CHELSEA vs LIVERPOOL: 30/04/08 7.45pm - Champions League Semi Final - 2nd Leg

Liverpool Football Club - General Discussion

Postby Redman in wales » Thu May 01, 2008 9:18 pm

s@int wrote:
Leonmc0708 wrote:
s@int wrote:
Leonmc0708 wrote:
s@int wrote:We spent over £70million on transfers this season - which team spent more ?

Where ?

Torres     £26.5m
Benayoun £5 m
Babel       £11.5m
Insua       £1.3
Skrtel       £6.5m
Mascherano £18m
Leto          £1.8

Total £70.6million - add in Dominguez and Itandje to cover your quibbling about how much Torres cost and I think that just about covers it mate  :D

I thought you where a bit wiser than to use tabloid price tags.

Splitting hairs a bit, but Mascherano package is £18 and includes wages, and Torres cost £19.5 cash plus Garcia, Insua and LEto where both bought at the end of the 2006-07 season, not this season.

Torres also cost us £250k for every 15 goals he scores during his 7 year contract we have already paid an additional £500k and at the rate he is scoring, he is going to cost us quite a bit more!!!

Emiliano Insúa Boca Juniors £1,300,000 26.08.2007

Sebastian Leto Club Atlético Lanús £1,800,000 01.07.2007

As for Maschers package including wages - I thought that mate but I am not so sure now.

i dont think anyone really knows what masherano cost.

the maths says if he was on 50k a week (which is quite low compared to many top class premiership players) his wages over 4 years would amount to £10.4mil... leave a fee of £7.6mil... and I cant quite believe that we'd get him that cheaply, considering MSI could have got a lot more for him from other places
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Postby josip84 » Thu May 01, 2008 9:31 pm

Why don't you admit once and for all that you were expelled from the Champions League by an outstanding striker whose name is Didier Drogba?
Imagine yesterday's game with Drogba wearing the red jersey : LFC fans would already be trying to get tickets to Moscow.
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Postby metalhead » Thu May 01, 2008 9:39 pm

josip84 wrote:Why don't you admit once and for all that you were expelled from the Champions League by an outstanding striker whose name is Didier Drogba?
Imagine yesterday's game with Drogba wearing the red jersey : LFC fans would already be trying to get tickets to Moscow.

we dont need him

we have fernando torres
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Postby god_bless_john_houlding » Thu May 01, 2008 9:42 pm

OK say we're out solely to Drogba...take everyone else away from Chelsea...we'd of won 3-2. Great player that Drogba eh ???
1) You'll Never Walk Alone
2) pass and move is the Liverpool groove
3) FIRST WILL ALWAYS BE FIRST AND SECOND WILL ALWAYS BE NOTHING.
4) If Torres has scored 60 league goals for Liverpool by the start of the 2011/12 season, I'll say he's better than Owen.
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Postby josip84 » Thu May 01, 2008 9:45 pm

metalhead wrote:
josip84 wrote:Why don't you admit once and for all that you were expelled from the Champions League by an outstanding striker whose name is Didier Drogba?
Imagine yesterday's game with Drogba wearing the red jersey : LFC fans would already be trying to get tickets to Moscow.

we dont need him

we have fernando torres

Drogba will play the final.
Torres won't.
That's all.
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Postby god_bless_john_houlding » Thu May 01, 2008 9:47 pm

josip84 wrote:
metalhead wrote:
josip84 wrote:Why don't you admit once and for all that you were expelled from the Champions League by an outstanding striker whose name is Didier Drogba?
Imagine yesterday's game with Drogba wearing the red jersey : LFC fans would already be trying to get tickets to Moscow.

we dont need him

we have fernando torres

Drogba will play the final.
Torres won't.
That's all.

torres has scored over 30 goals this season
drogba hasn't
that's all.

