Liverpool FC Forum

[account deleted by request]

[Quadrophenia]

Happy new year Bill start as you mean to go on like

 

I intend to girl, happy new year to you while we're at it.

[maypaxvobiscum]

Discussion over.

for you at least. as you've got nothing smart to say other than one-line replies in your oh-so-feeble attempts to be witty and funny.

besides, you rarely even discuss football at all. the fact that you're a mod despite going around sh!t stirring and baiting members into arguments just highlights the sorry state of affairs the forum has.

[Madmax]

Discussion over.

for you at least. as you've got nothing smart to say other than one-line replies in your oh-so-feeble attempts to be witty and funny.

besides, you rarely even discuss football at all. the fact that you're a mod despite going around sh!t stirring and baiting members into arguments just highlights the sorry state of affairs the forum has.

  now that was funny

[bigmick]

Discussion over.

for you at least. as you've got nothing smart to say other than one-line replies in your oh-so-feeble attempts to be witty and funny.

besides, you rarely even discuss football at all. the fact that you're a mod despite going around sh!t stirring and baiting members into arguments just highlights the sorry state of affairs the forum has.

  now that was funny

I didn't think so but it's all opinion. When Leon says, "end of discussion" it doesn't mean stop talking about it, nor stop debating it. It means in a flippant way, "that's all there is to it". a bit like somebody moaning that Torres doesn't score enough headers and somebody coming back and saying he scored 30 odd goals in his first season, end of discussion.

I understand there must be some history between Maxi and Leon, (as it appears there is some between all the mods and some posters, it is an inevitable consequence of modding the forum), but even so, I think Max the comment was uncalled for.

Given that it's a New Year and all that, it wouldn't be a bad resolution for us all to make to not necessarily look for rows all the time. We're all guilty of it. I've had my spats with GYSB which seem thankfully now to be a thing of the past. I have a long lasting love hate relationship with Kazza (I love him he hates me), I have the beginnings of something similar with the sbs the basketball man, and Deviney looks like he's spoiling for a row with me as well (no doubt there's loads more who feel the same but just can't be bothered).

My forum resolution though is to try and be less sarcy, and to revisit my "no internet spat" vow. Despite saying it, I've become a little blurry round the edges recently and have launched the odd pre-emptive strike which helps nobody. I'm going to do my best from now on to only respond under attack, and even then to keep it brief.

So to all the foes on here, whether I've mentioned you or not, I have this message.

Feck off   





No seriously  (that was a little Micky joke) the message is all the best and though we may differ, I'm going to try my best to get on with everyone again. Probably last about a day I know, but I'm gonna give it a bash anyway. If Barry can do it (change a bit for the better that is) then we should all give it a try.

[bigmick]

And I should also say to get things back on topic, that zonal marking from set-pieces is the way to go. Rafa deserves masses of credit for us being so good at it, and no doubt the addition of Pelligrino has helped as well. When I said he was an excellent signing all those years ago, though many said I was talking sh!t after they had seen him play a few times, the prediction came good in the end  I'm going to start a campaign now to bring Robert Earnshaw in as striker coach, failing that he could advise on backflips.

[ConnO'var]

What do you like about it? What don't you like? What don't you agree with? Is man to man better?

I think it's an efficient means of defending and allow us to spring out from defense to attack quickly as our players won't get pulled out of position by the markee. Teams keep their shapes better in this system and ensures discipline and concentration levels are kept high. Without which, the system comes apart at the seams. Zonal marking definitely works IMO.

However, it does require players to have some level of intelligence, awareness and decision making ability. So if you've got a bunch of numbskulls, you can get exposed. IMO, this occurs in situations where the players have too much time to think about it and not react instinctively. I am speaking of course about setpiece scenarios as compared to open play. So I do think that depending on the quality of players you have as well as how well drilled they are, a mixture of both man-man marking at setpieces and zonal marking in open play cannot hurt..... Many a time, I actually prefer this approach but I still believe that overall, the zonal system is better.

What don't you understand about it?

Too much! Was never deployed in the teams I played in when much younger..... so all knowledge of zonal marking has been theoretical based on observations!

[Number 9]

Discussion over.

for you at least. as you've got nothing smart to say other than one-line replies in your oh-so-feeble attempts to be witty and funny.

besides, you rarely even discuss football at all. the fact that you're a mod despite going around sh!t stirring and baiting members into arguments just highlights the sorry state of affairs the forum has.

Your one of the biggest attention seeking little stirrers on the fecking board.
Too many little one line jibes like this..all trying to kick something off coming from you all too often.

[kazza]

Ah so you did look then, good man  I wonder, in the thread which was entitled "zonal defence, will it work" what was my conclusion as you omitted to put it up 

Thought so.

Same as my own conclusion in my thread which I also omitted, pretty suspicious I am sure you will agree.

