Liverpool FC Forum

by **Toffeehater** » Fri Oct 23, 2009 4:33 am

Luca toni , great goal scoring record in germnay but no thank you , we had the problem with crouch and with him we will just play hoof ball again. S.Appiah is a good player but real question marks over his fitness concerns , there is a reason why no club is willing to take him , his injury problems are as bad as rosicky or owen maybe even worse.

We do need a backup striker and thats the first issue to address , i'd look to get in RVN , cracking player even at this age , still knows where the back of the net is and he can be our gary mac for 2 to 3 season , will cost around 2 million at most.

Backup Centre Back , With carragher on the decline , i'd look to get stephen taylor in , 5 million or so was the rumored price which he was to be sold for in the summer. Very versatile can play as a right back and centre back , very powerful in the air and would improce our options plus we will have cover for right back as well.

Aurelio entering the final year of his contract and rafa not convinced he can stay fit to give him a new contract , we should be looking towards gareth bale , harry doesn't fancy him and he's a young player , good at taking freekicks and he loves to attack , his confidence is shot and i think he needs a change of environment to get back to the player he once was , 5 million tops?

by **Owzat** » Fri Oct 23, 2009 7:36 am

dawson99 wrote:we're all just angry. of course we want Rafa to stay, but... he crazy. he is doing some bizarre stuff.

I don't care if Rafa stays or go, the club is bigger than the manager and all I want is a manager who can win the league. That is something Rafa hasn't delivered in getting on six seasons, not looking any more likely and if he can't do it with the budget on offer then get someone in who can/might. What worries me most is stagnation, a lot of transfer activity and not a lot of progress. His tactics are clearly open to criticism, he doesn't look willing or capable to change those so he clearly thinks he's never wrong - it's not the tactics it's the players (well who signed them Rafa....................) Buck stops at the manager, perhaps part of the problem is money is too convenient an excuse for fans because others have it. Does each member on here blame their employers because they get paid less than lawyers, MPs, footballers etc? Of course not, you signed up to the job at the salary advertised and accept that increases are never going to be massive. So why the expectation that new owners should match other owners' transfer budgets? If in fact they don't, because quite often we are up there with the biggest spenders, but they didn't waste £20.3m on Keane, £7m on Dossena, etc etc etc

Praying a sugar daddy owner will come in and Rafa get it right is just wishful thinking, the more Rafa co cks up the more likely new owners will bring a new manager in with them. I'm guessing they'd not be too knowledgable on football so go for the likes of Hiddink or Mourinho, big names.

As for one of the early 'witty' remarks about buying four quality players for £12m, well noone has ever said they expect that. If he's only got £12m then spend it wisely, don't waste all £12m on a left-back........................... Point being Rafa tries to spend big, ends up paying over the odds and having nothing left to strengthen the squad. You can't tell me there aren't any bargains out there, the problem is Rafa has lost any ability he had to find them. Too wrapped up in chasing targets that would cost at least 50% more than we should pay and can afford. Rafa doesn't spend to his budget wisely, instead he splashes cash like he has no limits and we end up with a good but not world class player but at a world class price. Was right-back a massive priority that could make or break our title prospects? No. Yet Rafa saw Johnson as so good and so vital he spent near half his budget on that ONE player.

by **Owzat** » Fri Oct 23, 2009 7:45 am

stmichael wrote:
aCe' wrote:id start off by selling a couple of players... i still think we have somewhere around 10mill to spend without having to sell anyone... Sell Dossena and Voronin and Skrtel (if anyone in their right mind would buy him)

easier said than done. with the three you've listed there, the question is would anyone in their right minds sign any of them? voronin has been in the shop window for more than a year and hertha didn't fancy him. skrtel i do quite like although he's never been the same player since he got that serious injury. dossena, although he's been dire for us, is actually quite highly rated in italy so can see that happening. babel i can only see going on loan if anything.

Delusional some might say, if selling Voronin and Dossena were that easy then they wouldn't still be here. Like with Pennant, we might put prices on them and expect £2m-£4m on any or all of the players we might sell, but they might not fancy going to any of the clubs that can afford them. With a step down in club is likely to come a step down in wages, so why would they leave if they don't have to when they can sit out their contracts and have a signing on fee and go for a free when their contract expires?

