many rumours and speculation floating around regarding us and what we will do but one of them is that louis van gaal is the one thats earmarked to replace comoli.
interesting choice imo and he has to have plenty of knowledge and contacts but id prefer if we did install him he would appeal to a much wider base of mature players as thats what we need to dig us out of this hole we are currently in.
im not against signing youth but in our situation we could be years waiting for these lads to step up and change our fortune.

by **Benny The Noon** » Mon May 07, 2012 8:59 pm

Van Gaal is the worst possible appointment as a DoF .

Truely horrendous person who will rip the club apart

by **ycsatbjywtbiastkamb** » Mon May 07, 2012 9:07 pm

cant say i know that much about him, i remember him at ajax, barcelona and bayern but i dont know if he`s argumentative or anything like that.
i dont even know what style of footy his teams play.

by **Benny The Noon** » Mon May 07, 2012 9:12 pm

Read up about him.

He is like the Woof of football

by **red till i die!!** » Mon May 07, 2012 9:12 pm

Benny The Noon » Mon May 07, 2012 8:59 pm wrote:Van Gaal is the worst possible appointment as a DoF .

Truely horrendous person who will rip the club apart

its only speculation benny.
what makes you form that opinion of him? and what other club/s has he ripped apart?.
i know of his spat with cruyff but even then he had the backing of the rest of the board and it could be just bad blood between the two or a difference of opinion.

by **friendlyguy33** » Mon May 07, 2012 9:13 pm

I don't know about Van Gaal but I'm puzzled by Gary Gillespie and others who have commented on LFCTV tonight about how much the players will learn from losing and that you can't always win everything? I can't imagine that Gary really thought this about losing when he was at the club in the 80s. What have Everton learnt since their cup final defeat to Chelsea in 2009? How much good did it do them in the semi final this year?

I mean seven of the team that started on saturday are over 25 if they can't put it together in a cup final now I doubt that the experience on saturday will change much in that regard. As for Henderson and Spearing I should imagine they learnt more from the experience against Cardiff. The only player on saturday that appeared bothered was Carroll - it was a disgraceful cup final performance overall from the team the experience of it won't change anything.

by **Benny The Noon** » Mon May 07, 2012 9:15 pm

You only have to read up about his time with both Barce and Bayern and the problems caused with both teams and players. Even with AZ - the guy is a dictator and massively strict to the point the players lose enjoyment. Even breakfast is regimented including every single player must eat and the same time every single day. He works on a card system where players could be dropped for infringements during the week. Players hate working under him

by **red till i die!!** » Mon May 07, 2012 9:38 pm

Benny The Noon » Mon May 07, 2012 9:15 pm wrote:You only have to read up about his time with both Barce and Bayern and the problems caused with both teams and players. Even with AZ - the guy is a dictator and massively strict to the point the players lose enjoyment. Even breakfast is regimented including every single player must eat and the same time every single day. He works on a card system where players could be dropped for infringements during the week. Players hate working under him

as a dof benny there is no way he would have that kind of control.
if he was a dictator like you say then i doubt he would have got 2 stints as manager of barca and as recently as last year managed bayern of to which he has to be credited with the current squad they now have.
he might be regimental yes but thats not neccessarily a bad thing.

by **Benny The Noon** » Mon May 07, 2012 9:43 pm

The problem is mate he is a manager not a DoF , how long do you think it would take him to undermine the current manager ?

by **red till i die!!** » Tue May 08, 2012 12:10 am

the role he is being linked with is as a dof not as a manager.
some of the other names linked were david dein and yohan cruyff and do you also think it would only be a matter of time before they would begin to undermine the manager and want his job?.
comolis job here was simple and that was to look after player transfers and help out with basic day to day duties so that the manager had more time to be with the team.he had nothing to do with training or coaching or indeed having an input into who plays or what way we set up tactically.
any future appointment in that role by fsg will have a similar role to what comoli had.
you dont rate him and thats fine but suggesting he would pull the club apart while trying to oust the manager in the process is paranoia.
id prefer the boot room approach myself as that seems to have served us well in the past but fsg have their own ideas and a dof is what they seem to want and as we seen with comoli if he doesnt get results they will can him and certainly not give him the managers job.

by **ycsatbjywtbiastkamb** » Tue May 08, 2012 12:17 am

god knows why our owners are so keen on a DoF, they dont work in this country.

