Liverpool FC Forum

[LittleHobo]

eh im still delighted with our start

and tonight we were shocking but didnt lose so thats a good sign

[maguskwt]

hmmm...  what a bizarre game. we really weren't very good were we? we looked like we were playing a pre-season friendly and the players were rusty and unaccustomed to playing alongside eachother. very odd. gerrard was nowhere, mascherano looked out of sorts and the defence looked shaky. porto spent all night diving and the ref was a gullible tw@t. on nights like this i'm glad we have the likes of kuyt in the side. heart of a lion that bloke

agreed... that's what i like about kuyt as well...

the thing is ppl seem to think porto is some team or something... they're a top european team... portoguese champions and sitting pretty on top of the league 100% record after 4 games...

I was more fustrated with the portsmouth game than this...

[Ace Ventura]

so what... now we're not letting him have an off day just because he's been tremendous for us almost every game?

In the last 12 months I can count on my fingers when he's played up to his level. He has been no where near his standards bar the Chelsea game and Villa game he's played this season.

When he doesn't play well he should be criticized like every other player. More so because he is the captain.

Quick to jump on our players you are mate, yeah he was poor tonight, and to be honest looked totally off the pace from the first whistle, like he wasnt on his toes and ready for the ball. Not sure why, but why go OTT ?
Criticising his form for a whole year ?
Ridiculous statement, one bad game and make him a scapegoat. By the way the other statement about the skipper...the except for Villa away and Chelsea at home he has been poor one..well THIS SEASON, before he got injured they were his only games. Derby at home, Sunderland away and Portsmouth he never played (well 20 mins against Portsmouth)


Now for my analysis of the game 

Like most i think we played poorly, right from the start when the usually reliable Finnan nearly gifted them a goal. We looked nervous, we were sloppy in posession and even when we had the ball in decent areas we looked like we were short of ideas. But not at one point in the game was i that worried.
Quaresma was great and also wasteful, looks a fantastic player but also one that doesnt choose the right option 7 out of 10 times, he is dangerous as f'ck though and was a constant threat. Also on a sidenote i have never seen anyone that can cross as well with the outside of the boot.
Mascherano looked like Gerrard off the pace and i think thats the main reason we struggled, thats where we would usually control the game, but we sort of got away with it as despiet Portos great movement and football they never really created anything.
Pennant's challenge was silly but decisions like that do my head in, i think the ref could of had a quiet word...the ball was going out..you could see he was only trying to keep it in but timed it wrong the player never even got injured, and it seemed to me the ref was eager to get the red card out. Seconds later the portuguese centre half goes right through the back of Torres...freekick awarded no card, then Mascherano does something similar, guess what no card. All i am saying is Jermaine should of known better and stayed on his feet, BUT there were worse tackles that went unpunished, and sending off Pennant affected the game.
Dirk Kuyt was MOM and played fantastically well, not only workrate (which most say thats all he has) he also looked the most likely in and around the box and deserves huge credit.
Well we all said Pompey away was difficult and the point while we may have wanted or expected more is worthwhile, well i feel today is a very similar result, we played our toughest group game, key players did not perform yet we got the point, that will do and its a decent start.

[LittleHobo]

yeah thing is with quasimodo you can tell hes great when he has it all go his way (like tonight) every time he fell over he got a foul, his team were on top most of the time

i dont think he would shine when the chips are down

[roberto green]

Not that bad when you look at it in the end, our hardest game of the group over and done with in the first game, Pennant was always likely to get sent off once he had been booked even tho he worked hard he still had a sh!te game like the rest of our midfield, for all those Dirk Kuyt haters he showed just why he is so valuable to our team tonight he was head and shoulders above anyone else for us.
I just feel the past 2 games we havent really played that well to our previous games and i think this is almost certainly down to to much rotation, we had a great start so why change. were in September not Febuarary so stick with whats getting results, i have a feeling Mr Benitez is more interested in europe still.

[AB's Red Army]

so what... now we're not letting him have an off day just because he's been tremendous for us almost every game?

In the last 12 months I can count on my fingers when he's played up to his level. He has been no where near his standards bar the Chelsea game and Villa game he's played this season.

When he doesn't play well he should be criticized like every other player. More so because he is the captain.

Quick to jump on our players you are mate, yeah he was poor tonight, and to be honest looked totally off the pace from the first whistle, like he wasnt on his toes and ready for the ball. Not sure why, but why go OTT ?
Criticising his form for a whole year ?
Ridiculous statement, one bad game and make him a scapegoat.

Do you see me coming on here every week after a game blaming Gerrard No the feck you don't.

It's quite simple. Tonight he played poorly, not just for a Liverpool player but for a Liverpool captain. Nothing to do with finding a scapegoat or jumping on players. People here jump on Alonso after every match. When someone mentions Gerrard, it's wrong and he has some excuse for playing badly.

He's playing below his standards for a while. This game was a glimpse of many games of how he performed last season. In the first two games this season he looked like a man possessed. Not tonight.

He was .

As far as his performances in the last 12 months, please prove me wrong otherwise.

In how many games did he play at the highest level from now all the way back to last season at this same time?

I'd be shocked if you can name 5 games in where he was the best man on the pitch without a doubt.

When he plays well or any other player for that matter, I'll be glad to praise him as I always done. When he plays poorly, I will criticize him. More is expected from him as he's wearing the captain's armband. Tonight he couldn't keep hold of the ball up until the last two or three minutes when he made that pass to Kuyt.

