Liverpool FC Forum

by **7_Kewell** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 8:09 pm

maguskwt » Wed Mar 28, 2012 12:07 pm wrote:I see there are alot of high horses in this forum

I think Benny and redbeergoggles take turns with the same one

by **spiceboys2014** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 8:35 pm

Thommo's perm » Tue Mar 27, 2012 10:05 pm wrote:
eds » Tue Mar 27, 2012 9:57 pm wrote:
aCe' » Tue Mar 27, 2012 9:07 pm wrote:this is boring as f*ck !
Move the fck on to something different

Agree.

Rightio then, which managers should we looking for at the end the season?

Bruce, Errikson, Mclaren, Hoddle, AVB- all free...

Lol. You cannot be serious. BRUCE. Mclaren. Avb? Those names are not even good enough to work in the canteen at melwood. Lol

by **spiceboys2014** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 8:42 pm

heimdall » Tue Mar 27, 2012 8:14 pm wrote:
Benny The Noon » Tue Mar 27, 2012 8:11 pm wrote:Supporting the club is your reward. It's as simple as that. If you want more then support someone else.

You will never understand the true meaning of supporting Liverpool FC, it's family.

Sorry but what do you mean "supporting the club is your reward", should it be a privilege or something, some secret club, how childish. The reward for supporting a club surely is to see your team play well and if lucky win things.

Its talk that comes from confused people who say stuff like.." its swings and roundabouts" , its " much of a muchness" and.." 6 of one, half a dozen of the other" lol.
Do these people forget to go to bed because they already think they are asleep!!

by **Boxscarf** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 9:02 pm

spiceboys2014 » Wed Mar 28, 2012 7:35 pm wrote:

Lol. You cannot be serious. BRUCE. Mclaren. Avb? Those names are not even good enough to work in the canteen at melwood. Lol

I don't see what Andre Villas-Boas has done to be classified as a sh*t manager?

by **heimdall** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 12:53 am

Boxscarf » Wed Mar 28, 2012 8:02 pm wrote:
spiceboys2014 » Wed Mar 28, 2012 7:35 pm wrote:

Lol. You cannot be serious. BRUCE. Mclaren. Avb? Those names are not even good enough to work in the canteen at melwood. Lol

I don't see what Andre Villas-Boas has done to be classified as a sh*t manager?

It's a fair point, I wouldn't mind him at Liverpool and he is a young manager. Give him a decent budget and the power to kick carra into touch and it could be very very interesting.

BTW before I get all the abuse I have nothing but thanks and admiration for what Carra has given the club but he needs to move on and so does the club.

by **D___C** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 1:14 am

stmichael » Wed Mar 28, 2012 4:14 pm wrote:yawn

http://www.talksport.co.uk/radio/kickof ... ard-167612

"Collymore: Liverpool need a world class manager like Mourinho to move them forward"

Whats wrong with saying that about the best manager in the world?

by **alwayslfc** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 6:20 am

Kenny will have to leave after this season IMO because he's had one full season and the results are going backwards. He will only be allowed to stay if FSG grants him one more season with even more funds to spend than last season because they can see something in him. But the question is, will they? To me, I don't think they will.

I still believe Kenny is a good manager but like Houllier and Rafa before him, they were good but not good enough to win EPL. Last season he did a fine job and lifting us from battling relegation to 6th testifies to that. But what caused the downturn in results this season was he made some disastrous signings in Carroll, Downing, Henderson and Adam. These guys except Adam were too expensive and are plainly average players (including Adam), the biggest flop being Carroll. Yes, I know there are a lot of Carroll defenders in here giving excuses like he's still young, not given enough games etc etc. That is all B.S.hit, a 35 million pound striker should be scoring goals almost right from day 1 like Owen, Torres, Rush, Fowler before him. He should be up there in that calibre, weren't they youngsters as well when they made their debut? Owen , Fowler and Rush were younger than him when they made their debut. Carroll is too rigid, the whole team have to change their style to suit him. I can go on and on, but I'll stop here.

