Liverpool FC Forum

parchpea » Thu Apr 12, 2012 3:14 pm wrote:You wonder how Dagger stands now after admitting that Comolli
was helpful bringing the players 'he' (Dalglish) wanted.

Quite an admission really considering that individual has been
sacked today, and one would assume because of those
recruitments.

Another issue is whether Dalglish should consider resigning seeing
as he played a big part in getting Comolli sacked with his transfer
targets.

I can see this being Kennys last year to be honest.

Perhaps Kenny will be moved upstairs to take the DOF role?

Everyone is behind Liverpool but we are trying to look beyond 'The King'
persona and speculate what may be at work after this development today.

Werner will naturally say the right thing publicly so I disregard most of
that and look behind the words for answers.

If Dalglish made the signings as he stated then he has effectively allowed
Comolli to take the fall for transfer orders he himself gave.

I dont care if your King Kenny or God Almighty that is actually wrong
and many would consider a resignation if what we are being led to
believe by Dalglish is true.

Incredible timing too on the eve on such a massive game, they clearly
felt this man couldnt remain in post even 2 days longer such was their
displeasure with his work.

Daggers on rocky ground whether people can handle the truth or not.

parchpea » Thu Apr 12, 2012 3:51 pm wrote:Everyone is behind Liverpool but we are trying to look beyond 'The King'
persona and speculate what may be at work after this development today.

Werner will naturally say the right thing publicly so I disregard most of
that and look behind the words for answers.

If Dalglish made the signings as he stated then he has effectively allowed
Comolli to take the fall for transfer orders he himself gave.

I dont care if your King Kenny or God Almighty that is actually wrong
and many would consider a resignation if what we are being led to
believe by Dalglish is true.

Incredible timing too on the eve on such a massive game, they clearly
felt this man couldnt remain in post even 2 days longer such was their
displeasure with his work.

Daggers on rocky ground whether people can handle the truth or not.

Be careful ? The Daily Fail will have your arse for copyright .

parchpea » Thu Apr 12, 2012 3:51 pm wrote:Everyone is behind Liverpool but we are trying to look beyond 'The King'
persona and speculate what may be at work after this development today.

Werner will naturally say the right thing publicly so I disregard most of
that and look behind the words for answers.

If Dalglish made the signings as he stated then he has effectively allowed
Comolli to take the fall for transfer orders he himself gave.

I dont care if your King Kenny or God Almighty that is actually wrong
and many would consider a resignation if what we are being led to
believe by Dalglish is true.

Incredible timing too on the eve on such a massive game, they clearly
felt this man couldnt remain in post even 2 days longer such was their
displeasure with his work.

Daggers on rocky ground whether people can handle the truth or not.

Are you suggesting he should resign?

I am suggesting that if you give someone a shopping list of players and they lose
their job for going to get them, then my reaction would be to consider my own
position and I dont think that is unreasonable.

Unless Dalglish lied at the press conference and did not sign the players then my
guess is he would have gone in todays cull had he not been Dalglish, but then again
we have had so many statements and counter statements today I dont think anyone
knows whats been going on.

First Comolli is gone for family reasons, mutual consent, then Werner tears into him
during an interview clearly suggesring hes been sacked for his role in player recruitment
and strategy which has become 'disconnected' with theirs. Earlier Dalglish had told us
he was responsible for that but remains in post.

I am convinced now that Dalglish is merely a caretaker until this campaign is over
and will be offered another job with the club at best and removed altogether at worst.

Thats just the way I see it.

Benny The Noon » Thu Apr 12, 2012 8:35 am wrote:Eds

Let's have a look at your list in more detail and remember your inital statement was "World Class Respected Manager "

Marcelo Biesla - Currently at Bilbao after being a national manager for over a decade. From Argentina doesn't speak English, won nothing outside of Argentina in club football. His current club was 11th in the table at the weekend. Flavour of the month because they knocked out the Mancs in the Europa league. He is 56 and has been a manager for two decades.

Walter Mazzarri - Currently at Napoli with some wonderful attacking players at his disposal and has done well getting them into the CL. Currently has them 6th in their table. Been a manager since late 90's. Trophies won = 0 . Reportedly going to be the next Inter boss and take Lavezzi with him.

Franceso Guidolin - Udinese currently. Aged 56 and has been a manager since 1989. In that time he has managed over 12 different clubs being sacked from many of them. In that whole time he has also won nothing. But he does currently have Udinese in 4th spot in Serie A .