:nod
1) You'll Never Walk Alone
2) pass and move is the Liverpool groove
3) FIRST WILL ALWAYS BE FIRST AND SECOND WILL ALWAYS BE NOTHING.
4) If Torres has scored 60 league goals for Liverpool by the start of the 2011/12 season, I'll say he's better than Owen.
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Postby josip84 » Thu May 01, 2008 10:02 pm

god_bless_john_houlding wrote:
josip84 wrote:
metalhead wrote:
josip84 wrote:Why don't you admit once and for all that you were expelled from the Champions League by an outstanding striker whose name is Didier Drogba?
Imagine yesterday's game with Drogba wearing the red jersey : LFC fans would already be trying to get tickets to Moscow.

we dont need him

we have fernando torres

Drogba will play the final.
Torres won't.
That's all.

torres has scored over 30 goals this season
drogba hasn't
that's all.

:nod

What is requested from a striker is to score decisive goals at important moments of the game.
Drogba does. Constantly.
Does Torres?

It makes a hell of a difference, doesn't it?
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Postby god_bless_john_houlding » Thu May 01, 2008 10:17 pm

josip84 wrote:
god_bless_john_houlding wrote:
josip84 wrote:
metalhead wrote:
josip84 wrote:Why don't you admit once and for all that you were expelled from the Champions League by an outstanding striker whose name is Didier Drogba?
Imagine yesterday's game with Drogba wearing the red jersey : LFC fans would already be trying to get tickets to Moscow.

we dont need him

we have fernando torres

Drogba will play the final.
Torres won't.
That's all.

torres has scored over 30 goals this season
drogba hasn't
that's all.

:nod

What is requested from a striker is to score decisive goals at important moments of the game.
Drogba does. Constantly.
Does Torres?

It makes a hell of a difference, doesn't it?

look you fucking idiot. Torres constantly scores against top sides, at important times, in important games.

So go and cry yourself to sleep because no matter how much money you have, you can't compete with Liverpool Football Club. We let you win yesterday. Do you think the Liverpool players really wanted to go through all that trouble of travelling to Moscow? Not in a million years. They've done that. They've been to two european cup finals, we didn't want to look greedy.

So when you and your precious Didier Drogba have a trophy cabinet bursting at the seams, come back and post on here, until then fuck off and struggle to come to terms that the most successful side England has produced is a side in the north west who play in red...and are called Liverpool Football Club. We're the only English side who've flown the flag in europe 8 times (5 european cups and 3 uefa cups) What have Chelsea got? a poxy cup winners cup?  :laugh:  :laugh: ...on a par with Everton. Spent nearly 300 million in 5 years of Ambrovich and achieved what on the european front which is what the russian twat wants more than anything? Achieved nothing. United will destroy you and Drogba will go back to diving antics.

Poor old chelsea. Will never be able to compete with Liverpool Football Club. So don't bother mate, because you can't compete with us. Torres best forward on the planet...Drogba not even good enough to lace El Nino's boots. So sod off now mate, before I start to slag chelsea, drogba and you off.
1) You'll Never Walk Alone
2) pass and move is the Liverpool groove
3) FIRST WILL ALWAYS BE FIRST AND SECOND WILL ALWAYS BE NOTHING.
4) If Torres has scored 60 league goals for Liverpool by the start of the 2011/12 season, I'll say he's better than Owen.
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Postby SundanceKid » Thu May 01, 2008 11:26 pm

No one realizes that Drogba's goals mean :censored:. Riise's own goal lost it for us, not because it was the valuable away goal, but had it not happened, we'd be going to Moscow.

If Riise cleared the ball correctly:
First leg: 1-0
Second leg [Full time]: 1-1
Aggregate: 2-1 Liverpool.