Kenny has not admitted those signings were ineffective. He has to admit it to JHenry and convince Henry to trust him by selling those guys and provide another 120 million to spend in the summer. Like I said just now, I don't think this will happen.

Our defence is decent with Enrique, Johnson, Coates, Skrtel, Flanagan, Kelly, Robinson around. In midfield Downing, Henderson and Adam must be relieved for everyone's sake and replace by Sterling, Suso, a quality right winger, a creative midfielder to replace aging Stevie and a clinical striker to replace Carroll permanently.

It is time to put an end to sentiments about Kenny which I did till the recent run of awful league results. I think the question to ask now is not whether Kenny will stay or not. It is who will be the best manager to replace him. Whoever he is, he must be in the calibre of Hiddink, Mourinho, Ancelotti, Guardiola and please, no more mid table managers. Hope Liverpool have learnt their lesson.

by **Reg** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 8:10 am

Liverpool do need a top quality manager, well we had one, but we sacked him after one bad season. The man that got us to two CL finals on the back of a £12m a season transfer kitty, you don't get much better than that. Now, that's World Class, Stan.[/quote]

Why don't we get the fella that played him in '15 minutes that shook the world' and pretend its Rafa? :ghostface:

by **Basil** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 8:47 am

I agree that Rafa was a good manager but he didn't do it on £12 million a year, his net spend was over a £100 million in his first 4 years and he probably had a stronger squad to start with.

The net spend over the next three seasons however, two with Rafa and the one with Roy/Kenny, was negative which is why we're in the mess we are in.

Since FSG took over our net spend is about £35 million but if that Tomkins article is right, we've also saved £30 million a season in wages.

We've got new owners, new manager, new coaches and new players and now we need some stability and regular fiancial backing over the coming years to put us back where we belong.

You can't turn it around in one season, there will be ups and downs but we just need to be moving in the right direction.

by **maypaxvobiscum** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 10:12 am

Liverpool's flawed four
March 29, 2012
By Norman Hubbard

It is the best part of half a century since Merseyside's major exports were dubbed 'The Fab Four'. Now, in a city whose global fame owes as much to goals as guitars, another quartet are attracting attention, albeit in unwanted fashion. The gruesome foursome of Andy Carroll, Stewart Downing, Jordan Henderson and Charlie Adam are more beaten than Beatles. Directly or indirectly, many of Liverpool's failings can be traced back to them.

Expenditure increases expectations, a rule that only football managers appear unable to grasp and, after the cash-starved mediocrity of the previous two seasons, Liverpool committed an initial £78.5 million, potentially rising to £84.5 million, for the four failures.

As they find themselves with fewer points than at the equivalent stage of the last two campaigns, it seems expensive regression. That, in turn, reflects poorly on Kenny Dalglish and the whole policy of buying British. If the unanswered question is how that windfall should have been spent, an unarguable conclusion is simply "better".

It is a misguided spending spree that affects not just Liverpool's present but their future. If Dalglish is not trusted with more money by owners Fenway Sports Group, it is understandable. If Liverpool have to sell before they buy in the summer, they must take a hefty hit on supposed investments.

Analyse their failings on the field and most can be attributed to the less-than-fab four. To the fact that none seems to possess the temperament Liverpool require, the ability to prosper under scrutiny which is needed at Anfield. And Liverpool have been poor at home, winning only five league games.

That, in turn, is a consequence of a lack of goals. Luis Suarez is often identified as a culprit but the electric Uruguayan's tally of 12 would be less of an issue if Carroll had 15 or 20. Instead, the target man has a mere six. Now he has been demoted to the bench, Dalglish presumably concluding that, rather than complementing Suarez, he gets in the South American's way. When a side struggles to score, the sight of a £35 million forward among the replacements is an obvious symptom of poor recruitment.