Juan Ignacio Martinez - currently at Levante. Has managed ten lower league clubs during a 14 year period until given a chance at Levante. Currently has the small club up to 5th in La Liga which is pretty but he very very unproven and definatly a flavour of the month.

Rene Girard - currently doing great at Montepellier and has them top of the table over PSG. He is 58 and been a manager for just over 20 years. Has won nothing also ( a trend it seems ). He is most definately a flavour of the month at a one season wonder club - proven nothing ( the French Alan Pardew )

Ricardo Pinto - who ?

Now onto prob the two decent names you mentioned.

Unai Emery - A very young coach at Valencia who is doing well with them keeping them at the head of the chasing pack. Proven - most definately not , potential - definatly , a risk - massive.

Jurgen Klopp - doing a great job at Dortmund, won the title last season and on his way to winning it again this season. Would take him as manager and he can bring some players with him. Couple of problems - he is winning titles and into CL - would he make the step down to us ? No - why ? Because Chelsea want him and also he is on the Radar of Madrid if Maureen leaves.


So in summary most of those names are not - World Class, or proven , they have all bar one win nothing , they have all bar the last two been managers for a long time. And most crucially most are all flavour of the months at clubs having one good season ( I would call them foriegn Hodgson's ).

We obviously disagree on "world-class" as it is obvious that you qualify this metric based on age and "winning titles / cups". I suggested these names off the top of my head because of what I have seen, heard and read about them. We already both agree that the Hiddinks, Mourinhos are beyond us to I am giving you examples of what I think some good decent world class coaches are. If you made a list of the top 50 currently coaching they would be in this list, so I don't know why you would discard them all.

Bielsa- I started becoming an admirer of Bielsa since he took over the Chilean national side a few years ago. I was gobsmacked at the level of improvement, the quality of play and his eye for bringing up youngsters through the ranks. For me he is one of the top managers in the world, Guardiola acknowledged this a few months ago in an interview. He plays all out frenetic football, somthing that most neutrals beg to watch every game, the opposite of what we have done this season. His only real weakness is probably his emphasis on defense but by brining in the right attacking players and hogging possesion each game this nullifies this weakness.

Mazzeri- I havent seen much of him outside the odd Euoperan game,just read some articles on his structures and team. Has brought in some wonderful attacking players to the Napoli. Funny that Inter are thinking of giving him a chance but you don't rate him.

Guidola- I just like him because he brought Alexis Sanchez to Europe. I have watched a few Udienese games over the last few years and have very impressed with his side and movement. I do agree that he may have found his niche at Udi and won't improve beyond that.

Martinez- Would like to see what this guy can do at a bigger club in Spain or Europe before making a full decision on his creditials. Possibly flavour of the month until we he improves as a manager and begins to stay consistent.

Girard- amazed at what he has done at Montpellier in a league that been dominated by the big clubs over the last decade or so. Will be very interesting to see if he can win the league from here on. And what he foes on to do next season, he is a big, big, risk but there is definately something going right over the there despite his past. You can't be a one season wonder and win a top league in europe! I don't believe in luck, you create your own luck.

Pinto- Haven't seen much of Sporting Lisboa, but in the land of Nandos they are talking him up as the next Mourinho and AVB. Another flavour of the month as I think his team is into the semies of Europa after taking some bigger scalps along the way.

Emery- Would wait to see what he does 1 or 2 more seasons with Valencia, has the pedigree to become one of the best managers in Spain. Young, unproven but so much potential seeing his setup and side play.

Klopp- Is the obvious choice in this list but wonder whether he will go to a bigger club. No reason why we shouldn't be courting him, he has done wonders at Dortmund  and if we are in the running just against Chelsea would bank on us as no one would won't to go there after AvB's treatment this season. That isn't a reality though as most top clubs chasing a manager will have him at the top of their lists.

Would be interested to hear other names from other people as that is just my quick list.

Not a chance! The man has far too much respect from the club and its supporters. Besides he need far more time

SouthCoastShankly » Wed Apr 11, 2012 2:40 pm wrote:

RED BEERGOGGLES » Wed Apr 11, 2012 2:08 pm wrote:I thought our neatest and most precise  passages of play involved Maxi last night he looks so comfortable on the ball. We definitely look a more
composed team when he plays .

No.

Sure he has good games, and like last night when he is good he is extremely effective. However it is a lottery which Maxi will turn up.

In terms of the league he is worth the risk because your league success is not dictated by one game. For cup games he is a risk in my opinion, how much I can't say. I could start him or bench him - I have no preference either way. I just wish he would make it easier by being more consistent.