There would have been no extra time, Chelsea wouldn't have scored the two other goals. I always did love Riise, but I can't help but question him now.
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Postby Reg » Thu May 01, 2008 11:40 pm

Riise's goal was critical because it gave Chelsea hope.  Punto.
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Postby King Carra » Fri May 02, 2008 12:32 am

Reg wrote:TOMKINS: SILVER LININGS ABOUND
Paul Tomkins 01 May 2008 

Everything in life has a silver lining. Even the worst things imaginable, providing they are survived, can make you stronger, or more humble, or more appreciative. 

Liverpool may end the season empty-handed, but have shown the guts and determination to try and rescue lost causes, right from the fourth game of the group stage onwards when the most remarkable escape act was undertaken. And, of course, there's been no little quality too. Goals have been in plentiful supply, and it's been a memorable campaign that was alive until the 120th minute of the semi-final second-leg.
 
In football, you have to take the rough with the smooth. Character is borne from setbacks, whether deserved or not. As with last year, I don't think a potential Champions League Final against Manchester United was what this relatively young team needed right now in terms of its development. I know a lot of fans feel the same, but of course, no Red wanted anything other than a Liverpool win once the semi-final kicked off.
 
It's not that I think United's recent record against Liverpool, and the fact that they're ahead in terms of team development, made them massive favourites; for a game like that it had to be 50-50.
 
After all, Benítez had won the only cup game against United, back in 2006, and Liverpool have a better psychological air in the Champions League. But it would have been too big a game –– the biggest club game Europe has ever seen; I said the same a year ago when the possibility was on the horizon. Liverpool have improved since then, but United are still the older, more experienced and more expensively-assembled side.
 
It would have been 50-50 odds, but like in a game of Russian roulette with three bullets in six chambers –– an especially apt metaphor, given the location of the final. United fans weren't keen on the idea either, but at least they had the league title in the bag as something to fall back on.
 
They could bounce back more easily from losing the final, and as things stand, Liverpool, I feel, can bounce back more easily from losing the semi-final than had defeat occurred in Russia. But it wasn't to be.
 
The law of averages suggested Chelsea had to win a semi-final against Liverpool sooner or later. The first goal is always crucial, and that it was offside in the build-up is irritating but par for the course of rubbish decisions when Liverpool play Chelsea. Even the one decision Chelsea feel they were cheated out of, in 2005, saved them from conceding a penalty and having Cech sent off. (The ref that night seems to be the only person outside of Liverpool fans who acknowledges this.)
 
The two decisions involving Sami Hyypia summed up Liverpool's luck with officials in games against Chelsea –– the Finn gave away a blatant penalty (no arguments there) but won an equally blatant one, too. Or rather, he would have had the referee not bottled it, putting his whistle to his lips but mysteriously changing his mind.
 
At least the officials rightly struck off Essien's goal, with a player jumping up and down in front of Reina as one of four offside players. If these type of offences aren't offside, as with the one at the weekend at Birmingham, then the law is an absolute joke.
 
Liverpool also had the worse luck with injuries, losing defenders in both games. So everything went against the Reds.
 
I have to say that didn't agree with Rafa's tactic of singling out Drogba for criticism, even though I totally agreed with the sentiment over the way such a powerful player can be strong when he wants to be, but when the defenders stand up to him with equal force, as they have to, he crumples like an aneamic anorexic. But Drogba would have been fired up for this one either way.
 
So overall I'm disappointed –– but not disheartened; far from it. I look for the positives, the signs of progress, as a matter of course. There's been plenty this season; alas, other teams are progressing too, and you can't do anything about that. I'm sure Rafa would love to be able to buy players like Anelka for £15m in the middle of the season, just to use them from the bench. But how many managers have such a luxury?
 
This season Liverpool have scored far more goals than in recent years (116 so far), but on the whole not without sacrificing defensive stability. Progress. Six players have got into double figures, and I can't recall the last time that happened. Again, progress. The overall balance of the side is very strong, and as with last summer the right additions can take the team up another level; unlike last summer, the project is that bit nearer completion. But there's still room for improvement in a couple of positions, and in the overall depth of the squad.
 