[only me]

No need to expend on our boys performance tonight ,aside from Kuyt they were poor to say the least.

But to this moment i can't understand the way rafa managed the game today ,can't understand after the awful first half why he didn't call up yossi and veronin instead of either torres/babel or penannt which was a liability from the moment he got his first booking ,rafa is a god but he froze and when he started acting it was already too late with a man down.

Result is good although coach and players totally beneath average...kinda worrying as we also played out of focus againt Pompey...Saturday should be our chance for regaining confidence.

[AB's Red Army]

No need to expend on our boys performance tonight ,aside from Kuyt they were poor to say the least.

But to this moment i can't understand the way rafa managed the game today ,can't understand after the awful first half why he didn't call up yossi and veronin instead of either torres/babel or penannt which was a liability from the moment he got his first booking ,rafa is a god but he froze and when he started acting it was already too late with a man down.

Result is good although coach and players totally beneath average...kinda worrying as we also played out of focus againt Pompey...Saturday should be our chance for regaining confidence.

Sorry, Voronin and Benayoun wouldn't have done any better than Torres and the co. Not with lack of supply from the midfield.

Benitez was right to keep Torres on the pitch as long as he did, as he had the pace [which none of our other strikers do] to catch Porto on the break.

He didn't freeze, our players froze and played like . The player  s on the bench wouldn't have done any better.

This has feck all to do with Rafael Benitez.

[Ace Ventura]

We are both agreeing that he played poorly tonight, what i took exception to was the over the top assesment that he has been below par for 12 months.
The statement you make about him not being the best man on the pitch in 5 games is a) obviously difficult to prove b) neither here nor there. . But to counter what you said....

Middlesbrough (home)
2 goals in a dire game that would of been a draw without him.
PSV (away) Champions league quarters, scores early header in a game we go on to dominate and comfortably go through.
Villa (away) poor game, infact really poor, one good player we had trying to change things and take the points.
Sheffield United (home) Wins two penalties then scores a superb fourth
Man City home, dire game lit up by strike from skipper outside the area, we were p!ss poor but stevie scored a decent goal.


Yes he deserves criticising when he is poor but to say he has been poor for most of the year is ridiculous.
Wish we had a few more poor performers if thats the case.

[only me]

I don't know if Benayoun or Veronin could have played better ,i do know Torres ,Babel and Pennant played poor and thats exactly what subs are called for ,striker for a striker ,wingman for wingman ,formation would have stayed the same but at least allow a chance for change ,sorry he froze and this was highlighted by pennants sending off.

[NANNY RED]

This has feck all to do with Rafael Benitez.

Best comment of the night in my opinion

People talking about bringing yossie on but once Pennant had been sent off the option to use him was gone
The players let Rafa down tonight by not playing for the shirt

[AB's Red Army]

We are both agreeing that he played poorly tonight, what i took exception to was the over the top assesment that he has been below par for 12 months.
The statement you make about him not being the best man on the pitch in 5 games is a) obviously difficult to prove b) neither here nor there. . But to counter what you said....

Middlesbrough (home)
2 goals in a dire game that would of been a draw without him.
PSV (away) Champions league quarters, scores early header in a game we go on to dominate and comfortably go through.
Villa (away) poor game, infact really poor, one good player we had trying to change things and take the points.
Sheffield United (home) Wins two penalties then scores a superb fourth
Man City home, dire game lit up by strike from skipper outside the area, we were p!ss poor but stevie scored a decent goal.


Yes he deserves criticising when he is poor but to say he has been poor for most of the year is ridiculous.
Wish we had a few more poor performers if thats the case.

For HIS STANDARDS, yes he was poor for much of the season. Compared to the seasons he had in the past, it was poor.

And all of those games you've named were against poor to average opposition. PSV included.

None of those performances were up to par to what he produced in the seasons before. The level that he's been renowned for.

[AB's Red Army]

I don't know if Benayoun or Veronin could have played better ,i do know Torres ,Babel and Pennant played poor and thats exactly what subs are called for ,striker for a striker ,wingman for wingman ,formation would have stayed the same but at least allow a chance for change ,sorry he froze and this was highlighted by pennants sending off.

Torres received no service what so ever in the entire match. You cant expect him to play 1-2 with himself, get past 11 players and create a chance.

There was no service from the center of the park or the wide men.

Torres had the pace and ability to cause Porto problems had we played actual football. He was kept in the game due to the fact that his pace was an asset.

Voronin doesn't posses pace or the ability as Torres.

You're quite deluded if you believe that Benitez froze. Our team underperformed. Our full strength team btw, couldn't string a pass together and you think that has something to do with Benitez.

[Kharhaz]

What exactly is the problem? yes liverpool played poorly but they still walked away from the hardest fixture in the group with a point. Liverpool have made a great start to the season and maybe too much is expected of the new lads, lets not forget this was Torres's first champions league game so all in all stop bitching about it and be glad we got a point, it could have been much much worse.

[Ace Ventura]

So what you are saying is that if Steven isnt the best player on the pitch, and against decent players, then he isnt doing enough ?
Are there any players in the world that are ?
I was countering your argument despite the fact that i thought it was a pointless one, as Steven is part of a team...and provided he performs well (not the best on the pitch every game) then he is doing his job.
Jumping on his back when we have just picked up a point away from home (in our most difficult away group fixture) helps nobody, added to the fact that this was his first start since Chelsea.

We all know what he can do, and that over the course of the season he will be one of the most consistent performers we have, so the OTT reaction from yourself and possibly others is imo uncalled fo and more than a little embarassing.