Well at least he has his good moments as opposed to Henderson who has not had a single good moment for us so far, so I still don't understand why Henderson gets games instead of Maxi. If I was Maxi and Kenny was still manager over the summer I'd be handing in a transfer request.

heimdall » Fri Apr 13, 2012 10:33 am wrote:
Well at least he has his good moments as opposed to Henderson who has not had a single good moment for us so far, so I still don't understand why Henderson gets games instead of Maxi.

heimdall, compared to a lot of people on here i actually think you're ok. maybe its because i go to norway quite often, or something. however, this kind of statement doesn't help your cause at all. if you genuinely haven't seen a good moment from henderson so far then you are definitely lacking in some serious appreciation of the game.

lots of love


andy

SouthCoastShankly » Wed Apr 11, 2012 2:40 pm wrote:

RED BEERGOGGLES » Wed Apr 11, 2012 2:08 pm wrote:
I thought our neatest and most precise  passages of play involved Maxi last night he looks so comfortable on the ball. We definitely look a more
composed team when he plays .

No.

Sure he has good games, and like last night when he is good he is extremely effective. However it is a lottery which Maxi will turn up.

In terms of the league he is worth the risk because your league success is not dictated by one game. For cup games he is a risk in my opinion, how much I can't say. I could start him or bench him - I have no preference either way. I just wish he would make it easier by being more consistent.

At least Maxi does show up some of the time, with Henderson you just know he's gonna be utter ***** for 90 mins...

andy_g » Fri Apr 13, 2012 9:39 am wrote:

heimdall » Fri Apr 13, 2012 10:33 am wrote:
Well at least he has his good moments as opposed to Henderson who has not had a single good moment for us so far, so I still don't understand why Henderson gets games instead of Maxi.

heimdall, compared to a lot of people on here i actually think you're ok. maybe its because i go to norway quite often, or something. however, this kind of statement doesn't help your cause at all. if you genuinely haven't seen a good moment from henderson so far then you are definitely lacking in some serious appreciation of the game.

lots of love


andy

OK maybe he's done a few things ok'ish, and I actually think he will be a good player for us when the new manager starts playing him in centre midfield but you have to admit that Maxi has had far more of an impact in the games he's played this season and should have started far more compared to Henderson and/or Downing.

In terms of new managers I quite like the look of Martinez, I think he could be a great manager for the future and for him it would certainly be a step up managing Liverpool.

BTW Why should managers be given so much time to get the basics right, if any of us ***** up our jobs in the way kenny has this season then we would have gotten the sack a long time ago, why should football be any different. You should only give a manager patience if the team is moving in the right direction and at the moment we really aren't despite the success in the cup competitions.

heimdall » Fri Apr 13, 2012 9:56 am wrote:In terms of new managers I quite like the look of Martinez, I think he could be a great manager for the future and for him it would certainly be a step up managing Liverpool.

BTW Why should managers be given so much time to get the basics right, if any of us ***** up our jobs in the way kenny has this season then we would have gotten the sack a long time ago, why should football be any different. You should only give a manager patience if the team is moving in the right direction and at the moment we really aren't despite the success in the cup competitions.

Are you suggesting football is like real life?

Unintentionally hilarious you mate

Thommo's perm » Fri Apr 13, 2012 10:59 am wrote:

heimdall » Fri Apr 13, 2012 9:56 am wrote:In terms of new managers I quite like the look of Martinez, I think he could be a great manager for the future and for him it would certainly be a step up managing Liverpool.

BTW Why should managers be given so much time to get the basics right, if any of us ***** up our jobs in the way kenny has this season then we would have gotten the sack a long time ago, why should football be any different. You should only give a manager patience if the team is moving in the right direction and at the moment we really aren't despite the success in the cup competitions.

Are you suggesting football is like real life?

Unintentionally hilarious you mate

oi! leave 'im alone!

andy_g » Fri Apr 13, 2012 11:07 am wrote:

Thommo's perm » Fri Apr 13, 2012 10:59 am wrote:

heimdall » Fri Apr 13, 2012 9:56 am wrote:In terms of new managers I quite like the look of Martinez, I think he could be a great manager for the future and for him it would certainly be a step up managing Liverpool.

BTW Why should managers be given so much time to get the basics right, if any of us ***** up our jobs in the way kenny has this season then we would have gotten the sack a long time ago, why should football be any different. You should only give a manager patience if the team is moving in the right direction and at the moment we really aren't despite the success in the cup competitions.

Are you suggesting football is like real life?

Unintentionally hilarious you mate

oi! leave 'im alone!

Andy and Heimdall sitting in a tree K-I-S-S-I-N-G