What Benítez has done is create a side that never says die; this team has come from behind to win key games ever since he arrived –– Olympiacos, Luton, AC Milan, and most recently, Arsenal –– and defensive or one-dimensional teams don't do that. It gave every last ounce of effort at Stamford Bridge, and over the two games Petr Cech had the more meaningful saves to make.
 
Unfortunately, one newspaper piece this morning read: "After four seasons under Benítez Liverpool are no closer to Chelsea, Manchester United and Arsenal in the league than they were in 2004 when Gérard Houllier left Anfield."
 
I respect the author, having known him a few years ago, but this is utter tripe, as was the suggestion that Benítez is still living off Istanbul. The gap was 30 points in 2004, and 21 points last season. Currently it's down to 11 points. How is that being 'no closer' to the other three big clubs? I'm no mathematician, but even I can spot a closing gap. Over the past three seasons, Liverpool have accrued more league points than Arsenal, lest we forget.
 
Meanwhile, the gap to fifth has been extended, with three good away results recently secured with a 'squad' team. Again, more signs of progress.
 
As a result, Liverpool are comfortably established within the top four, something that wasn't the case four/five years ago. But the challenge to win the title remains an immense one, given that the other three teams are also especially strong, particularly the top two with their far greater riches.
 
The Reds didn't lose to either Chelsea or Arsenal in the league, or to either London side over 90 minutes in four Champions League games (defeat to Chelsea came in extra-time, and in the League Cup which is now a virtual reserves competition). That's eight meaningful games of parity between Liverpool and two clubs who were miles ahead when Benítez arrived. Manchester United still have the upper hand in head-to-heads, but a bit more luck for Liverpool at Anfield and that will deservedly change.
 
I've mentioned the success of the Reds' youth and reserve teams a few times lately, but that's all part of the overall improvement; it took both Ferguson and Wenger years to get their systems right before players started filtering through to the first team, so Benítez and his staff have done an excellent job in this respect. I'd expect journalists to pay some kind of attention to all the work a manager does, particularly laying foundations.
 
Six of this season's signings –– Torres, Babel, Benayoun, Skrtel, Lucas, and the now permanently-signed Mascherano –– have all added new dimensions, with each looking a very astute buy; the average age of that sextet is just 23. Voronin and Leto haven't quite worked out as yet, for a number of reasons including injury, but neither is a bad player. Also, a number of teenagers have featured in the first team in the league this season.
 
And all this during another European season that was very, very good, and fell just a fraction short of being excellent. But it's more experience to bank, more victories against top sides on the way to almost making a third final in four seasons.
 
Regardless of who wins this year's final, no team in Europe has a better Champions League record than the Liverpool manager in Benítez's four years –– the Reds are joint-best with AC Milan, who have also won one of two finals, reached one further semi-final, and fallen at the last-16 stage since Benítez took charge.
 
If that's not progress for a club ailing in the UEFA Cup in 2003/04, I am utterly at a loss to suggest what is.

This interview speaks so much sense. It really does pain me to say it but in a way I think it's a good thing that we didn't get through. Playing Man Utd at Moscow would been an extremely tough game and yeah, if we won it'd been amazing, but i'm not sure whether we'd have been able to, and if we didn't it would have hit the players so badly mentally, and most of all it'd have given the Mancs a huge one over on us.

I don't care who wins the final, I just want the lesser of the two evils to win. Hopefully Chelsea so Abramovic can :censored: off once and for all. The way I look at it though, is one club certainy won't be smiling come the end of the game.  :D
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Postby cpc4eva » Fri May 02, 2008 1:42 am

Big Niall wrote:Gave it their all and can hold their heads up. Chelsea are the better team though and I hope they win league and CL to shut Fergie up (although I think there is something sinister about their supporters like Millwall,Leeds and Rangers).