A focus on the strikers, however, obscures the fact the midfielders contribute too few goals. Between them, Downing, Henderson and Adam have five in 110 games this season, and one of those was a penalty. In contrast, the under-used Maxi Rodriguez has four in his limited opportunities and Raul Meireles, shunted out of the back door, managed five in half a season under Dalglish last year. That Downing, a £20 million winger, has neither scored nor created a league goal is an extraordinary embarrassment.

The faith shown in all three calls Dalglish's judgment into doubt. Henderson is Liverpool's most used outfield player with Downing and Adam not far behind. Maxi, Craig Bellamy and Dirk Kuyt have been granted too few starts. That the Dutchman, arguably Liverpool's finest performer last season, was a substitute on the opening day while Carroll, Downing, Adam and Henderson all started seemed unfair. That Bellamy, monumental in the Carling Cup semi-final against Manchester City, was omitted for the showpiece smacked of favouritism.

Perhaps, for Dalglish, it was a quest for vindication, so his employers could see his signings deliver silverware. To others, it sent out the wrong sort of message: that Liverpool is no longer a meritocracy. The manager's preference is to discuss the side, rather than individuals, but collective responsibility protects the weakest links. And usually, they tend to be his expensive additions.

Moreover, attributing triumphs to the whole team is often incorrect. While, until recent setbacks, the defence was functioning well as a unit, Liverpool have been reliant upon individuals, whether Bellamy, Suarez or Steven Gerrard, for an injection of inspiration, drive or dynamism when attacking. With those notable exceptions, they lack pace going forward: signing four players of at best average speed - even though Dalglish strangely suggested Downing is both quicker and better than he thought when buying him - hardly helped.

It is important to consider the players jettisoned to make way for them. Few tears were shed when Joe Cole was loaned to Lille, but he is enjoying a better season than any of the quartet. More pertinently, the gifted Alberto Aquilani and Meireles, a qualified success at Anfield if not Stamford Bridge, were exiled for lesser talents in Adam and Henderson. The departed duo might have offered more penetrative passing.

The impression is that Dalglish did not believe the Portuguese was capable of shielding the back four. Yet Adam is no defensive midfielder - slow, a poor tackler and with questionable positional sense - while Liverpool appear unsure what Henderson, at fault for goals in the last two games, is. In a department where Gerrard and Lucas are vastly superior to the other alternatives, their injuries have disrupted Liverpool's season. But pricey understudies should have compensated better; instead, it seems the captain reins himself in, given added responsibility because of his colleagues' deficiencies.

It comes at a cost. Gerrard is one of the few matchwinners. Carroll, Downing, Henderson and Adam lack his capacity to control or determine a game. Despite a combined outlay of almost £80 million, it is doubtful if any have deserved to be Liverpool's man of the match once this season (Downing received the official award in the Carling Cup final, but Martin Skrtel would have been a worthier choice). Were they not at Anfield, it is hard to imagine any of them getting in the top five teams apart from in an injury crisis; in many situations, they would not even merit a place on the bench.

They are reasons, although Liverpool have won one trophy and could yet make it two, that this has been a wasted year in the league and a missed opportunity. The fall-out from the faulty foursome's purchase and poor performance could be considerable. Some fans blame Damien Comolli - although with his greater knowledge of European football, it is probable he also suggested candidates from the continent - but Dalglish is definitely diminished; partly by overseeing their arrival, partly by his rhetoric in defending them and partly by the way others have been elbowed aside to promote players who, simply, are not good enough for Liverpool.

:nod

excellent article

by **D___C** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 11:02 am

maypaxvobiscum » Thu Mar 29, 2012 9:12 am wrote:Liverpool's flawed four
March 29, 2012
By Norman Hubbard

It is the best part of half a century since Merseyside's major exports were dubbed 'The Fab Four'. Now, in a city whose global fame owes as much to goals as guitars, another quartet are attracting attention, albeit in unwanted fashion. The gruesome foursome of Andy Carroll, Stewart Downing, Jordan Henderson and Charlie Adam are more beaten than Beatles. Directly or indirectly, many of Liverpool's failings can be traced back to them.

