Liverpool FC Forum

by **maypaxvobiscum** » Tue Nov 16, 2010 12:51 pm

yeah it IS the results and we all feel the annoyance. it is frustrating that we're not higher up the table...but seeing the way the table is this season, nothing can be confirmed. there are actually 4 teams who can easily take over #1 in a matter of 2 games, while most of the teams are either level on points or 1 point apart. im still confident we can improve on our league position from last season.

by **Ben Patrick** » Tue Nov 16, 2010 12:59 pm

maypaxvobiscum wrote:yeah it IS the results and we all feel the annoyance. it is frustrating that we're not higher up the table...but seeing the way the table is this season, nothing can be confirmed. there are actually 4 teams who can easily take over #1 in a matter of 2 games, while most of the teams are either level on points or 1 point apart. im still confident we can improve on our league position from last season.

The problem is, if we stick with Roy we wont pick up many points away from home at all.
He is persisting with this dropping deep and looking to play on the break tactic.
Its killing us and i agree with anyone that thinks he needs to go for the good of the club.
Its a shame and usually i would say he hasnt had enough time, but there is no sign that things are going to improve.

Igor i for now would bring Kenny in until the end of the season and then try and get someone in long term.

by **Dundalk** » Tue Nov 16, 2010 1:03 pm

andy_g wrote:
Igor Zidane wrote:Bunch of fanny farts the lot of youse . In a nice way like .

spot on, lash

by **Benny The Noon** » Tue Nov 16, 2010 1:05 pm

Ben Patrick wrote:
maypaxvobiscum wrote:yeah it IS the results and we all feel the annoyance. it is frustrating that we're not higher up the table...but seeing the way the table is this season, nothing can be confirmed. there are actually 4 teams who can easily take over #1 in a matter of 2 games, while most of the teams are either level on points or 1 point apart. im still confident we can improve on our league position from last season.

The problem is, if we stick with Roy we wont pick up many points away from home at all.
He is persisting with this dropping deep and looking to play on the break tactic.
Its killing us and i agree with anyone that thinks he needs to go for the good of the club.
Its a shame and usually i would say he hasnt had enough time, but there is no sign that things are going to improve.

Igor i for now would bring Kenny in until the end of the season and then try and get someone in long term.

Yep i would totally agree

I would even maybe look at bringing in a younger up and coming manager to work alongside Kenny - someone like Di Matteo maybe even Coyle or Stevie Nicol etc

by **maypaxvobiscum** » Tue Nov 16, 2010 1:06 pm

thing is Ben Patrick, what i am worried is that if we sack Roy now, NESV will appoint a new manager rashly and he might not be the type of manager they thought he was after all.. im hoping for someone who is here for a long term like how Wenger and Fergie have been. i do feel he needs to go too, im just unsure if he goes now, and Kenny takes over..what happens if Kenny screws up and doesnt produce the results? his reputation would be tainted as well. its a big risk.

by **laza** » Tue Nov 16, 2010 1:08 pm

Well I thought it would be counter productive to remove Roy before end of the season.

However If there is no dramatic change in fortunes, I like to see a caretaker manager in by Christmas and then a rebuild over the summer.

Oh and on superficial note, Bad Bob Firefly sigs wipes the floor with all you trekkes (OOTers and non OOters alike)

by **stmichael** » Tue Nov 16, 2010 1:11 pm

I can't believe that people don't think that there is some form of xenophobia in the media. Just check out the double standards here (not that I can ever take anything Lawrenson says seriously as he speaks absolute tripe).

[url=http://www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/liverpool-fc/liverpool-fc-news/2010/11/16/mark-lawrenson-it-s-the-liverpool-fc-players-who-need-a-rocket-not-the-manager-92534-27663
451/3/]http://www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/liverpo....3[/url]

So according to him, finishing 8th would be acceptable this season. Yet largely the same squad finishing 7th last season was a disgrace and unacceptable.

Unbelievable.

by **Ben Patrick** » Tue Nov 16, 2010 1:11 pm

maypaxvobiscum wrote:thing is Ben Patrick, what i am worried is that if we sack Roy now, NESV will appoint a new manager rashly and he might not be the type of manager they thought he was after all.. im hoping for someone who is here for a long term like how Wenger and Fergie have been. i do feel he needs to go too, im just unsure if he goes now, and Kenny takes over..what happens if Kenny screws up and doesnt produce the results? his reputation would be tainted as well. its a big risk.

Of course it is a risk.

I wouldnt rashly bring in anyone, i think Kenny would be a safe pair of hands to get through this season with the intention of bringing in someone that can start afresh.

If we dont i genuinley fear that we could end up coming about 10th this season.
The league is that wide open that any manager worth his salt should be able to get this side in the top 6.

by **jacdaniel** » Tue Nov 16, 2010 1:13 pm

There could also be a backlash if kenny was appointed until the end of the season.

What if he got us 4th and then had to stand down?

by **Benny The Noon** » Tue Nov 16, 2010 1:14 pm

jacdaniel wrote:There could also be a backlash if kenny was appointed until the end of the season.

What if he got us 4th and then had to stand down?

If he got us 4th mate he wouldnt have to stand down - i would expect both the owners and fans would want him to carry on .

by **maypaxvobiscum** » Tue Nov 16, 2010 1:15 pm

Ben Patrick wrote:
maypaxvobiscum wrote:thing is Ben Patrick, what i am worried is that if we sack Roy now, NESV will appoint a new manager rashly and he might not be the type of manager they thought he was after all.. im hoping for someone who is here for a long term like how Wenger and Fergie have been. i do feel he needs to go too, im just unsure if he goes now, and Kenny takes over..what happens if Kenny screws up and doesnt produce the results? his reputation would be tainted as well. its a big risk.