I would sell (or not give new contracts to) Kuyt,Pennant,Kewell,Risse,Banayoun,Arbeloa,legend Hypia,Voronin,Crouch(Rafa doesn't like him),Alonso (what happened him over last two years?),Finnan(getting old),

Reina,Agger,Skrtel,SG,Masch,Torres and maybe babel are good enough to win league medals - get four other players and that is a top team.

yeah ?

which 4 u suggest ?
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Postby maguskwt » Fri May 02, 2008 1:58 am

Owzat wrote:
s@int wrote:The point I was trying to make was this season Rafa has spent £70million and we are no closer to winning the league than last season (in real terms) even when Torres has proven to be everything we could wish for, Mascherano has looked as good as we all knew he was and Babel and Skrtel have done well.

Unless we have a bottomless purse (dic) going off this season even if we spend another £70million we arn't going to close the gap, not unless we have a radical rethink about the way we play and use our best players, and realise that effort doesn't make up for a lack of ability.

If you summarise the four seasons under Rafa :-

League : 5th, 3rd, 3rd, 4th.
Average : 3rd/4th, if you discount first season then 3rd
Title challenges : zero

Champions League : Won, L16, Runners-Up, SFs
Summarised : we win it one in four, we reach the final every other year

Domestic Cups : Won FA Cup once, Runners-Up in Carling Cup once.
Summarised : much the same as Champions League, win one every four years and reach the final every other year.



So if we take that as Rafa's average, in four seasons he has finished highest third in the league and way behind the winners, wins the Champions League and a domestic cup every four years. Bar the fact that he won the biggest cup of them all, his record is not that different to Houllier. The points and stakes may be higher, but he's still no closer. Houllier can at least boast an away win against Chelsea, 2nd in the league and some good wins over the mancs not enduring regular defeats.

I checked the poll yesterday, only 1 in 8 people on here prefers the Champions League to Premiership, yet we're happy to win the Champions League and not be close to winning the Premiership by sticking by Rafa. I can't say he definitely won't win the league without sticking my neck out, but where is there any shred of evidence to suggest we will? The presence of a handful of top quality players and some kids who might or might not be in the Wenger-raised mould. We now play out the season and can't even push for 3rd anymore.

Good enough?

:sleep  :sleep  :sleep
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Postby SundanceKid » Fri May 02, 2008 4:30 am

Reg wrote:Riise's goal was critical because it gave Chelsea hope.  Punto.

Nah. It was critical because it gave them a second chance at extra time. We were even more unfortunate that they took advantage of it.
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Postby josip84 » Fri May 02, 2008 6:41 am

god_bless_john_houlding wrote:
josip84 wrote:
god_bless_john_houlding wrote:
josip84 wrote:
metalhead wrote:
josip84 wrote:Why don't you admit once and for all that you were expelled from the Champions League by an outstanding striker whose name is Didier Drogba?
Imagine yesterday's game with Drogba wearing the red jersey : LFC fans would already be trying to get tickets to Moscow.

we dont need him

we have fernando torres

Drogba will play the final.
Torres won't.
That's all.

torres has scored over 30 goals this season
drogba hasn't
that's all.

:nod

What is requested from a striker is to score decisive goals at important moments of the game.
Drogba does. Constantly.
Does Torres?

It makes a hell of a difference, doesn't it?

(...)you can't compete with us. Torres best forward on the planet...Drogba not even good enough to lace El Nino's boots. (...)

I had always thought Liverpool fans truly loved the game of football and could speak knowledgeably about it.
Reading GBJH's post, I now realise some of them (to say the least) are just a bunch of arrogant ignorants blinded by their childish jingoism.
Even though I can understand some foolish words can be uttered out of frustration, I will never be able to understand how someone can reach such a level of stupidity as to claim "Torres is the best forward of the planet" on the very day Torres is outplayed by Drogba...

How old are you, God Bless John Houlding?
Does your mum know you're here?


:laugh:
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