Actually I wanted to save red faces that said "will never work" (one of our long serving mods)  . You see Mick there is often a bigger picture that does not involve you. Despite what you may think I do not actively look to discredit you. My only issue with you is when after a poor performance when we are all feeling cr@p you come on and go on about rotation when it is no more than 10% of the issue. It is overly simplistic to assume that we might have played poorly due to that when there is so much more going on that we are not privvy too. FACT- You do not know my opinion on rotation, Dirk or any other thing we may have disagreed with. I have always stated that you do not have all the facts. I just try to be positive whatever I am feeling about the team, it is called support.

[bigmick]

Ah so you did look then, good man  I wonder, in the thread which was entitled "zonal defence, will it work" what was my conclusion as you omitted to put it up 

Thought so.

Same as my own conclusion in my thread which I also omitted, pretty suspicious I am sure you will agree.

Actually I wanted to save red faces that said "will never work" (one of our long serving mods)  . You see Mick there is often a bigger picture that does not involve you. Despite what you may think I do not actively look to discredit you. My only issue with you is when after a poor performance when we are all feeling cr@p you come on and go on about rotation when it is no more than 10% of the issue. It is overly simplistic to assume that we might have played poorly due to that when there is so much more going on that we are not privvy too. FACT- You do not know my opinion on rotation, Dirk or any other thing we may have disagreed with. I have always stated that you do not have all the facts. I just try to be positive whatever I am feeling about the team, it is called support.

Cool, I appreciate you try and give the team your support. I just try and give an honest opinion, there's not that much difference really    .

[Leonmc0708]

Discussion over.

for you at least. as you've got nothing smart to say other than one-line replies in your oh-so-feeble attempts to be witty and funny.

besides, you rarely even discuss football at all. the fact that you're a mod despite going around sh!t stirring and baiting members into arguments just highlights the sorry state of affairs the forum has.

Thanks for that stu.

[milou]

Yes, you stick with the zone rather than the man. I personally think its a great system and by far the best way of defending set peices.

I think if you look at the ability (or lack of) that Liverpool have in the air then I think this proves it by [/B] our defensive record from these situations.

I think we need some statistics (from owzat?  ) before we can really conclude that we really do concede less from set-pieces.

This will settle the argument once and for all.

Firstly we don't need any statistics. Its the naked eye that is the judge, statistics always ignore variables.

Secondly I was comparing what would happen IF we went man to man as apose to Zonal. We don't, we wouldn't, its not the way forward.

I don't agree that naked eye is more accurate than statistic.

The team that accumulates the most points in a season would win the premiership. The player that scores the most goal would win the golden boat.. etc etc. Simple and straightforward they maybe, but they are statistic too.

In my opinion, statistic are useful but it only becomes confusing, inaccurate or even downright ridiculous if people who does it add complicated and stupid assumptions to twist/hide the truth... aka "Tompkins style".

Equally, you can always try to twist the story to prove that though you win the premiership or golden boat.. somehow you aren't the best in the league or aren't the best striker. My point is you can almost ALWAYS use the right/wrong assumptions to prove any arguments of your choice.

But in the case of "zonal marking", I think a direct comparison of "goals conceded through set-peices" between liverpool (who uses "zonal defence") and other teams (that don't), would be useful.

It would also be straight-forward & more or less conclusive.

[Fo Dne]

Discussion over.

for you at least. as you've got nothing smart to say other than one-line replies in your oh-so-feeble attempts to be witty and funny.

besides, you rarely even discuss football at all. the fact that you're a mod despite going around sh!t stirring and baiting members into arguments just highlights the sorry state of affairs the forum has.

Thanks for that stu.

Yeah, what maypax said.

[Fo Dne]

But in the case of "zonal marking", I think a direct comparison of "goals conceded through set-peices" between liverpool (who uses "zonal defence") and other teams (that don't), would be useful.

It would also be straight-forward & more or less conclusive.

Why would it?

I'm sorry but thats rubbish.

Like I said their would be massive variables. The quality of the opposition, the quality of the teams in the air in comparrison to the quality of the comparrison team to name a couple.

For example, you compare Liverpool and Man Utd's defence in these situations. You have to compare ability of the players, ability of the opposition, the quality of delivery and a massive host of other things before you can even compare the systems.

In football stats can be very useful, they can also be taken completely out of context.

A defensive midfielder usually has a pass completion in the region of 85% in the top level of english football, a striker usually has a completion level of around 65% (neither figure is spot on its just a rough estimate), who is the better passer?

You can't tell because of the variables. Statistical analysis in football has a time and a place, that place is right at the back of the queue and that time is after you've done everything else.

Again, I make the point, its useful. If I was a manager I'd study it like there was no tomorrow, but there is absoloutely no way I'd let that make the judgements for me and it would be very rare I'd let it influence any decision that was made.

[account deleted by request]

To keep things in perspective re stats.

                   Alonso THIS SEASON           Alonso LAST SEASON
games                    20                                    19
total passes         1507                                   995
accurate passes    1278                                  794
shots                     33                                     18
shots on target        10                                      5

I think while these stats don't PROVE anything, when added to what we have already seen with our own eyes, we can safely say that Alonso is playing better this season.