Shout for Rosicky isn't a bad one other than his injury record. 37 apps in 06/07, 31 in the two and a bit seasons since including zilch in 08/09 (source : wiki)

Problem we have is Rafa's known for paying over the odds so British clubs will not give us much of a bargain. Known quality comes at a price, we need another relative unknown or perhaps to shop in the Dutch leagues, France and Spain. We pay £17.5m for Johnson, Real Madrid get Arbeloa for £3.5m. I like the line on Arbeloa on wiki, saying Madrid paid the same as we did in 2007 (€4m) with no regard for the exchange rates at the time as if it means he cost exactly the same as he did years earlier.

by **The_Rock** » Fri Oct 23, 2009 7:56 am

Going for proven players :
1)From newcastle - i reckon 12 million can get both these players :
a)Steven Taylor - Can play CB and RB....heck he could even a job at LB too (Bentiez type of player)..

b)Kevin Nolan - A goalscoring central midfielder.........We don't have one at the moment (Apart from gerrard who plays is a support striker now)

3)José Andrés Guardado Hernández - I am just not happy with all the wingers we currently have. Knowing that Benitez will never....ever.....get rid of Kuyt...the most i can hope for is a left winger who is fast...can dribble ...can put in a more than decent cross. To summarise, he is better than all our wingers put together. Deportivo bought him for 7 million euro in 2007. I reckon we can do a player exchange deal with deportivo for babel and guardado.... Think babel is still living on his youth world cup (or is the youth european cup) performance. So lets hope deportivo rates babel based on that performance.

4)RVN - He loves playing upfront on his own....he will be an able deputy for Torres. I guess he isn't in good terms with f@ck face fergie...so how more to irritate him than joining us.

RVN might cost 2 to 3 million....so we gotta offload Dossena or voronin in the jan window to buy him.

by **banana** » Fri Oct 23, 2009 8:13 am

Owzat wrote:
dawson99 wrote:we're all just angry. of course we want Rafa to stay, but... he crazy. he is doing some bizarre stuff.

I don't care if Rafa stays or go, the club is bigger than the manager and all I want is a manager who can win the league. That is something Rafa hasn't delivered in getting on six seasons, not looking any more likely and if he can't do it with the budget on offer then get someone in who can/might. What worries me most is stagnation, a lot of transfer activity and not a lot of progress. His tactics are clearly open to criticism, he doesn't look willing or capable to change those so he clearly thinks he's never wrong - it's not the tactics it's the players (well who signed them Rafa....................) Buck stops at the manager, perhaps part of the problem is money is too convenient an excuse for fans because others have it. Does each member on here blame their employers because they get paid less than lawyers, MPs, footballers etc? Of course not, you signed up to the job at the salary advertised and accept that increases are never going to be massive. So why the expectation that new owners should match other owners' transfer budgets? If in fact they don't, because quite often we are up there with the biggest spenders, but they didn't waste £20.3m on Keane, £7m on Dossena, etc etc etc

Praying a sugar daddy owner will come in and Rafa get it right is just wishful thinking, the more Rafa co cks up the more likely new owners will bring a new manager in with them. I'm guessing they'd not be too knowledgable on football so go for the likes of Hiddink or Mourinho, big names.

As for one of the early 'witty' remarks about buying four quality players for £12m, well noone has ever said they expect that. If he's only got £12m then spend it wisely, don't waste all £12m on a left-back........................... Point being Rafa tries to spend big, ends up paying over the odds and having nothing left to strengthen the squad. You can't tell me there aren't any bargains out there, the problem is Rafa has lost any ability he had to find them. Too wrapped up in chasing targets that would cost at least 50% more than we should pay and can afford. Rafa doesn't spend to his budget wisely, instead he splashes cash like he has no limits and we end up with a good but not world class player but at a world class price. Was right-back a massive priority that could make or break our title prospects? No. Yet Rafa saw Johnson as so good and so vital he spent near half his budget on that ONE player.

My god. You have some nerve.

We had the best team in the world over the last two seasons. You know it. We did not win the league because we were unlucky and because we relied to much on Torres who was injured a fair bit. But at the day, with our best 11 we could crush Man U on Old Trafford and end Chelseas 80 games or so winning streak.

This is unbelievable. You are willing to throw that away?

It is easy to come here and critizise and to say what you say. But you are wrong. Being wrong is not a problem, but you should be a bit more humble and willing to learn from past mistakes. You were also desperate to sell Alonso and bring in more "quality in the middle" I quote;

One of our best ten players, doesn't necessarily make him irreplacable and money can always be handy. We can cope without him, we did earlier in the season and now we have Mascherano it makes Alonso less pivotal.

Point? People use expressions like "one of the best" or "world class" etc without much meaning. I'm "one of the best" posters on this forum, could mean anything. I might be in the top ten, top 100, top 1000 or kidding myself (I don't care, it's just an example) When you think about a comment using that phrase you normally find it is too ambiguous or rubbish, I reckon there are at least half a dozen more important players and in a squad of 24 then outside or just outside the top 25% isn't exactly massive. Top three players or top 10% would be impressive, but Torres and Gerrard hold the top two slots and I doubt Alonso would come in third in many people's voting

End quote.