Expenditure increases expectations, a rule that only football managers appear unable to grasp and, after the cash-starved mediocrity of the previous two seasons, Liverpool committed an initial £78.5 million, potentially rising to £84.5 million, for the four failures.

As they find themselves with fewer points than at the equivalent stage of the last two campaigns, it seems expensive regression. That, in turn, reflects poorly on Kenny Dalglish and the whole policy of buying British. If the unanswered question is how that windfall should have been spent, an unarguable conclusion is simply "better".

It is a misguided spending spree that affects not just Liverpool's present but their future. If Dalglish is not trusted with more money by owners Fenway Sports Group, it is understandable. If Liverpool have to sell before they buy in the summer, they must take a hefty hit on supposed investments.

Analyse their failings on the field and most can be attributed to the less-than-fab four. To the fact that none seems to possess the temperament Liverpool require, the ability to prosper under scrutiny which is needed at Anfield. And Liverpool have been poor at home, winning only five league games.

That, in turn, is a consequence of a lack of goals. Luis Suarez is often identified as a culprit but the electric Uruguayan's tally of 12 would be less of an issue if Carroll had 15 or 20. Instead, the target man has a mere six. Now he has been demoted to the bench, Dalglish presumably concluding that, rather than complementing Suarez, he gets in the South American's way. When a side struggles to score, the sight of a £35 million forward among the replacements is an obvious symptom of poor recruitment.

A focus on the strikers, however, obscures the fact the midfielders contribute too few goals. Between them, Downing, Henderson and Adam have five in 110 games this season, and one of those was a penalty. In contrast, the under-used Maxi Rodriguez has four in his limited opportunities and Raul Meireles, shunted out of the back door, managed five in half a season under Dalglish last year. That Downing, a £20 million winger, has neither scored nor created a league goal is an extraordinary embarrassment.

The faith shown in all three calls Dalglish's judgment into doubt. Henderson is Liverpool's most used outfield player with Downing and Adam not far behind. Maxi, Craig Bellamy and Dirk Kuyt have been granted too few starts. That the Dutchman, arguably Liverpool's finest performer last season, was a substitute on the opening day while Carroll, Downing, Adam and Henderson all started seemed unfair. That Bellamy, monumental in the Carling Cup semi-final against Manchester City, was omitted for the showpiece smacked of favouritism.

Perhaps, for Dalglish, it was a quest for vindication, so his employers could see his signings deliver silverware. To others, it sent out the wrong sort of message: that Liverpool is no longer a meritocracy. The manager's preference is to discuss the side, rather than individuals, but collective responsibility protects the weakest links. And usually, they tend to be his expensive additions.

Moreover, attributing triumphs to the whole team is often incorrect. While, until recent setbacks, the defence was functioning well as a unit, Liverpool have been reliant upon individuals, whether Bellamy, Suarez or Steven Gerrard, for an injection of inspiration, drive or dynamism when attacking. With those notable exceptions, they lack pace going forward: signing four players of at best average speed - even though Dalglish strangely suggested Downing is both quicker and better than he thought when buying him - hardly helped.

It is important to consider the players jettisoned to make way for them. Few tears were shed when Joe Cole was loaned to Lille, but he is enjoying a better season than any of the quartet. More pertinently, the gifted Alberto Aquilani and Meireles, a qualified success at Anfield if not Stamford Bridge, were exiled for lesser talents in Adam and Henderson. The departed duo might have offered more penetrative passing.

The impression is that Dalglish did not believe the Portuguese was capable of shielding the back four. Yet Adam is no defensive midfielder - slow, a poor tackler and with questionable positional sense - while Liverpool appear unsure what Henderson, at fault for goals in the last two games, is. In a department where Gerrard and Lucas are vastly superior to the other alternatives, their injuries have disrupted Liverpool's season. But pricey understudies should have compensated better; instead, it seems the captain reins himself in, given added responsibility because of his colleagues' deficiencies.