by **Boxscarf** » Tue May 08, 2012 1:55 am

Benny The Noon » Mon May 07, 2012 8:15 pm wrote:You only have to read up about his time with both Barce and Bayern and the problems caused with both teams and players. Even with AZ - the guy is a dictator and massively strict to the point the players lose enjoyment. Even breakfast is regimented including every single player must eat and the same time every single day. He works on a card system where players could be dropped for infringements during the week. Players hate working under him

Bayern Munich players loved playing under him and were saddened by his departure.

by **D___C** » Tue May 08, 2012 3:20 am

ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Mon May 07, 2012 11:17 pm wrote:god knows why our owners are so keen on a DoF, they dont work in this country.

simple... they don't have enough knowledge on the game to just have a manager run everything (they wouldn't feel uncomfortable doing so).. so the d.o.f is like a go-between.

Its misguided.. but thats how they feel.

by **D___C** » Tue May 08, 2012 3:37 am

ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Mon May 07, 2012 7:21 pm wrote:
burjennio » Mon May 07, 2012 6:57 pm wrote:

Personally I think its poor for a side that goes into every tournament with a large section of their fanbase and media expecting to win it.

Also, QF or better sounds good until you look at it from the point of view that they have only made 2 semis, one of which was with home advantage.

Also during that time Czechoslovakia, Denmark, Greece and, God forbid, THE FRENCH have all won major tournaments

but to be fair the cold facts dont tell the full story.
in 82 (and throughout the 70`s) there was a wierd system in place with group stages that led straight to semi finals, it wasnt a knock out type system so there were no QF`s etc, in 82 the england side did well, they never lost a game, they comfortably beat eventual semi finalists france (platini et al) 2-0, drew with eventual finalists west germany and drew with hosts spain but went out on some strange co-efficient thing.
in 70 they lost in the QF`s to west germany but were many peoples favourites to win the tournament after their performance against brazil, england were a bit unlucky, first just before the QF they lost their keeper gordon banks to food poisoning but despite that they dominated germany and cruised to a 2-0 lead. with 10 minutes left ramsey decided to save bobby charltons legs (charlton was giving beckenbauer the run around) because the game was played in a mexican heatwave and took him off.
with charlton off the pitch germany gained momentum and got a couple of soft goals that chelsea keeper peter bonetti took the blame for, they eventually won in extra time, it was germanys first ever win against england.
that england side was brilliant and pele himself said in his autobiography that the sense of relief that went right through the brazil camp when england went out was palpable.
england have genuinely been unlucky in a few tournaments, 86 was another one.

Of course there are (and have been) quality English/British players.. but the problem is the very top nations produce far more top players than here which means there are very few worth buying, hence the need to look abroad for better.

If we are to buy English/British players then they have to be the best.. and given that there are so few that means the pool is very very small. Man U gobbled up the two quality players in the market last year in Young and Jones.

There are no English/British players on the market, bar Gareth Bale, who would make us better/challenge top 4. Therefore we have to look beyond. The mistake Comolli (and Kenny) made was not doing so, and as a result they expanded the average load on the squad and made us worse. From Torres to Carroll, from Meireles to Henderson/Adam. Inspite of some dodgy buys themselves (Rafa with Keane, Houllier with Heskey, Diouf, Diao, Cheyrou) they have been in a different league to Kenny as regards bringing quality players in. No manager in our history has squandered so much as Kenny and in record time. His one true class signing is Suarez, and the one decent signing is Enrique. He (and Comolli) made a huge error in bringing in players to cater to Carroll, ripping up the progress he had made in his first six months. This season has been a direct result of his (and Comolli's) bizarre strategy. He failed massively and at huge cost.

by **stmichael** » Tue May 08, 2012 12:18 pm

D___C » Tue May 08, 2012 3:37 am wrote:If we are to buy English/British players then they have to be the best.. and given that there are so few that means the pool is very very small. Man U gobbled up the two quality players in the market last year in Young and Jones.

Phil Jones is ridiculously overrated. The bloke's had an absolute nightmare in recent months but as he's a United player nobody mentions a squeak about what he cost or the fact that nobody actually knows what his position is. Same for Smalling who's ok, nothing more, nothing less. Don't even get me started on Cleverley.

Ashley Young, despite being one of the biggest cheats in the league, is a decent player who was always going to thrive at United. The way the two teams play though, if we'd got him and United had got Downing, we'd have turned Young average and United would have got the best out of Downing.

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