So what have you learned from this I may ask? Have you asked yourself the obvious question?

by **bigmick** » Fri Oct 23, 2009 8:16 am

You keep bringing that up as a killer quote, clearly designed to make Owzat look like a numpty. The in the same post you once again say we have been the best team in the World over the last two seasons. Two seasons ago we finished fourth in the League.

Have you been taking halluciagenic drugs or something

If you have, then I suggest you take some more and forget about posting for a while, just enjoy yourself.

by **The_Rock** » Fri Oct 23, 2009 8:35 am

banana wrote:We had the best team in the world over the last two seasons. You know it. We did not win the league because we were unlucky and because we relied to much on Torres who was injured a fair bit. But at the day, with our best 11 we could crush Man U on Old Trafford and end Chelseas 80 games or so winning streak.

Best team in the world ? :wwww

We didn't win the EPL (BPL).... We haven't won the champions league in 4 years (you can effectively say 5 years now)... So how the ....

Not even the most happy clappy hippy in this forum would say that.......

You sure you ain't smoking crack ?

by **banana** » Fri Oct 23, 2009 8:41 am

bigmick wrote:You keep bringing that up as a killer quote, clearly designed to make Owzat look like a numpty. The in the same post you once again say we have been the best team in the World over the last two seasons. Two seasons ago we finished fourth in the League.

Have you been taking halluciagenic drugs or something If you have, then I suggest you take some more and forget about posting for a while, just enjoy yourself.

Yes I believe we were the number one team when you compared first 11 againts first 11. We dominated all teams in terms of possession and shots at target.

We were unlucky to be beaten by Chelsea in the CL last year, I put that down to a shocking referee letting Drogba get away with all sorts of cheating and diving. We loast that game on the free kicks Drogba won. I think he won 9 free kicks around the box. We won 1 againt him. They fouled Lucas before one of their goals.

In the league we drew too many of our games. Even though we dominated thjem massively. A part of that I put on our old fashioned stadium which is a lot easier to defend than Old T (short narrow field).

And I do think it is right to look at his track record when posting. If he was so wrong back then. He is even more wrong right now. Making this mistake will make us pay the ultimate penalty. I am not willing to let that happen.

by **bunglemark2** » Fri Oct 23, 2009 8:56 am

banana wrote:
bigmick wrote:You keep bringing that up as a killer quote, clearly designed to make Owzat look like a numpty. The in the same post you once again say we have been the best team in the World over the last two seasons. Two seasons ago we finished fourth in the League.

Have you been taking halluciagenic drugs or something If you have, then I suggest you take some more and forget about posting for a while, just enjoy yourself.

Yes I believe we were the number one team when you compared first 11 againts first 11. We dominated all teams in terms of possession and shots at target.

We were unlucky to be beaten by Chelsea in the CL last year, I put that down to a shocking referee letting Drogba get away with all sorts of cheating and diving. We loast that game on the free kicks Drogba won. I think he won 9 free kicks around the box. We won 1 againt him. They fouled Lucas before one of their goals.

In the league we drew too many of our games. Even though we dominated thjem massively. A part of that I put on our old fashioned stadium which is a lot easier to defend than Old T (short narrow field).

And I do think it is right to look at his track record when posting. If he was so wrong back then. He is even more wrong right now. Making this mistake will make us pay the ultimate penalty. I am not willing to let that happen.

Another nutjob on the forum ! :wwww

by **The_Rock** » Fri Oct 23, 2009 9:24 am

banana wrote:
bigmick wrote:You keep bringing that up as a killer quote, clearly designed to make Owzat look like a numpty. The in the same post you once again say we have been the best team in the World over the last two seasons. Two seasons ago we finished fourth in the League.

Have you been taking halluciagenic drugs or something If you have, then I suggest you take some more and forget about posting for a while, just enjoy yourself.

Yes I believe we were the number one team when you compared first 11 againts first 11. We dominated all teams in terms of possession and shots at target.

We were unlucky to be beaten by Chelsea in the CL last year, I put that down to a shocking referee letting Drogba get away with all sorts of cheating and diving. We loast that game on the free kicks Drogba won. I think he won 9 free kicks around the box. We won 1 againt him. They fouled Lucas before one of their goals.

In the league we drew too many of our games. Even though we dominated thjem massively. A part of that I put on our old fashioned stadium which is a lot easier to defend than Old T (short narrow field).

And I do think it is right to look at his track record when posting. If he was so wrong back then. He is even more wrong right now. Making this mistake will make us pay the ultimate penalty. I am not willing to let that happen.