Of course it is a risk.

I wouldnt rashly bring in anyone, i think Kenny would be a safe pair of hands to get through this season with the intention of bringing in someone that can start afresh.

If we dont i genuinley fear that we could end up coming about 10th this season.
The league is that wide open that any manager worth his salt should be able to get this side in the top 6.

good point about the league. but we'll be hard pressed to find a manager who will leave his post midway through the season to come to us. it might leave us with those who havent got any position at the moment...but Dalglish for the time being is a good idea. if he does well, perhaps could even extent it to another season.

by **Ben Patrick** » Tue Nov 16, 2010 1:26 pm

I honestly feel that we should cut our losses immediately and get Kenny and Aldo in until the end of the season.
Kenny knows his football and aldo would get the lads motivated without a doubt.
Get a bit of fire back and get the tactics right, by that i mean keeping the football and dominating the possesion. The old Liverpool way.

by **Reg** » Tue Nov 16, 2010 1:27 pm

The big picture scenario at LFC is not complicated to understand, the frustration is the cummulation of a number of events that haven't been fully exorcised yet.

T&T destroying our balance sheet and nearly breaking the club.
The infighting between T&T, the humiliartion and sacking of Parry, the appointment of CP to 'find 100 million',
The intense media speculation and virtual '1 year countdown to bankrupcy'.
The intense infighting concerning Rafa and eventual sacking inexplicably 3-4 months prior to the club was sold.
Roy being appointed.
The loss of key players.

These individual acts were played out over a 3 year period and created fan stress, the club allowed it to rise unchecked for the final 2 years. The fans united to take on the owners.

The outcome fortunately was far better than we could have expected:

T&T were forced to sell at a minimum price that left the balance sheet respectable and hopefully allows well financed owners to invest the money saved from the overinflated T&T price idea.
The court drama heightened stress levels quite intensely, fortunately Grabbo played a blinder.
We found what appear to be sensible new owners who have made the right noises thus far.

However, the fanbase (not just our forum) has understandably and collectively had a massive outporing of emotion since the closure of the takeover.
We want to see tangible results after our 3 years of héll.
We expect to see the players raise their game and provide some payback.
We expect to see the club rise and move forward reclaiming a top 4 spot and brushing off the likes of Blackpool, Wigan and Stoke.
We expect to see scouse pride restored.

This hasn't happened and is being put down to 2 things:
The manager appears unsuited for the job.
The attitude of certain players and the fact that some also appear incapable of lifting their game.

I believe the fans are prepared to put up with dicky performances if we see a manager and squad working together and visibly trying to move forward but we expect to see harmony and respect between manager, players and fans. We expect to see a united cause.

On one hand I understand the new owners desire to wait a year before making changes. They need to recruit a commercial team, they need a business plan and solid financial resources to make it work.
They need to learn the game, learn the club, understand fan expectations. The investment side I believe is in good hands, so the issue for the fans today is the manager and squad - this is what is visible and 'on trial' every weekend.

For me, it was criminal to employ Roy, not just because he isnt a big club manager but because of what it will cost us to get rid - on top of the 6 million we paid Rafael. Thats just plain bad business.
I see no downside to appointing Kenny on a well publicised 6 month basis. Caretaker, Temporary. Standin. Call it what you like, pending the appointment of a replacement over the closed season. The Kop would accept bad results from a team led by someone we trust, rather than someone held in derision.

Then the squad. Comolli has hinted he wants to wait til summer. Yes, thats when we'll probably get the replacement manager as well so its understandable. So Kenny will have to make do with the unbalanced squad we have, and get them to gel. Maybe bring in an old warhorse on a freebie in january to help Torres?

The downside of this is key players like Pepe, Carra, Stevie and Nando will feel righty let down by the club. They endured the T&T fiasco, the Rafa debacle, the takeover media frenzy.
Then instead of stepping out from the dark into the sunshine we got Roy, lost Masher and got the likes of Poulsen instead. If we dont have a dynamic manager come in with the ability to spend, these players 'should' leave - otherwise Torres will finish his career without a medal in domestic or european football - one of the best strikers of his generation, medaless??

Despite the bickering on this forum and I'm sure many more and around the stadium as well, the fans have to make ONE LAST PUSH for the club.
Whether the new owners are ready or not, Roy has to go. The atmosphere in the changing room, ground and global fanbase has to improve before we see results on the field.
If the players continue to play under this black cloud of easy turnovers, then understandably they'll walk at the end of the season becuase cl,early the 'plan' doesnt work. I would in their position.

So the infighting on this forum is understandable though hardly inspiring.
The most important thing is to get rid of Roy and get the club back on a level keel waiting for a replacement manager at the end of the season with funds to spend.
But that said, the owners need to recognise all the above - why we're at this stage - and rise to the challenge also.
Statistics are great, but they'll have to wait - theres work to be done.

by **Benny The Noon** » Tue Nov 16, 2010 1:28 pm

Ben Patrick wrote:I honestly feel that we should cut our losses immediately and get Kenny and Aldo in until the end of the season.
Kenny knows his football and aldo would get the lads motivated without a doubt.
Get a bit of fire back and get the tactics right, by that i mean keeping the football and dominating the possesion. The old Liverpool way.

Not sure about Aldo tbh mate

by **wrighty (not mark!)** » Tue Nov 16, 2010 1:29 pm

Ben Patrick wrote:I honestly feel that we should cut our losses immediately and get Kenny and Aldo in until the end of the season.
Kenny knows his football and aldo would get the lads motivated without a doubt.
Get a bit of fire back and get the tactics right, by that i mean keeping the football and dominating the possesion. The old Liverpool way.

I completely agree, would be a dream pairing.

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