Liverpool FC Forum

by **JBG** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 1:14 pm

Is Gerrard Houllier now entering the killing zone?

I read this morning that Harry Kewell took a bad knock on his ankle on Wednesday against Bolton and is out for three weeks.

With Owen and Finnan also out until Christmas, as well as all the other injuries, Liverpool look spectacularly average going into the Christmas run of games, which is a period which usually separates the men from the boys.

For the next couple of games, including the crucial game against Newcastle, we will have to choose a front two from Heskey, Pongolle and Diouff, or maybe play Smicer or Le Tallec up front.

Two of those players are teenagers who, despite showing some promise, are not players who will lead the club through this difficult period.

Heskey’s faults are well known, and Diouff, for all his hard running and occasional trickery, cannot shoot to save his life. Smicer is up and down, and he’s not the kind of player to prove the difference against Newcastle.

It also looks like Houllier will have to pick Cheyrou to fill in for Kewell. Cheyrou deserves a chance, but who here really believes that he will save Houllier’s bacon?

In defence we have a converted midfielder with a useless first touch and a tendency to commit absolutely crazy tackles at centre half, another hard tackling midfielder with poor positional awareness at right back, and a cross between Michael Jordan and Bugs Bunny at left back.

Given the terrible injuries and the under performance of the remaining fit players, I can easily see us lose at least three games over the Christmas period, maybe even five, and surely that will be enough for the board to finally see sense and sack Houllier?

Unfortunately, we could lose the next 6 matches on the trot and Houllier would still not resign, as he now has the handy excuse of having 5 or 6 players injured.

I don’t like wishing other clubs bad luck but in a way I wish Celtic lose away to Lyon in the Champions League next week as it might streamline a move for Martin O’ Neill.

by **Cool Hand Luke** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 2:11 pm

I think the christmas period is going to really tough for Houllier, espically with the injuries, and if celtic do get knocked out of the champions league there may be some movement.

by **Owzat** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 2:24 pm

We had bad spells this time last year and the year before so it would not be a new experience. We're lucky this year that only three teams have shown any consistency or our mid-table plight could be a lot worse. Despite already losing five games we are still sixth just one point off the Champions League place that might just save Kermit's hide

by **Cool Hand Luke** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 3:40 pm

People must realise that the premership has become a lot stronger over the past few years, it is unlikely teams can only lose 4 games all season, the smaller teams are alot stonger, look at Middlesbrough they have players like Mendiate, Juninho,
Man city have Anelka, southamton have Fernandez.

The general play has upped a level, so it shoulden't be suprising when we or anyone else loses.

by **JBG** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 5:17 pm

The Premiership is definitely much stronger now.

I think last season was the strongest Premiership yet.

Look at the likes of Middlesbro and Bolton.....sides packed with players like Okocha, Juninho, Mendieta, Djorkeaff, Jardel etc.

Even Man Ure are struggling to keep up with Arsenal and Chelsea at the moment.

I think Liverpool will suffer a terrible Christmas.

We are missing Owen, Kewell, Carragher, Baros, Finnan and Henchoz....I could see us losing a lot of games.

Houllier will blame it on injuries but last season Man UTD lost Keane, Scholes, Solsjaere, Butt, Brown and Gary Neville for long periods of time and still won the league.

by **greenred** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 5:58 pm

I cant agree that the premiership is stronger then ever.infact most teams are playing worse than in recent seasons.outside the top three is a pretty mediocre bunch of clubs .liverpool are getting worse along with leeds,everton,newcastle,villa,blackburn,spurs,man city,southampton. Blackburn,man city and southampton all got knocked out of the uefa cup to teams from minor leagues.Outside the top three most of the teams are pretty ordinary im afraid.

by **THEBARON** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 10:55 pm

Yes I'd have to agree with greenred. The top 3 sides are good quality sides and should all be in the next round of the champions league. The rest are average and the fact that, despite having a cr#p run so far this season we are only 1 win away from being 4th, shows how mediocre and inconsistent many of the sides are.
Owzat makes a good call when he points out that we may still finish 4th because of the failings of other teams rather than our own strengths. What we must not forget that 4th is not the summit of our ambitions , not after £100 million being spent and promises being made.

by **Torben Piecnik's Y-fronts** » Sat Dec 06, 2003 1:04 pm

I'm with The Baron and Greenred on this one, bar the top 3 it is very average.
If Everton can have a season ike they did last year with the Drudge they have that says it all.
Pray we can "RISE" to 4th...
Jesus, that look terrible as a life long Redman.

by **greenred** » Sat Dec 06, 2003 4:41 pm

in the ten years previous to heysel, english clubs won eleven european trophies,seven of which were the european cup. this in an era when the vast majority of the players came from english speaking countries. no country has ever dominated european competitions to that extent.ordinary clubs who didnt have vast resources were able to achieve success ie ipswich,villa,forest,spurs and everton.Now lets take the ten years that followed the ban,english clubs won four european trophies,three of which were the cup winners cup which was a genuine mickey mouse trophy.This in an era when the premiership is meant to be the best league in the world,packed with glamourous foriegn players.makes you think doesnt it? It reinforces the fact that liverpool of that era were an incredible team.we totally dominated a league that was without question(unlike today) the strongest in the world.

by **JBG** » Mon Dec 08, 2003 12:58 pm

I think people are misreading what I and a few others have said.

The Premiership is a strong league, but in my opinion it is still behind Spain and Italy. The results in the Champions League over the past ten years prove this.

However, the Premiership is getting stronger. People forget how terribly weak it was in comparison to Spain and Italy in the mid 1990s, when even Man UTD suffered the occasional hammering away from home in Europe.

I think the standards have risen since then, but when I say that the Premiership is getting stronger I mean in comparison to what it was 7 years ago, but it is still a small bit behind Italy and Spain.

by **redandblue** » Mon Dec 08, 2003 1:20 pm

You are right that the Premiership is stronger. But outside the toop three, the rest of the league, including LFC, is very mediocre. Any team this year between Birmingham (just below us) and Wolves could go down.

The top three, on their day, are very good, sometimes exceptional. We are a long way behind the best.

by **redandblue** » Mon Dec 08, 2003 1:29 pm

Our best chance of getting rid of Houllier will be if Yeovil knock us out in the FA Cup.

by **JBG** » Mon Dec 08, 2003 2:08 pm

I disagree that in the Premiership there are 15 potential relegation candidates. Realistically there are 6 or 7......the rest usually get their act together.

People say this every year yet you can almost always pick those sides who are going to get relegated early in the season.

by **Owzat** » Mon Dec 08, 2003 2:10 pm

John Barnes' Granny wrote:Houllier will blame it on injuries but last season Man UTD lost Keane, Scholes, Solsjaere, Butt, Brown and Gary Neville for long periods of time and still won the league.

Scholes played 33 league games last season and banged in 14 goals. You've probably been listening to too many know-nothing mancs

by **Owzat** » Mon Dec 08, 2003 2:16 pm

Is the Premiership stronger? I doubt it. The real measure is how the rest compare to the top sides and all English sides with their European opponents and that hasn't been too good so far.

- Why are Chelski, manure and Arsenal so far ahead? Because the rest of the Premiership has not been able to compete.

- How have our sides fared in Europe? Southampton, Man City and Blackburn have all been knocked out already. Newcastle didn't get into the Champions League and Arsenal have struggled.

So in answer to my original question - "is the Premiership stronger?" - according to the media yes, according to those who want to believe it yes, according to fact - who knows?

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