Classic example of forgetting how lucky we were at the beginning of last season what with all the red cards and all. If the ref was not as lenient we would have dropped $hitload of points during that period..... Frankly no analyst in the world will call a team which has Skertel as one of the CB, Auerlio/Dossena as the leftback....Dirk Kuyt as a RW as best team in the world. If you said we had the best central midfield pairing.....or the best forward combination...people will agree. But best overall team ?

Seriously....the last team I can safely proclaim "the best team in the world" was when we won the treble in 2001. If Houllier hadn't screwed that team up....our 18 would look more like 23 or 24 by now.

by **babu** » Fri Oct 23, 2009 9:30 am

bloody hell, maybe banana has taken it too far, but we were one of the better sides in the world last year.

Far from nutjob.

by **CTID** » Fri Oct 23, 2009 9:47 am

Miroslav Klose. Imagine his strength and arieal ability alongside Torres. But then what? You still need another striker at least.

by **europian-kings** » Fri Oct 23, 2009 9:52 am

Apparently Barca are preparing another bid for javier mascherano.
Messi, Imbrahimovic and iniesta are said to be part of the deal.

cough.

If only.....

by **heimdall** » Fri Oct 23, 2009 10:26 am

banana wrote:
bigmick wrote:You keep bringing that up as a killer quote, clearly designed to make Owzat look like a numpty. The in the same post you once again say we have been the best team in the World over the last two seasons. Two seasons ago we finished fourth in the League.

Have you been taking halluciagenic drugs or something If you have, then I suggest you take some more and forget about posting for a while, just enjoy yourself.

Yes I believe we were the number one team when you compared first 11 againts first 11. We dominated all teams in terms of possession and shots at target.

We were unlucky to be beaten by Chelsea in the CL last year, I put that down to a shocking referee letting Drogba get away with all sorts of cheating and diving. We loast that game on the free kicks Drogba won. I think he won 9 free kicks around the box. We won 1 againt him. They fouled Lucas before one of their goals.

In the league we drew too many of our games. Even though we dominated thjem massively. A part of that I put on our old fashioned stadium which is a lot easier to defend than Old T (short narrow field).

And I do think it is right to look at his track record when posting. If he was so wrong back then. He is even more wrong right now. Making this mistake will make us pay the ultimate penalty. I am not willing to let that happen.

Take the red pill Neo

by **maypaxvobiscum** » Fri Oct 23, 2009 10:36 am

banana wrote:
Owzat wrote:
dawson99 wrote:we're all just angry. of course we want Rafa to stay, but... he crazy. he is doing some bizarre stuff.

I don't care if Rafa stays or go, the club is bigger than the manager and all I want is a manager who can win the league. That is something Rafa hasn't delivered in getting on six seasons, not looking any more likely and if he can't do it with the budget on offer then get someone in who can/might. What worries me most is stagnation, a lot of transfer activity and not a lot of progress. His tactics are clearly open to criticism, he doesn't look willing or capable to change those so he clearly thinks he's never wrong - it's not the tactics it's the players (well who signed them Rafa....................) Buck stops at the manager, perhaps part of the problem is money is too convenient an excuse for fans because others have it. Does each member on here blame their employers because they get paid less than lawyers, MPs, footballers etc? Of course not, you signed up to the job at the salary advertised and accept that increases are never going to be massive. So why the expectation that new owners should match other owners' transfer budgets? If in fact they don't, because quite often we are up there with the biggest spenders, but they didn't waste £20.3m on Keane, £7m on Dossena, etc etc etc

Praying a sugar daddy owner will come in and Rafa get it right is just wishful thinking, the more Rafa co cks up the more likely new owners will bring a new manager in with them. I'm guessing they'd not be too knowledgable on football so go for the likes of Hiddink or Mourinho, big names.

As for one of the early 'witty' remarks about buying four quality players for £12m, well noone has ever said they expect that. If he's only got £12m then spend it wisely, don't waste all £12m on a left-back........................... Point being Rafa tries to spend big, ends up paying over the odds and having nothing left to strengthen the squad. You can't tell me there aren't any bargains out there, the problem is Rafa has lost any ability he had to find them. Too wrapped up in chasing targets that would cost at least 50% more than we should pay and can afford. Rafa doesn't spend to his budget wisely, instead he splashes cash like he has no limits and we end up with a good but not world class player but at a world class price. Was right-back a massive priority that could make or break our title prospects? No. Yet Rafa saw Johnson as so good and so vital he spent near half his budget on that ONE player.

We had the best team in the world over the last two seasons. You know it.

Banana...proudly presented to you today by the letters W, T and F.

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