It comes at a cost. Gerrard is one of the few matchwinners. Carroll, Downing, Henderson and Adam lack his capacity to control or determine a game. Despite a combined outlay of almost £80 million, it is doubtful if any have deserved to be Liverpool's man of the match once this season (Downing received the official award in the Carling Cup final, but Martin Skrtel would have been a worthier choice). Were they not at Anfield, it is hard to imagine any of them getting in the top five teams apart from in an injury crisis; in many situations, they would not even merit a place on the bench.

They are reasons, although Liverpool have won one trophy and could yet make it two, that this has been a wasted year in the league and a missed opportunity. The fall-out from the faulty foursome's purchase and poor performance could be considerable. Some fans blame Damien Comolli - although with his greater knowledge of European football, it is probable he also suggested candidates from the continent - but Dalglish is definitely diminished; partly by overseeing their arrival, partly by his rhetoric in defending them and partly by the way others have been elbowed aside to promote players who, simply, are not good enough for Liverpool.

excellent article

Its a wonderful article, nigh on word perfect. The two highlighted parts are what ive stated previously.. first that Kenny picked his four costly British signings for the final to show to Henry and FSG.. "look.. my signings winning a trophy". In that game, Carroll and Henderson were hauled off having contributed zilch, while Adam overhit everything and finished it off with a shocking penalty. It was a dreadful display and really Kenny Miller should have buried us with that chance. It was left to a man unjustly left out, Dirk Kuyt, to come on and contribute more in his 15 minutes than 3 of them combined had in over 100 minutes. Kenny bought garbage, and has felt compelled to pick that garabage. As the article alludes to his treatment of Maxi is a disgrace... every time he has played he has done something, whether its laying if off to Suarez as he did against Stoke in the FA Cup, or linking up play and casuing more of a goal threat. But alas, Kenny didnt fork out a fortune for him so didnt feel compelled to play him.

The second part.. its a terrible indictment on his signings that its March, almost 40 games played.. and none of the four have had a stand out game all season (bar Downing at Wembley). 80 million on midtable level british junk.

by **Reg** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 11:38 am

You're a miserable bugger D__C, you make me look like Mr Happy.

Cheer up son, you're not going to die for another 50 seasons so get used to it.

by **D___C** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 12:24 pm

lol... seriously im not normally like this (my posts do not reflect my jovial demeanour).

Its just been a frustration, specific to his british signings.. which condemned us to mediocrity, and what a glorious missed opportunity it has been in a season when both Arsenal and Chelsea have been poor. If we had Sheik Mansour i wouldnt be uttering a word as we could afford to throw cash around... but thats not our situation.

That article is genuinely word perfect.

by **maguskwt** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 12:32 pm

D___C » Thu Mar 29, 2012 12:14 am wrote:
stmichael » Wed Mar 28, 2012 4:14 pm wrote:yawn

http://www.talksport.co.uk/radio/kickof ... ard-167612

"Collymore: Liverpool need a world class manager like Mourinho to move them forward"

Whats wrong with saying that about the best manager in the world?

Well, it's disrespectful to Kenny even though the statement maybe correct. Kenny is a manager who won the league with 2 clubs how often do you come across a manager like that? He has done mistakes in the transfers and he can't seem to mitigate this with coaching but that doesn't mean he should be disrespected...

by **Roger Red Hat** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 1:16 pm

D___C » Thu Mar 29, 2012 12:14 am wrote:
stmichael » Wed Mar 28, 2012 4:14 pm wrote:yawn

http://www.talksport.co.uk/radio/kickof ... ard-167612

"Collymore: Liverpool need a world class manager like Mourinho to move them forward"

Whats wrong with saying that about the best manager in the world?

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